So there a movement in the tech world on the Right to Repair, I just wonder what Amiga users feel about all this, I know Commodore did a pretty good job for the time they where about, I dont recall them doing any funny business like have custom screw heads made, or holding on to the chips supply or having software / the OS detect none compliment hardware, I look at the whole modding and hacking scene we have got in the Amiga world and it kind of make me sad that the new modern computers dont really have that.

Most Phones & laptops just 6 year ago you could easily replace the battery now that's no longer the case, I get it for some designs it might be very difficult or in practice to allow battery access but then there even stopping third party replacement parts I get it they can be dangerous or not as good quality control but it should be up to the end user of what they do with the device.

Plus who knows where this will lead in the future as more device get connected to the internet, or when all cars go electric. John Deere tractors story is maybe a glimpse of the future? ( https://www.vice.com/en/article/xykkkd/why-american-farmers-are-hacking-their-tractors-with-ukrainian-firmware )

Anyway pretty good video on it here where I feel the basic right to repair a item you own should be allowed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTbrXiIzUt4

Last edited by amigang on 08-May-2021 at 02:03 PM.
Last edited by amigang on 08-May-2021 at 02:01 PM.

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@amigang

I'm all for it. I'd like to start with my Kindle. In it's current state it's more of an appliance than a general-purpose computing device.

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@amigang

I voted against only because it's not clear what you're referring to.

A lot of warnings about repair is due to liability concerns. There are things in some devices that can kill you. For those that don't, the average idiot messing with the device can destroy important data (almost guilty). In that sense, forbidding repairs is one effective way of preventing an entire class of frivolous lawsuits.

However, I agree that the design of devices to prevent even a trained or authorized individual to perform a repair is an abuse that we should consider regulating.

An example: When my wife's Moto G3's battery died, a couple of local repair shops said, nope, sorry, won't do that one, too hard. Motorola designed the thing not to be repaired. A little digging online and I found a video that showed how to do it. My respect for the South Asians who figure out how to do this; you can find loads of such videos in barely comprehensible English. A short time later and voila, I have a mostly working phone. ("Mostly" because the screen has vertical gray lines when it's on and otherwise all black, e.g., at first boot. Any other time the screen is fine. I probably connected the screen slightly badly but I don't care enough to open the thing back up and figure it out.)

Another: At least one repair shop has told me they won't do newer phones with the wraparound screens because they're just as likely to break the screen as to fix the phone.

You may remember how the music corps used to fight the sharing of music online, even the selling of music online, up until Steve Jobs convinced them that he could make them money hand over fist with iTunes. Once these manufacturers realize they can make money on the repairs they'll change their business model, but until then we're stuck with a bunch of tech companies thumping their chests about sustainable practices while fighting tooth and nail to protect a business model that constitutes nothing more than the selling of disposable phones.

...with Apple and Google being the leading offenders.

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@simplex

PS I mentioned "almost guilty" at one point. When I upgraded my A500 to a Fat(ter?) Agnus back in 92 or 93 I didn't cut the connection in the motherboard deep enough. Thank God for the guy that Grapevine Computers (?) had back then who kindly took some time to help me get that worked out.

Likewise the idiotic design of the WB ROMs on some of those A500's (like mine) where they'd ship a ROM and you had to solder a wire connecting two pins. I had such a hard time of it when I upgraded to 2.x that I took it to a professional for 3.x and even he soldered the wrong pins, so I did it myself again.

I think eventually they started shipping ROMs with the wire soldered already, so idiots like me could just cut it instead of waste a couple of hours panicking that our machine no longer works, but that $.02 modification was too expensive (or perhaps too intelligent) for them to provide from the start.

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@amigang

I believe they wont the schematics, in order to repair devices, that can be problem because make it easier to copy someone’s else work, I suggest that be time period before schematics was given, but don’t see way a law should enforce it.

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@simplex

"There are things in some devices that can kill you"

So ?! It's the persons equipment and decision to take the risk and not anyone else's business. And by the same token if one gets injured it's one's own responsibility..
It's funny how they invoke "our security" to justify going forward with their interests/agendas...

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José

@Jose

Agreed, I just repaired an Apple charger lead that started to snap. Simple touch of solder and reinforced the joint with superglue and then electrical tape and a pen spring to stop flexing. And £79.99 saved! Might not pass a PAT test but landfill space saved!

Also replaced one of those cheap Chinese battery cell cordless drill battery packs with a slimline sealed battery of the same voltage. Yes I only saved £10 on buying a new drill but it’s the principle and you get to practice your soldering It is scandalous that all those cordless batteries have proprietary connectors

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@Jose

Quote:

Quote: "There are things in some devices that can kill you" So ?!

Read two sentences further, where I wrote: Quote:

Quote: In that sense, forbidding repairs is one effective way of preventing an entire class of frivolous lawsuits.

I don't like it, but our litigious society is a cause.

I work at a university. Some years ago, university counsel advised us that when a student asks for a letter of recommendation, we should obtain an explicit release to discuss the student's grades.

Kind of stupid, right? Why would he say such a stupid thing? "A recent lawsuit in Florida was filed by a student who complained that her professor discussed her grades in a letter of recommendation..."

Around that time I realized that companies don't pay lawyers to fight lawsuits. They pay lawyers to prevent lawsuits. Forbidding repair of your product is one way to prevent liability lawsuits.

Last edited by simplex on 08-May-2021 at 08:35 PM.
Last edited by simplex on 08-May-2021 at 08:35 PM.

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I've decided to follow an awful lot of people I respect and leave AmigaWorld. If for some reason you want to talk to me, it shouldn't take much effort to find me.

@simplex
Ok but it sounds fishy because most equipment already have stickers warning for authorized repair personnel only or something along those lines, or at least warning of danger. So if the courts were reasonable they would simply consider the owner responsible for anything that happens after they decided to do open/repair the equipment themselves.

@BigD
I repaired a big vintage audio amp that had capacitance to kill me. I could hear the buzz on the rails when it was on! I don't have any education on electronics and I'm glad following online tutorials I managed to repair it. There's almost nothing like that today, at least if you don't want to pay thousands...
It felt great when I got it working but I admit I was kind of nervous when testing knowing the danger.
I guess in a not so far distopian future they're gonna have devices that warn the police when the owner opens them so that they can play him a visit...

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José

@Jose

Quote:

So if the courts were reasonable they would simply consider the owner responsible for anything that happens after they decided to do open/repair the equipment themselves.

I agree, but courts are not always reasonable. A lot of Western legal culture over the last few decades has concentrated on arguing that almost any known risk is unreasonable. Besides, "reasonable" can be culturally conditioned; there's a reason a lot of IP lawsuits are filed in certain jurisdictions, where judges and juries are known to be friendlier to that sort of, uh, "reasoning".

Please note that I'm not saying this is the only reason.

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I've decided to follow an awful lot of people I respect and leave AmigaWorld. If for some reason you want to talk to me, it shouldn't take much effort to find me.

Good news, the tide seems to be moving the right way. Guess that distopian future is probably still somewhat in the future ;)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dhuia0skrus

Last edited by Jose on 09-May-2021 at 04:09 PM.

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José