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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
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nubechecorre 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 29-Mar-2021 18:57:32
#61 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Nov-2003
Posts: 895
From: San remo -Italy-

after the update my usb is unstable (sam440ep). I did a fresh install and I didn't install the enancher software.. I don't know what to say..

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mbrantley 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 29-Mar-2021 22:57:48
#62 ]
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Joined: 10-Jun-2010
Posts: 547
From: Mobile, Alabama, United States

@nubechecorre

I haven't run across anybody but me complaining of USB problems until you, but after Update 2 on my X1000 my USB stack would constantly crash/hang. Symptom was that all with the computer would appear to still be running, but my keyboard and mouse would lock up. First press of capslock key would turn on the light and then it would stay on. Nothing to do but reboot. It's a time like these I wished for a PS/2 port on my machine.

My solution was to find all the drivers related to USB and roll them back to Update 1 versions, and then the problems went away.

Now, if I was not so lazy I might have then started putting the new ones back one by one until I found the offender. But I am lazy and have been running with these Update 1 USB drivers since then. This is why I quit the OS4 beta testing team -- too dang lazy!

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Gregor 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 30-Mar-2021 7:16:07
#63 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2011
Posts: 200
From: Unknown

@mbrantley

I also have problems with USB in my X5000... They existed alreaady in Update 1 but hard to say if there is much change. Some partitions on USB disks are not mounted automatically if the unit is connected to USB port when booting or rebooting (soft or hard). Some of these partitions are FAT32, some SFS (which ARE set to automount with Media Toolbox!).

Often only way to get a certain partition to appear is to use 'Mounter'; repeated reboots do not help. I have not experienced the same with Linux, this is purely an AmigaOS problem.

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Hypex 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 24-Aug-2021 4:29:03
#64 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 10308
From: Greensborough, Australia

@mbrantley

I am getting the same issues with my keyboard. Since Update 2 (and also beta modules) it boots up and kills my keyboard. I thought it was because I was using an esoteric Apple keyboard. But I sense not! The same kind of issue is reported with KVM switches.

Usually I like to run the latest USB modules as USB has been one of the most faulty components in OS4. But I am sick of typing, finding nothing on screen because it's dead, then need to locate the connection under the desk so I can pull it out and plug it back in!

My keyboard has a hub with a mouse connected to it. So the hub still working but it has killed the keyboard device inside it. That takes talent.

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amigang 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 24-Aug-2021 7:52:59
#65 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jan-2005
Posts: 1680
From: Cheshire, England

@Hypex

Just recently been getting a few hard crashes on my setup no idea why yet as after my second hard crash I just thought sod this and went on my emulated setup on my pc. I just didn’t want to spend the afternoon finding yet a another little issue in os4.

I have to say after being a user of os4 / x1000 for a while now the bugs and crash are a annoying part of life in that world, it has even made me consider selling it, only more due to lack of time, time I just want to relax and play around with Amiga stuff not do technical / diagnostics fix’s.

Don’t get me wrong, I’ve had stable builds and good times on os4, but it feel now with every update or new program I recently try I’m playing Russian roulette with my setup.

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Hypex 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 24-Aug-2021 11:06:01
#66 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 10308
From: Greensborough, Australia

Update!

So I've spent some time testing my system the last week. Because I got sick of a broken system where I could only boot a patchy Kickstart. With a mix of components. Running Update 1.5.

I had a hunch it was graphic related as there were no crashes in logs. Just strange behaviour like AmiIpdate killing AmiDock and then other elements like buttons and menus stopped responding. As well as compositing killing the whole system to a stand still.

I had replaced battery, RAM, SATA cables but my graphic card was the final frontier! In the days of Update 1, before the time of Update 2 had arrived, I had purchased a NOS R7 250. And then purchased Enhancer for the Radeon drivers. It was working fine until the day I installed Update 2. And yes, I ran FixFonts, after forgetting to run it, just in case that broke it.

So I got out the old 5450 and slotted it back in! At this stage I kept the R7 in the top spot and found a spot below it. I had to rearrange some stuff as I needed the PCIE x16 thingy. I found it didn't work well with two graphic cards and then looked up why. A yellow cursor on the 5450 and the R7 had corrupted colours, in CFE. OS4 would not boot as it stood with the 5450 and only with the R7, unless driver mods were added. So then I played around with Linux to see if I could get 3d working on the 5450. But I couldn't even get a display. After getting all tuckered out I decided to get serious and pull the R7 out.

So I pulled the R7 out and left the 5450 where it was below. Then turned on to test Update 2. It loads, it boots, it works fine!

I do all sorts of tests. This is my usual procedure.

1. Run AmiUpdate from Workbench menu which usually kills AmiDock.
2. While an open Workbench window will still respond for a while, AmiUpdate will cause other GUI elements like buttons and menus to stop responding.
3. If I manage to load GUI Prefs by this stage, enable compositing, then watch the screen reload into a white Workbench and totally freeze up for the winter!

