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Poll : Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Detailed, with a firm ship date
Vague and evasive
Somewhere in between
Pancakes
 
PosterThread
Everblue 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 18-Oct-2021 9:34:22
#21 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 24-Sep-2006
Posts: 667
From: Amigaland

So, please correct me if I am wrong - the staus of the board is:

1. Drivers - all done
2. Software, getting there
3. Hardware, no idea when it is happening or where even it is going to be manufactured.

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IridiumFX 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 18-Oct-2021 10:33:01
#22 ]
Member
Joined: 7-Apr-2017
Posts: 67
From: London, UK

Constructive criticism ...

Was it just me or Trevor and Steven spent most of the show caught off guard?
They gave the impression of not being prepared. I like "genuine people", but not every observer does. Trevor, However, promised to give an actual update sooner or later on his blog, which I 100% appreciate, it shows dedicaton. Thumbs up.

The idea of hammering forums to make people know there's a new Amiga product is also a good realization, imho. However ...
- who should do this ? The world is changing and external-zealots don't work anymore.
- which forums ? Commodorians will not switch, deal with it. Atarians? We burned the bridges mocking them for ages, mission impossible. Linuxians? Those are the worst fanatics ever forged and the Androidians are not much better. Apple people? heh, snob club. Not gonna happen unless you have the Apple seal of approval (and pay for it).
It may work to have more presence on youtube with coding sessions (OS4 is a radical departure from Amiga OS 3. I tried, failed and shelved it, for instance) being more active in providing content to educate OS4ers and the random guest, however. Maybe a dedicated printed magazine to create that feeling of rebirth? but that's extra costs and not enough news.

Trevor also realized there's a price barrier. I like that man. He's caught between a rock and a hard place, however, as the user base does not allow to produce at high volumes. On the other hand, A-Eon has no ultra low price product to use as an onboarding platform, like the various beagle-boards and raspberry-pis did on the ARM camp.
If I was Trev, I'd call Michele Battilana and Tony Wilen who are experts in this field and build up a software only, click & install dev-first AmigaOS4 environment for your PC/Mac/Linux to expand the audience, hoping for a conversion rate to the actual hardware when it's ready.

Last edited by IridiumFX on 18-Oct-2021 at 11:13 AM.

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Rose 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 18-Oct-2021 11:19:26
#23 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 5-Nov-2009
Posts: 935
From: Unknown

@IridiumFX

Quote:
We burned the bridges mocking them for ages, mission impossible.


It's not just limited to Atari users.

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paolone 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 18-Oct-2021 12:47:44
#24 ]
Super Member
Joined: 24-Sep-2007
Posts: 1100
From: Unknown

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

There are multiple paths, that can be taken, the question is what order.

A) 32bit -> 64bit
B) 32bit -> SMP (AmigaOS4)
C) PPC -> ARM
D) PPC -> x64 (MorphOS)



Frankly speaking, the only path which makes sense here is:

ANY -> Grave

Sorry for being so negative, but the only positive things the Amiga scene finally started producing, are new videogames for the classic machines. Like the C64 scene started doing several and several years before.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 18-Oct-2021 15:50:04
#25 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11921
From: Norway

@paolone

I kind agree with, more ideas and projects I can work on then time available.

Modern computer is moving target, and get why just doing stuff because like it, instead doing stuff because some else wonts it for money.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 18-Oct-2021 at 04:05 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 18-Oct-2021 at 03:57 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 18-Oct-2021 at 03:52 PM.

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matthey 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 18-Oct-2021 21:13:56
#26 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2007
Posts: 1230
From: Kansas

IridiumFX Quote:

Was it just me or Trevor and Steven spent most of the show caught off guard?
They gave the impression of not being prepared. I like "genuine people", but not every observer does. Trevor, However, promised to give an actual update sooner or later on his blog, which I 100% appreciate, it shows dedicaton. Thumbs up.


Steven's Amiga boing ball balloons definitely required planning! Some of the problem may have been cutting from one video feed (solo live, multi-live and recorded) to the next without a good system of notification of what was active which was likely out of their control. Steven joked more and was more vague than normal about the 3rd attempt at the multi-core support in ExecSG. He really doesn't want to and shouldn't over promise for something that may not be possible, at least without hardware help. Others have already made that mistake and he was put in a tough spot to give an update. Maybe some of the expert low level PPC programmers on this board heard the call for help and can step up if there are any. RISC compilers were supposed to make assembly programming obsolete and this was thought to be an advantage. There are plenty of good low level 68k programmers around.

