@BigD

I'm going to go with bad and ugly.

Last edited by bison on 15-Dec-2022 at 08:32 PM.

_________________
"Unix is supposed to fix that." -- Jay Miner

Hyperion(more precisely, ben Hermans) is, without any doubt, the greatest calamity Amiga/AmigaOS have ever seen.

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@WolfToTheMoon

But he also stopped Amiga Inc from destroying AmigaOS 4.x like they did the Amiga's credibility with The Christmas Card Maker and Amiga Center at Kent! Ben also "enabled" OS3.1.4 and OS3.2!

What a conundrum!

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

Ben not "enabled" 3.1.4 and 3.2, he got it on a silver plate without paying one cent

@BigD

Quote:

But he also stopped Amiga Inc from destroying AmigaOS 4.x like they did the Amiga's credibility with The Christmas Card Maker and Amiga Center at Kent! Ben also "enabled" OS3.1.4 and OS3.2!

Nah, the basically stole AmigaOS IP as soon as the lawyer in B.H got a whiff of blood coming from A.Inc.
Had it not been for Hyperion A.Inc would have licensed the development of AmigaOS to someone else. Continuation of the OS was always going to happen. The fact that A.Inc themselves released nothing of import is irrelevant in regards to AmigaOS. They *always* planned to license out the OS development.
It just turned out that they chose close the the single worst entity possible to do so.

@BigD

Just want to comment ...

I won't comment on the legal stuff or the court battles.

I purchased my OS4 system in 2004. I have installed every publically available version of OS4 since that time. Some were great and some were not.

From my point of view, Hyperion went to sleep for many years after they released AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition Update 1. Like many other OS4 users, I purchased Enhancer software from A-EON to enhance my system.

Then suddenly, Hyperion came back to life and released AmgaOS 4.1 FE Update 2. Unfortunately, it had some issues and required some fixes.

My system has been very stable since I installed the hotfix.

Since then, I purchased and installed A-EON's Enhancer Software 2.2.

At this time, I do not expect any more OS4 updates from Hyperion.

I have no issues with Cloanto and own some of their software.

-----

I also own an ancient Commodore A2000HD system with AmigaOS 3.1.

I purchased AmigaOS 3.2 and Kickstart ROM to upgrade my A2000HD.

But, I decided to try it first with emulation.

AmigaOS 3.2 running on E-UAE running on my OS4 system.

I have since upgraded to AmigaOS 3.2.1 and it seems to work fine under emulation with most of my old software.



redfox

Last edited by redfox on 15-Dec-2022 at 11:59 PM.
Last edited by redfox on 15-Dec-2022 at 11:57 PM.
Last edited by redfox on 15-Dec-2022 at 11:54 PM.

@fishy_fis

If it was as simple as calling a few motley contractors to do a spot of coding then Amiga Inc should have done it themselves! Oh yeah, they couldn't organise a stadium sponsorship deal and were just a shell company for Pentti Kouri! They sure did sell a mean Amiga Inc coffee mug though!

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@redfox

I'm glad your experiences with OS3.2 have been good and thanks for your honesty regarding OS4.x.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

Quote:

But he also stopped Amiga Inc from destroying AmigaOS 4.x

And we know this would be a net negative how?

One can of course spin the events as unfolded into a net positive narrative, but since we can't wind the proverbial clock back a try it the other way, we can't be certain that the other path would be worse than what we have today.

Ben/Hyperion didn't, or rather can not have saved us from anything. They are key actors in this ongoing farce. Their motivations are irrelevant: Only the detritus left in their wake are the means by which we can measure their role.

To quote Grantland Rice:
"For when the One Great Scorer comes to mark against your name,
He writes not that you won or lost, but how you played the Game."

Here endeth the sermon.

_________________
All the way, with 68k

@BigD

Quote:

If it was as simple as calling a few motley contractors to do a spot of coding then Amiga Inc should have done it themselves!

That's exactly what they did and what happened. It was always the plan.
They didn't have the talent inhouse, so how do you think they could have done it themselves?
The fact they didn't have the inhouse talent is why they contracted others to do it.
Had it not been Hyperion it would have been someone else. Unfortunately for A.Inc they contracted people who manipulated them so as to steal AmigaOS with delay tactic after delay tactic by developing something that the port wasn't intended to be.
And what was the result?
An OS that has seen in the ballpark of similar amounts of development in 15+ years as Commodore did every few years, even when they used 3rd party developers.
It could be argued that AmigaOS would be further along had Hyperion been con artists.
There's no way to know so sure, but Hyperion have showcased little more than incompetence and shadiness since they got involved with the OS.
Yes, they delivered something, but even a few bedroom coders with access to the sourcecode of AmigaOS could have delivered more in 15+ years approaching it as a hobby project.

Hyperion are the single worst thing that happened to AmigaOS in it's history.

Last edited by fishy_fis on 16-Dec-2022 at 06:02 AM.
Last edited by fishy_fis on 16-Dec-2022 at 06:00 AM.

Let’s face it the situation is a mess, the ip holders Hyperion and Amiga Corp need to try and just come together and recognise that all they are doing are hurting fans and users with there ip bull crap.

How many projects, developments, developers and users has this stuff held back progress and projects in the Amiga world.

I feel like there both squatters holding the keys on stuff they didn’t make and barely invested in and yet hold the power and make the money on stuff.