The 5450 passes all the tests. This would place the blame with the R7 with some kind of conflict or glitch. But the strange thing it doesn't always show up. Sometimes I boot once in a while and the system works fine! It's as if Update 1 sets the graphics correctly but if I run Update 2 it messes them up. There is just no consistent behaviour and it makes it very hard to track.

So last night I tried revering Intuition, Graphics and PCIGraphic modules. The system behaves. Then I activated them all to Update 2. Then it boots! What the hell? Then tonight I let it boot as usual into my main volume with Update 2. And it freezes!

I'm always giving up. In fact, I just about will. I can't keep testing this and that to see if I crack it. Gotta use it as a computer for once and do something with it. So I'll keep using my hybrid Update 1.5 setup until anything changes. Sometimes some things in life remain a mystery. And are never solved. I think this will be one of those times. One of those times you need to get over things and just move on...

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 24-Aug-2021 15:07:00
#67 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11917
From: Norway

@Hypex

If you use CFCARD for you LNUX kernels try removing it, and see if that helps.. it helped me, my system froze every 2en boot or something like that, before fixing that, anyway if messing stuff from GITHUB, crashes are expected, just saying..

Anyway I find my RS232 null modem cable really useful as debugging console, and as way to access my computer when intuition or keyboard has frozen.

I try run as little of enhancement stuff as possible, no XDock, no screen savers, no candy, nothing like that. I do not have latest graphic drivers, as they are for RX cards, and I have HD cards, so make no difference to me.

I have also recently replaced backup battery due to no memory found issue in CFE,
My system is now pretty OK with update 2

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 24-Aug-2021 at 03:16 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 24-Aug-2021 at 03:12 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 24-Aug-2021 at 03:10 PM.

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Hypex 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 25-Aug-2021 1:07:36
#68 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 10308
From: Greensborough, Australia

@amigang

A hard crash is unusual. And I'm seeing more of them. Expected on the XE with random freezes but the X1000 used to be solid as a rock.

In fact, as I was diagnosing my Update 2 conflict, I was typing away in a shell window when suddenly the keys stopped working then a few moments later it freezes. I thought OS4 had killed the keyboard like happens a lot. But not, couldn't get the keys back, and the mouse was also frozen.

It's annoying when the OS has obvious bugs. It just seems things aren't tested enough after a change. Or one small thing changes that has a butterfly effect. In a big ecosystem like OS4 a change in one component could damage another. And I've seen evidence in the past of OS modules not checking versions and just flying through. Though that was a set up where Kickstart and Workbench were from different versions totally somehow.

And OS4 apps being buggy just adds to it. That's not the fault of the OS when an app is bad. But it makes the user experience suffer.

Recently I've been having hardware troubles. Such as crashing on boot, random drive errors appear and other related issues. I thought it was ram as re-slotting the ram seemed to fix it. But then it came back. In the process I replaced battery, ram and now sata cables. I think I finally got it. Unfortunately CFE isn't a very stable firmware and crashes at the drop of a hat. UBoot was rock solid on my XE.

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Hypex 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 25-Aug-2021 1:19:39
#69 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 10308
From: Greensborough, Australia

@NutsAboutAmiga

I actually don't use a CF card. Never have. I used to use USB for Linux kernels. Then found compressed kernels (which is the norm elsewhere) can load off HDD from a FFS volume.

But now I use the X1Boot Manager!

https://forum.hyperion-entertainment.com/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=4672

I've got a null modem cable permanently attached and plug in my "terminal" when I need too. But in my case of Update 2 freezing or otherwise behaving badly there is no crash on serial. Only normal operations listed.

I have the Enhancer stuff installed but only to try out. The only thing I have activated is the classic Blanker. But I do have the latest drivers. Well latest for RadeonHD which I need.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 25-Aug-2021 5:26:18
#70 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11917
From: Norway

@Hypex

Maybe the new ExecSG kernel is running hotter, I have a water cooled system, so I should not ever be a problem with that.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 25-Aug-2021 at 02:48 PM.

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amigang 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 25-Aug-2021 7:49:02
#71 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jan-2005
Posts: 1680
From: Cheshire, England

@Hypex

Yes hard crash is a bit more worrying, I feel my system had this bug for the last 2 years of use really on and off. Which is odd, I thought it might of been a temp issue as about a year ago, I replace the cpu fan and cooler and gave it a though clean that seem to fix the issue, but now it’s returned with these random hard crashes.

It might be as simple as dust / clean it needs again, as I haven’t done clean inside since then.

Plus I agree with that fact it’s not always the os4 fault, third party apps can also crash the system. maybe it because finally Windows is pretty dam stable now and I haven’t had a tech problem with my Pc for a very good run, I feel it more when Amiga gives it me.

Last edited by amigang on 25-Aug-2021 at 07:56 AM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 25-Aug-2021 14:50:31
#72 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11917
From: Norway

@Hypex

Quote:
But now I use the X1Boot Manager!


yes that can be a problem

You should send bug report to person who wrote it

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Chris_Y 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 25-Aug-2021 19:13:23
#73 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jun-2003
Posts: 3176
From: Beds, UK

My USB hasn't worked properly since FE. I have an old OS4.1 Update 6 boot partition in case I need to plug any USB MSD in. In OS4.1FE Update 2 (and earlier) the keyboard constantly doesn't work until I unplug i and plug it back in again. MSDs don't work at all. SAM440EP.