IridiumFX Quote:

The idea of hammering forums to make people know there's a new Amiga product is also a good realization, imho. However ...
- who should do this ? The world is changing and external-zealots don't work anymore.
- which forums ? Commodorians will not switch, deal with it. Atarians? We burned the bridges mocking them for ages, mission impossible. Linuxians? Those are the worst fanatics ever forged and the Androidians are not much better. Apple people? heh, snob club. Not gonna happen unless you have the Apple seal of approval (and pay for it).


Add a $10 FPGA and you may get some of the Commodore 8 bit fans. Use a 68k CPU and give some support to Atari fans which has worked for the Vampire. Make hardware cheap enough with an MMU and you might get some Linuxians and Androidians using the hardware albeit without the AmigaOS unless they get hooked on the Amiga while playing 68k games. It should be possible to create a more modern linux.library like ixemul to run inside of AmigaOS while using the MMU. Apple fans are a tough sell as they are locked into the Apple ecosystem. All you can do is try to undercut Apple products in price.

IridiumFX Quote:

It may work to have more presence on youtube with coding sessions (OS4 is a radical departure from Amiga OS 3. I tried, failed and shelved it, for instance) being more active in providing content to educate OS4ers and the random guest, however. Maybe a dedicated printed magazine to create that feeling of rebirth? but that's extra costs and not enough news.


Is AmigaOS 4 really that different to program from AmigaOS 3?

IridiumFX Quote:

Trevor also realized there's a price barrier. I like that man. He's caught between a rock and a hard place, however, as the user base does not allow to produce at high volumes. On the other hand, A-Eon has no ultra low price product to use as an onboarding platform, like the various beagle-boards and raspberry-pis did on the ARM camp.


Are you sure high volume sales are not possible? Mass production should be able to dramatically lower costs and increase sales but there is a risk that volumes will not be high enough. I wouldn't try it with PPC or emulation on ARM hardware but retro 68k hardware which is also semi-modern and cheap is a lot more interesting and could turn heads if done right.

IridiumFX Quote:

If I was Trev, I'd call Michele Battilana and Tony Wilen who are experts in this field and build up a software only, click & install dev-first AmigaOS4 environment for your PC/Mac/Linux to expand the audience, hoping for a conversion rate to the actual hardware when it's ready.


The best Amiga lure is retro gaming which would require a 68k AmigaOS. It doesn't do any good to lure customers though if what you are trying to convert them to is more expensive and slower than the emulation hardware they are using. Amiga retro gaming on PPC is slower emulation than x86-64 or ARM emulation and costs more. Mass produced competitive 68k hardware would be needed first.

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BigD 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 18-Oct-2021 21:18:43
#27 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 5964
From: UK

@matthey

Quote:
The best Amiga lure is retro gaming which would require a 68k AmigaOS. It doesn't do any good to lure customers though if what you are trying to convert them to is more expensive and slower than the emulation hardware they are using. Amiga retro gaming on PPC is slower emulation than x86-64 or ARM emulation and costs more. Mass produced competitive 68k hardware would be needed first.


The A1222 Plus demo guy said that if classic gaming was your primary use for the hardware you should consider the Vampire SA.

For productivity apps the A1222 Plus appears to run great other than for 3D rendering.

Last edited by BigD on 18-Oct-2021 at 09:19 PM.

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BigD 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 18-Oct-2021 22:56:16
#28 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 5964
From: UK

@Thread

A1222 Plus update:

"When it's built!"

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toRus 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 19-Oct-2021 0:08:17
#29 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 207
From: Unknown

@IridiumFX

Quote:

IridiumFX wrote:
- which forums ? Commodorians will not switch, deal with it. Atarians? We burned the bridges mocking them for ages, mission impossible. Linuxians? Those are the worst fanatics ever forged and the Androidians are not much better. Apple people? heh, snob club. Not gonna happen unless you have the Apple seal of approval (and pay for it).


As long as we don't get PC/Windows people we are ok.