Part of me think well at least Hyperion did something with the ip, and made something that generally most people wanted to see and are happy with, amigaos3.2. I wish they treated devs better and insured they paid them what they owe. plus I wish we knew what the hell was going on with Os4, my guess just lack of money and devs to meet its commitment. But if that’s the case they should just allow A-eon ownership and recognise just holding on to a ip is bad for the os4 community.

Amiga Corp I feel are nearly as bad, I mean maybe because of disputes of amigaos3 license it stop them from being more proactive and supporting projects, but then the A500mini and Cloanto Amiga forever projects happen and both I feel could be better than what they are. I wrote about it on my blog https://amigang.com/cloanto-should-be-doing-more/ and it just feels like there so many missed opportunity within the Amiga community. It just a shame.

I feel like now as an Amiga fan you should just give your support and use product that you like and try not let the ip brain wash you into thinking it’s the only true Amiga way, pi + amikit is better than A500 mini, yes it not an official product and not in fancy package, but it better in every other way. Vampire team and there Apollo Os is great and improve aros 68k a lot (I wish the uae / emulator devs supported the saga and 68080 core) and I hope A-eon and it system 52 is also a success they clearly poured money and thrown more support to Os4 platform.

Last edited by amigang on 16-Dec-2022 at 10:59 AM.

_________________
AmigaNG, YouTube, LeaveReality Studio

@amigang

Quote:

Amiga Corp I feel are nearly as bad, I mean maybe because of disputes of amigaos3 license it stop them from being more proactive and supporting projects, but then the A500mini and Cloanto Amiga forever projects happen and both I feel could be better than what they are. I wrote about it on my blog https://amigang.com/cloanto-should-be-doing-more/ and it just feels like there so many missed opportunity within the Amiga community. It just a shame.

THEA500 Mini was a success and licensed just in time before a new wave of litigation! The other projects are not quite as rosy! I never even heard of AmigaOS 3.x until I researched 3.1.4 and 3.2! I get it now that it was meant to be a project to rebundle the majority of the components of OS3.9 and provide them legally but you have to admit that the OS3.2 product got closer to that goal! As for Amiga Forever; is this product penetrating into the mainstream PC user market? If not why not?

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

Hyperion is a criminakl enterprise and Ben is a criminal.
He never pays any developers, any revenue Hyperion gets goes straight down into Bens pocket and no one else sees a single cent.
This is how he manouvered out everyone else of the Hyperion share holders. He unilaterally hired himself as legal cuncil and then overcharged the company until Hyperion had to issue new shares and dillute everyone else out into oblivion.

Had this happened on a publicly traded company he would be in ten plus years of prison for this.


Sales of OS 3.2, not a single cent goes to any developer. Everything just goes to Bens pocket.
Do not gift Ben undeserved money for this. Just pirate it.

Piracy is the answer and the only ethical way to get OS3.2

Last edited by V8 on 16-Dec-2022 at 12:28 PM.

@V8

Quote:

Piracy is the answer and the only ethical way to get OS3.2

While I am not staunchly opposed to piracy, as a necessary component of a thriving ecosystem, the current state of our post-Amiga world is far from thriving.

I would happily donate 10x of Hyperion's asking price for Amiga OS 3.2, if I were assured that 85%+ went to the developers and 0% went to Ben.

As it is, I am happy with Amiga OS 3.9 + Boing Bags for the old stuff, and AROS 68k for the new.

_________________
All the way, with 68k

@agami

I agree that OS3.9 is great though I wouldn't want yo set it up from scratch again. However, it is not available to buy anymore as Vesalia have finally run out of CD-Roms. What was OS3.X from Cloanto and how close to a OS3.9 replacement did it become? If they'd pushed the concept there would have been no room in the market for OS3.1.4 and OS3.2!

(Edit: Cloanto released Workbench 3.X not Hyperion)

Last edited by BigD on 17-Dec-2022 at 11:09 AM.
Last edited by BigD on 17-Dec-2022 at 09:43 AM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

Quote:

What was OS3.X from Hyperion and how close to a OS3.9 replacement did it become?

Very funny.

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B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC

@kolla

I meant Cloanto. Sorry. Seriously, I don't know much about its development.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

Workbench 3.X Files

_________________
"Unix is supposed to fix that." -- Jay Miner

@BigD

Quote:

the OS3.2 CD is the only sensible consumer choice!

How is helping Ben Hermans to rape Jörg Strohmeyer et al some more a "sensible consumer choice"?

From what I hear, 3.2 is a really nice update. But is it essential? Were Classic Amigas useless before it came long? Is this a "3.2 or die" situation? No.

It's a nice, shiny toy. The kind that you can show to the community yelling, "look, something shiny!", the kind that immediately makes everybody forget that they just witnessed you beating up an old lady.

Quote:

But he also stopped Amiga Inc from destroying AmigaOS 4.x

No, he didn't. Amiga Inc. wanted to outsource OS development and had deals or at least negotiations with H&P, the MorphOS team and (finally) Hyperion. Nobody was going to "destroy" AmigaOS 4, Amiga Inc. was very much interested in continuing OS development - they even tried to buy it back from Ben, just to find out he played them and the buy-back-clause was useless.

As somebody already said: we have no idea how any alternative, Ben-free deal would have played out (it's not like Bill Buck or the MorphOS team leader are widely regarded as business geniuses). But claiming Ben "saved" AmigaOS is nonsense. It's just a defense mechanism, because you want to be left alone so you can keep playing with your shiny toy.

Hyperion may have gone back to sleep again, but others are active.
- Updated AmiSSL to AmiSSL-5.6
- Updated IBrowse to IBrowse 2.5.8



redfox