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Hypex 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 26-Aug-2021 6:59:24
#74 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 10308
From: Greensborough, Australia

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:
Maybe the new ExecSG kernel is running hotter, I have a water cooled system, so I should not ever be a problem with that.


That's a rather advanced setup.

Quote:

yes that can be a problem

You should send bug report to person who wrote it




I did! The problems are fixed. Now it works as expected.

Unfortunately Update 2 remains broken. I suspect if I could load from X1Boot Update 2 would still be broken. X1Boot runs solo as an OpenFirmware binary so doesn't have Update 2 issues.

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drHirudo 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 27-Aug-2021 3:03:20
#75 ]
Super Member
Joined: 26-Apr-2004
Posts: 1106
From: Sofia

Little late, but I've finally installed the FE update 2 yesterday. So far no issues. I am posting this from my updated machine with he use of IBrowse 2.5.5 (Downladed with AmiUpdate as well). The only slowdown with the update was the need to manually edit the Kicklayout file. Video of the process:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=-MInvEUZ0Qc

Last edited by drHirudo on 27-Aug-2021 at 03:06 AM.

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Hypex 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 27-Aug-2021 13:00:15
#76 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 10308
From: Greensborough, Australia

@Chris_Y

That is very common on a 440. A friend has one and he needed to hot plug the keyboard a lot. He also had one of the "official" AmigaOne keyboards and mouse. Very annoying. How do the developers put up with it?

I've also noticed that the Update 2 USB stack kills my keyboard. Now I have the 440 keyboard problem! Think I'll revert the USB drivers slightly back. Since I already need to revert Kickstart modules to use my system might as well add some more to the list.

But don't let kas1e know. He might accuse of you of having USB problems because of leaving an old Update 6 system around. Sounds hacky

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Hypex 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 27-Aug-2021 13:24:05
#77 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 10308
From: Greensborough, Australia

@drHirudo

Was that with a HDMI grabber? Looks clear. A few notes on the process. Your download looked too fast for an AmiUpdate. It asked for system twice, this is unnecessary. It would have helped if it pasted the line you need to copy into the clipboard. But really it shouldn't expect the user to edit a system file, it should be automated. Either simply replacing it, which earlier updater did, or reading the current and merging it to a new one. I didn't see you reboot. It seemed unusual to run AmiUpdate by hand, you went right past the menu option! Finally, I didn't see you run FixFonts. Did you forget about it like I do? Yes should be automated and all that.

Last edited by Hypex on 27-Aug-2021 at 01:26 PM.

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drHirudo 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 27-Aug-2021 13:51:49
#78 ]
Super Member
Joined: 26-Apr-2004
Posts: 1106
From: Sofia

@Hypex

Yes, it is a HDMI Framegrabber - Blackmagic Decklink 4K Extreme 12G. I bought it especially to record the Amiga and so far it works almost fine for Amiga 500,600,1000, 1200, microAmiga One and X1000. Of course I love the X1000 most and it is my most upgraded machine.

In the video the Amiga resolution is 720p, upscaled to 1080p. I can grab better quality at 1080p (up to 4K), but I decided to go for the lower 1280x720 instead of 1920x1080, because most of the Amiga applications open small windows on higher resolutions.

My AmiUpdate wasn't updated for long time, since I do all the updates on the Amiga manually.
First I updated the AmiUpdate, then the AmigaOS and finally the MUI (also seen in the video at the end).

After installation of the Update 2, I paused the video and then resumed when it booted again.

The part where I had to manually edit the file was really annoying. I had to triple-check if I have written it correctly, with the risk of rendering my Amiga unbootable.

I don't know if this is the case with clean install of FEu2.

I didn't run FixFonts. I didn't know it was needed! But will do it.

Meanwhile I am enjoying running some new software.

The DOSBox emulator with x86 JIT emulation is quite fast and impressive, although I wasn't able to run Windows 95 or Windows 98 on it yet.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 27-Aug-2021 15:29:28
#79 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11917
From: Norway

@Hypex

Anyway, I noticed the copper list array in my (lib)copper project, is too small, so it corrupts memory, I had all kinds issues working on it , I see its like 3 or 4 fools downloading it
Anyway developers, downloading random stuff from github, must expect crap like that.

Anyway people love this kind stuff on Amiga, so maybe I should not fix it… Amiga developers never write buggy software after all. So, we don't need memory protection.



Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 27-Aug-2021 at 03:42 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 27-Aug-2021 at 03:40 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 27-Aug-2021 at 03:30 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: How's your experience been with FE Update 2?
Posted on 27-Aug-2021 15:46:35
#80 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11917
From: Norway

@drHirudo

Quote:
I didn't run FixFonts. I didn't know it was needed! But will do it.


Always after you have converted TTF fonts into bullet fonts, you most use it.

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