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matthey 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 19-Oct-2021 0:36:17
#30 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2007
Posts: 1230
From: Kansas

BigD Quote:

The A1222 Plus demo guy said that if classic gaming was your primary use for the hardware you should consider the Vampire SA.


For best classic gaming compatibility, MiSTer is probably a better choice than the Vampire. The Vampire is somewhere between the MiSTer and the 1222 in performance and compatibility although closer to the MiSTer which also has more versatility as it is more open. The Apollo core would fit in the MiSTer FPGA which is similar (Altera Cyclone V) and, last I checked, larger than any used in Vampire hardware. Being open is a huge advantage here giving MiSTer a much broader appeal. None of these hardwares is competitive in performance/price and it is difficult to make hardware with a large amount of FPGA logic cheap. The options are either a hard CPU with smaller FPGA for chipset and older CPU simulation or a hybrid custom chip eFPGA with hard and eFPGA blocks but this requires a 16nm chip fab process which would increase the price but also performance (more risk for mass production).

https://www.achronix.com/product/speedcore

At AmiWest, Trevor mentioned he bought a MiSTer and he will notice the quality of simulation and flexibility of this hardware. No more latency on the controls. Maybe he will realize FPGA+GPIO is better than Zena+Xorro and finally replace it.

The Sam 440 had a tiny Lattice FPGA with 80 pin GPIO which was cool but the FPGA was too small for even a chipset emulation. A larger FPGA of the same cost today may hold a chipset and even smaller CPUs up to the 68000 (roughly equivalent to the $45 FPGA Ohm). Sadly, the Sam 460 removed the FPGA instead of upgrading it to a more useful size. Of course the ultimate hobbyist computer would have a 68k CPU instead of PPC which would also reduce the footprint making it cheaper to mass produce.

BigD Quote:

For productivity apps the A1222 Plus appears to run great other than for 3D rendering.


Sadly, 3D games need recompiling due to the missing FPU (seems slow even compared to my 68060 but then I'm used to Voodoo accelerated gfx too). I just can't see a big push to recompile for the 1222 as 1000 or so units isn't enough to incentivize it and if there are more runs then why not upgrade the e500v2 cores to e500mc cores with the standard FPU?

Last edited by matthey on 19-Oct-2021 at 12:42 AM.
Last edited by matthey on 19-Oct-2021 at 12:39 AM.

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KimmoK 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 19-Oct-2021 9:13:37
#31 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5204
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

@matthey

"Of course the ultimate hobbyist computer would have a 68k CPU instead of PPC which would also reduce the footprint making it cheaper to mass produce."

I doubt that would change the price much ... but it would cripple the performance.

Once we have multicore support (perhaps with memory protection & 68k sandbox), we need to start thinking ARM, IMO.

199USD PPC board P-Cubed that did not materialize after all:
http://ben-collins.blogspot.com/2012/11/servergy-announces-new-powerpc.html
https://www.linux.com/news/servergy-announces-linux-power-enterprise-development-platform/

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// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

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eliyahu 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 19-Oct-2021 15:11:20
#32 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1869
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@matthey

Quote:
Sadly, 3D games need recompiling due to the missing FPU.

Some do, some don't. It really depends. Some work great out of the box. I'll be posting tons of stuff whenever the machine ships to share on how well certain games perform, what settings changes are needed (if any) to optimize, that sort of thing. Most of the 68K stuff runs really well, in fact, although it looks like my RunInUAE settings were borked during the demo. I need to create a Youtube video to show how well everything runs in that space.

-- eliyahu

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Multicore support is still a priority

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eliyahu 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 19-Oct-2021 15:19:25
#33 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2010
Posts: 1869
From: Waterbury, Connecticut (USA)

@BigD

Quote:
The A1222 Plus demo guy said that if classic gaming was your primary use for the hardware you should consider the Vampire SA.

For productivity apps the A1222 Plus appears to run great other than for 3D rendering.

Yep, that was me!

My comment on the Vampire was directed towards folks that use their Amigas almost exclusively for playing classic games. In that case the Vampire is an awesome choice, even if it's a tad pricier than the A1222. For everyone else willing to try AOS4, I'd still recommend the A1222. 68K games work great under emulation -- either via 'Petunia' or E-UAE -- and you get so much more performance and capability everywhere else. Oh, and you get more modern games, too.

