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   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
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pavlor 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 9-Apr-2023 15:28:02
#21 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9494
From: Unknown

@Maijestro

Network seems to work OK (tried only to download few applications from OS4depot via old IBrowse).

There are still some minor issues:
- NVRAM settings aren't saved after exiting QEMU (to make the boot automatic).
- Changing CDs via QEMU monitor is a painful experience (sometimes the emulation acts weird after disk change).
- Is there any easy option for file transfer between quest and host? I use iso images (with the help of UltraISO), but this leads to the above mentioned issue.
- QEMU doesn't support my native screen resolution 1366x768. Using 1024x768 right now.

Now some quick benchmarks (host: Core i3-5005U 2 GHz):

Dnetc/OGRNG: 3,300,486 nodes/sec

prBoom (timedemo demo3):
320x200 70.3 FPS
640x480 43.7 FPS
800x600 34.5 FPS
1024x768 20.0 FPS

Amiga Quake 2.40 (timedemo demo1):
640x480 11.6 FPS (slooow FPU )
1280x720 5.1 FPS (another test with -cpu 7447)

Ragemem:
VIDEO BUS
Read: 2512 MB/Sec
Write: 2759 MB/Sec


Blender (test.blend from http://www.eofw.org/bench/ ) - mostly testing FPU speed (command line: bldyn -b test.blend -o ram:picture -F JPEG -f 0)
02:05:44.30 (for comparison: Sam 440ep Flex 733 MHz gives 00.20.26.00; AmigaONE-XE G4 1.0 Ghz gives 00:10:15.56)

Note Blender GUI requires 3D accelleration (or Wazp3D) to work, but render benchmark doesn't open GUI, so works out of the box even under emulation.

Edit: Quake 1280x720
Edit: Blender
Edit: Blender benchmark link

Last edited by pavlor on 15-Apr-2023 at 12:13 PM.
Last edited by pavlor on 15-Apr-2023 at 11:47 AM.
Last edited by pavlor on 13-Apr-2023 at 07:56 PM.

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Maijestro 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 9-Apr-2023 18:18:39
#22 ]
Member
Joined: 31-Mar-2023
Posts: 20
From: Unknown

@pavlor

Quote:

pavlor wrote:
@Maijestro

Network seems to work OK (tried only to download few applications from OS4depot via old IBrowse).

There are still some minor issues:
- NVRAM settings aren't saved after exiting QEMU (to make the boot automatic).
- Changing CDs via QEMU monitor is a painful experience (sometimes the emulation acts weird after disk change).
- Is there any easy option for file transfer between quest and host? I use iso images (with the help of UltraISO), but this leads to the above mentioned issue.
- QEMU doesn't support my native screen resolution 1366x768. Using 1024x768 right now.

Now some quick benchmarks (host: Core i3-5005U 2 GHz):

Dnetc/OGRNG: 3,300,486 nodes/sec

prBoom (timedemo demo3):
320x200 70.3 FPS
640x480 43.7 FPS
800x600 34.5 FPS
1024x768 20.0 FPS

Amiga Quake 2.40 (timedemo demo1):
640x480 11.6 FPS (slooow FPU )

Ragemem:
VIDEO BUS
Read: 2512 MB/Sec
Write: 2759 MB/Sec


Thank you for the test.

Quake 2.40 gives me the following benchmark (timedemo demo1)
13.7 FPS at a resolution of 1280x720

"NVRAM settings aren't saved after exiting QEMU (to make the boot automatic)".

The nvram is not emulated yet therefore firmware environment variables are not preserved so the boot command has to be typed at each boot

Last edited by Maijestro on 09-Apr-2023 at 06:31 PM.
Last edited by Maijestro on 09-Apr-2023 at 06:22 PM.

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pavlor 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 10-Apr-2023 9:13:17
#23 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9494
From: Unknown

@Maijestro

Real world benchmark comparison:

Pegasos 2 G4 1266 MHz, 1 GB RAM, Radeon 9250 128 MB


Dnetc/OGRNG: 12,913,497 nodes/sec (KOGE 3.1 Scalar = AltiVec not used; same core as in the QEMU test)
Dnetc/OGRNG: 27,058,629 nodes/sec (KOGE 3.1 Hybrid = AltiVec used)

prBoom (timedemo demo3):
320x200 279.7 FPS
640x480 81.7 FPS
800x600 54.0 FPS
1024x768 33.1 FPS

Amiga Quake 2.40 (timedemo demo1):
640x480 53.8 FPS
1280x720 24.3 FPS

Ragemem
VIDEO BUS
READ: 51 MB/Sec
WRITE: 221 MB/Sec

Last edited by pavlor on 10-Apr-2023 at 09:13 AM.

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Maijestro 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 10-Apr-2023 18:19:39
#24 ]
Member
Joined: 31-Mar-2023
Posts: 20
From: Unknown

@pavlor

Quote:

pavlor wrote:
@Maijestro

Real world benchmark comparison:

Pegasos 2 G4 1266 MHz, 1 GB RAM, Radeon 9250 128 MB


Dnetc/OGRNG: 12,913,497 nodes/sec (KOGE 3.1 Scalar = AltiVec not used; same core as in the QEMU test)
Dnetc/OGRNG: 27,058,629 nodes/sec (KOGE 3.1 Hybrid = AltiVec used)

prBoom (timedemo demo3):
320x200 279.7 FPS
640x480 81.7 FPS
800x600 54.0 FPS
1024x768 33.1 FPS

Amiga Quake 2.40 (timedemo demo1):
640x480 53.8 FPS
1280x720 24.3 FPS

Ragemem
VIDEO BUS
READ: 51 MB/Sec
WRITE: 221 MB/Sec


Thanks for the detailed test with real hardware.