But if you're basically looking for a 68K gaming platform, then the A1222 may not be the best choice. Go with Vampire SA or a Pi400 setup. It's just my opinion, of course. What we need is for the A1222 to ship and have everyone attend next year's shows in the US and Europe, try both out, and make their own choices.

-- eliyahu

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Multicore support is still a priority

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Rose 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 19-Oct-2021 15:43:12
#34 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 5-Nov-2009
Posts: 935
From: Unknown

@IridiumFX


Quote:

toRus wrote:
@IridiumFX

Quote:

IridiumFX wrote:
- which forums ? Commodorians will not switch, deal with it. Atarians? We burned the bridges mocking them for ages, mission impossible. Linuxians? Those are the worst fanatics ever forged and the Androidians are not much better. Apple people? heh, snob club. Not gonna happen unless you have the Apple seal of approval (and pay for it).


As long as we don't get PC/Windows people we are ok.


Like toRus here proves, Linux users have nothing compared to TrueAmigans™ when it comes to fanatism.

Amigan's are Amiga's worst enemy.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 19-Oct-2021 16:10:39
#35 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11921
From: Norway

@matthey

Quote:
Is AmigaOS 4 really that different to program from AmigaOS 3?


Depends, if he used to write Amos program and now try to write C programs, he might find that hard.

Arexx is Arexx same.
Phyton I belive that’s only AmigaOS4 option.
AmigaE, should be possible with Portable E.
680x0 Assembler, you need to use vasm, (AsmPro, AsmOne buggy and useless on AmigaOS4.1)
BlitzBasic2 crashes, AmiBlitz3 never tried it.
Amos can be programed in an emulator, and you run it Amos Kittens. (no compiler for AmigaOS4.x)
Pascal, never tried, but we have FreePascal.

C/C++ should be easier on AmigaOS4.1, more tools, support for ABCShell (Bash), strange syntax “IExec-> “ not needed, easy to avoid. Some legacy has to be replaced but lot examples on how to do it, and easy to ask in the forums.

680x0 Assembler:
Do not bang chipsets (custom registers).
Don’t trust that code someone else wrote does not bang hardware.
Remember to black list your program in “Compatibility Preferences” or else you won’t get stack traces. Always open Intuition screens and always provide Mode ID, AmigaOS4.1 will give True Color Mode or 8bit chunky Mode, if not defined!.
Always alloc and free memory, as expected.
Don’t disable multitasking, more than a few microseconds. (Sound / network, messaging depends on it.)
Do not expect fonts to be only 8pixel high, all kind with and heights can be used.
Do not expect Window Width, and Height to be the same, Border width and Height, changes inner width and height, always resize window to fit larger buttons.
Don’t poke execbase, use functions to obtain system info.
Do not assume everyone has the same devices installed, different hardware has different devices.
Do not assume screens id, has same height and width of different machine, screen id depends on the monitor.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 19-Oct-2021 at 04:29 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 19-Oct-2021 at 04:21 PM.

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IridiumFX 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 19-Oct-2021 18:57:42
#36 ]
Member
Joined: 7-Apr-2017
Posts: 67
From: London, UK

@Rose

I think toRus was being sarcastic, which I can appreciate. He mentioned the last desktop tribe I did not name

Quote:

Rose wrote:
@IridiumFX


[quote]
toRus wrote:
@IridiumFX


IridiumFX wrote:
- which forums ? Commodorians will not switch, deal with it. Atarians? We burned the bridges mocking them for ages, mission impossible. Linuxians? Those are the worst fanatics ever forged and the Androidians are not much better. Apple people? heh, snob club. Not gonna happen unless you have the Apple seal of approval (and pay for it).

As long as we don't get PC/Windows people we are ok.

Like toRus here proves, Linux users have nothing compared to TrueAmigans™ when it comes to fanatism.

Amigan's are Amiga's worst enemy.

Last edited by IridiumFX on 19-Oct-2021 at 06:58 PM.

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bison 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 21-Oct-2021 15:09:29
#37 ]
Super Member
Joined: 18-Dec-2007
Posts: 1913
From: N-Space

@thread

Four people voted for "detailed, with a firm ship date" *after* AmiWest was over and no ship date was announced. What's up with that?

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IridiumFX 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 22-Oct-2021 13:29:01
#38 ]
Member
Joined: 7-Apr-2017
Posts: 67
From: London, UK

@NutsAboutAmiga

C and ASM, and I am doing away with ASM as it's clear I'll never get back to a teen brain :)

Amiga/Amiga OS and AmigaOne/AmigaOS bear similar names and similar GUIs, but it's a surface only similarity, sometimes camouflaged by High(er) Level Languages and libraries.

in C you have the "Custom" struct which is both part of the NDK and the official Amiga OS (note the space between the two words).
When I attach a copperlist to my app, I don't go ASM for instance. The same happens when I want to blit something. It's all C, System supported and ... not working natively on AmigaOS (Note the missing space here).

To scroll something, do you play with an offset or a modulo ? Or do you blit over instead ? Have you ever timed something on a vblank ? Do you use hardware Sprites ? DMA enabled? What is a CIA ?

On the Amiga (machine family), I have an OS (casually, referred to as Amiga OS) handling the chipset (guess ? the Amiga chipset) or letting me takeover when I know better. It's flexible, lightweight, fit for the purpose it was designed for.

I am not bashing AmigaOS (without the space). I stopped caring about it. The label on the box was not matching the content. I took a spoonful of it and disliked it. I am happy for you if you have found something you like in your generic machine running AmigaOS. I am equally happy to see OS4 and System54 move forward, otherwise I'd not write here. No polemics.

@Trevor, gimme an AGA on PCI-Express and I'll happily jump to this AmigaOS/System54 thingy again.

Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote:
...

C/C++ should be easier on AmigaOS4.1, more tools, support for ABCShell (Bash), strange syntax “IExec-> “ not needed, easy to avoid. Some legacy has to be replaced but lot examples on how to do it, and easy to ask in the forums.

680x0 Assembler:
Do not bang chipsets (custom registers).
Don’t trust that code someone else wrote does not bang hardware.
Remember to black list your program in “Compatibility Preferences” or else you won’t get stack traces. Always open Intuition screens and always provide Mode ID, AmigaOS4.1 will give True Color Mode or 8bit chunky Mode, if not defined!.
Always alloc and free memory, as expected.
Don’t disable multitasking, more than a few microseconds. (Sound / network, messaging depends on it.)
Do not expect fonts to be only 8pixel high, all kind with and heights can be used.
Do not expect Window Width, and Height to be the same, Border width and Height, changes inner width and height, always resize window to fit larger buttons.
Don’t poke execbase, use functions to obtain system info.
Do not assume everyone has the same devices installed, different hardware has different devices.
Do not assume screens id, has same height and width of different machine, screen id depends on the monitor.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 22-Oct-2021 16:57:57
#39 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11921
From: Norway

@IridiumFX

Quote:
C and ASM, and I am doing away with ASM as it's clear I'll never get back to a teen brain :)


Never got really into 680x0 asm, I can barely read it (I have to lookup etch instruction to see what it does), and I horrible as write it, I too easily break short jumps, long jumps, and compiler complains, and have mess around different assemblers, and I’m not that interested.

in libcopper.library I’m porting a tut46.a to tut46.c, it was written as example that Photons@coopex did, a few years back, just figuring out how-to rewrite this in a C style.

https://github.com/khval/libcopper.library/blob/main/tests/asmskool/tut46.c

I will be using libblitter.library to do hardware blitter stuff, libcopper will do rendering of AGA screen, its where CPU intensive, but there is lots of CPU left to do other stuff, when nothing else has to be emulated, (you most likely can do some smart refresh etc as well, don’t need to render everything when nothing is happening.)

All registers are handled as globals, writing it in C means I have move data that defined bottom of project to top, or declare it at the top, so some code has moved around.

it’s bit time consuming, but I think the end result, can be interesting, to see how to port assembler to a C program.

(Alternatively I can maybe be done whit dividing the code, and compiled as individual parts loaded etch part in with a hunk loader, and use internal JIT compiler on it, but I believe its lot of work, not as big advantage as porting it to C. or maybe projects like this is better written as WarpOS programs?)

You kind get where a function starts and end in Assembler, RTS being the end, “.labels” most often loops, name: being the function name.
Quote:
Amiga/Amiga OS and AmigaOne/AmigaOS bear similar names and similar GUIs, but it's a surface only similarity, sometimes camouflaged by High(er) Level Languages and libraries.


I can write 680x0 using old SDK if I wonted to, its all there, but if you compare it with new SDK, you see some stuff has been renamed, or replaced by better functions that does something similar, but they try make things safer or add support for something.

On AmigaOS4.1 you don’t need to use pens, but you can use pens, only if you want to, its easier to just set ARGB value of front color, back ground color, or border color, the biggest difference is bigger fonts, old gui’s are warry static, they don’t always scale, often designed around topaz 8 font, this makes old GUI’s often look like crap. On higher resolutions you wont larger fonts, so you can read the text. Some old GUI where designed when people were using floppy disk with just one font installed in the ROM. Its hard to write a GUI that scales and has adjust to different border sizes, and font sizes. But people don’t do that, they use Reaction or Mui, so instead, a lot easier when GUI knows how to resize itself, without the developer having to code it in.

To scroll something, do you play with an offset or a modulo?

Graphic library has scroll function, don’t believe it takes modulo, it takes a rastport.
Well you have bytes per row, so I guess so, WritePiexelArray see Picasso96 / CyberGraphics, similar functions exists for graphic library.

Or do you blit over instead ?

Most likely using Composition / GPU.
(but not if I’m work on legacy code.)

Quote:
Have you ever timed something on a vblank?


Yes using timer.device (timer signals) or WaitTOF(), this functions should exist AmigaOS3.x as well.

Do you use hardware Sprites ? DMA enabled?
Don’t have hardware sprites, its ARGB bitmaps using composition, or flat 3D objects.
or it has to be slowly rendered. A few functions support DMA, like WritePixelArray, (often better then bitmap locking on a displayable bitmap as it moved data only one way…)

Quote:
What is a CIA ?


http://amigadev.elowar.com/read/ADCD_2.1/Hardware_Manual_guide/node012E.html

It’s hardware timer CIAA / CIAB chips see Amiga 500 motherboard, AmigaONE’s don’t have that.
not sure how port code that depends on it. (a lot of the code is polling the hardware registers. Or using interrupt vectors.)
Quote:
(Note the missing space here).


Amiga Or OS? Well, there is no OR in AmigaONE OS, you only have the OS, and you depend on it for Audio, Network, USB, GPU and everything else, you take over maybe but how the heck can you do anything then. No AmigaONE is the same.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 22-Oct-2021 at 05:15 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 22-Oct-2021 at 05:00 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 22-Oct-2021 at 05:00 PM.

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Re: Trevor's AmiWest A1222 update
Posted on 22-Oct-2021 19:32:37
#40 ]
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Joined: 4-Apr-2014
Posts: 1154
From: Unknown

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote:
@amigang

There are multiple paths, that can be taken, the question is what order.

A) 32bit -> 64bit
B) 32bit -> SMP (AmigaOS4)
C) PPC -> ARM
D) PPC -> x64 (MorphOS)

A) I can’t think of any good argument for it.

B) Will enable more CPU power, and a lot things will improve.

C) Going ARM bigger market, can use big endian, in some form.

D) Going x64, maybe the days are numbered, reducing CPU power, not environmentally friendly, imagine a carbon tax on x64. (Too hot, take lot of energy, noisy, eats batters like butter.)

C and D requiered recompile of all applications, (or a JIT compiler, maybe get 15-30% of CPU power of the native CPU. (but really a lot less with out SMP.)).


A) you can’t find any good arguments for it? Amiga has 31-bit address space, which is very limited. Even 32-bit is limited. 64-bit is *needed*, together with proper 64-bit instructions to go with it. Will need recompiled (and slightly altered) sources.

B) also breaks compatibility and will also need recompiled (and slightly altered) sources. Yes, even on OS4.

C) ARM is not a generic standard platform though, no single market. Everything is custom built. There exists motherboards that resembles proper x86 desktop motherboards, but they are few and not easily available. And Raspberry Pi is not one of them.

D) is the only proper generic desktop platform that also has proper laptop options. Options ranging from energy efficient to very powerful. Best price/performance ratio.

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