Ragemem:
VIDEO BUS
Read: 2512 MB/Sec
Write: 2759 MB/Sec

The bottleneck is probably the missing Altivec support and the SM501 driver with its 64 MB.

And the missing 3d acceleration.

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pavlor 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 10-Apr-2023 19:06:56
#25 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9494
From: Unknown

@Maijestro

Quote:
The bottleneck is probably the missing Altivec


FPU is far more important (softfloats are sloooow, integer performance of QEMU on your hardware probably reaches the X5000 level). AltiVec has use in some applications (lame, dnetc, mplayer), but FPU is a neccessity for 3D games (those not requiring 3D accelleration).

Quote:
support and the SM501 driver with its 64 MB.


SM501/502 is a dead end (too limited features - eg. 16 bit colour dept, screen resolutions etc.). Isn't it possible to emulate Cirrus Logic chip (GD5446 is available in QEMU and is supported by OS4 - at least by the Classic version)? That one at least supports 16M colours (well, screen resolution is also limited by 4 MB VRAM). However, using "-device cirrus-vga" freezes Pegasos 2 start-up. Toni Willen improved the Cirrus Logic emulation few years ago for WinUAE, maybe his work could be used back in QEMU? Speaking about WinUAE... (dreaming mode ON) what about porting the UAEGFX to QEMU? That would solve our GFX issue for time being.

I use 1280x1024 resolutions on Pegasos 2 in my possession (for best experience with old games), but most people today expect at least 1920x1080. Some OS4 applications even expect 24bit/32 bit colour depth (eg DosBox).

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Maijestro 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 10-Apr-2023 21:13:11
#26 ]
Member
Joined: 31-Mar-2023
Posts: 20
From: Unknown

@pavlor

Quote:

pavlor wrote:
@Maijestro

Quote:
The bottleneck is probably the missing Altivec


FPU is far more important (softfloats are sloooow, integer performance of QEMU on your hardware probably reaches the X5000 level). AltiVec has use in some applications (lame, dnetc, mplayer), but FPU is a neccessity for 3D games (those not requiring 3D accelleration).

Quote:
support and the SM501 driver with its 64 MB.


SM501/502 is a dead end (too limited features - eg. 16 bit colour dept, screen resolutions etc.). Isn't it possible to emulate Cirrus Logic chip (GD5446 is available in QEMU and is supported by OS4 - at least by the Classic version)? That one at least supports 16M colours (well, screen resolution is also limited by 4 MB VRAM). However, using "-device cirrus-vga" freezes Pegasos 2 start-up. Toni Willen improved the Cirrus Logic emulation few years ago for WinUAE, maybe his work could be used back in QEMU? Speaking about WinUAE... (dreaming mode ON) what about porting the UAEGFX to QEMU? That would solve our GFX issue for time being.

I use 1280x1024 resolutions on Pegasos 2 in my possession (for best experience with old games), but most people today expect at least 1920x1080. Some OS4 applications even expect 24bit/32 bit colour depth (eg DosBox).


Quote from BALATON Zoltan:

"So I've tested it again adding CirrusGD5446.chip to Kicklayout and then
using -device cirrus-vga,romfile="" -trace enable="vga*" and it looks like
the driver starts and talks to the card so it may work but something goes
wrong somewhere before it can display anything. Also enabling OS4 logs via
os4_commandline env variable I see bootimage module getting DSI exceptions
(although it still talks to the card) and screen remains blank so it seems
Cirrus driver is started but crashes on the card and does not fully
initialise it.

The same also happens if I add both -device sm501 and -device cirrus-vga
which means PCIGraphics.card does find the cirrus-vga as that's the first
it checks for so never gets to sm501 then. As I also see writes to the
card I think the CLGD driver also starts so it may work but something is
not going as it should.

The problem could be anything at this point, it's hard to debug without
knowing what the driver tties to do. One could check the traces to see
what registers it writes and try to check if those go off track anywhere
or maybe check the cirrus emulation in UAE which comes from an older QEMU
version but may have some patches missing from QEMU that is needed to get
it working. I wouldn't mind if somebody else debugged and fixed it, if
that does not happen I may look at it again later but it's very low
priority for me now.

Also the CLGD driver seems to work but has no error checking and the
emulated card does not behave as it expects and crashes without error.
Apparently it gets further with a card BIOS as it probably does not try to
init the card itself but expects the card option rom to be run by the
firmware to init the card and starts from there. With:

-device cirrus-vga,romfile=VGABIOS-lgpl-latest.cirrus.bin -d unimp

I eventually get errors saying:

cirrus: linear bitblt is not implemented

so it seems it might work but likely needs a bios and some patches from
UAE."

Tony Wilen has done this before for WinUae and could help make it possible under Qemu as well. But I think he will not be ready for that and BALATON Zoltan told me that he will not do it without help.

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V8 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 11-Apr-2023 9:01:51
#27 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 30-Mar-2022
Posts: 101
From: Unknown

@Maijestro
Tony Wilen has done this before for WinUae and could help make it possible under Qemu as well. But I think he will not be ready for that and BALATON Zoltan told me that he will not do it without help.[/quote]

It is open source.
If OS4 folks want this they can easily send patches to fix it to upstream.
If no one bothers to do a patch it just means that no one really cares enough to fix it.

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mac6 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 11-Apr-2023 16:51:38
#28 ]
Member
Joined: 12-Jan-2021
Posts: 20
From: Western Australia

This is great! I previously used the instructions from http://zero.eik.bme.hu/~balaton/qemu/amiga/ with mixed results (back when apple m1 first came out). I've always wondered about ATI GPU pass-through, has anyone done it successfully? E.g. with an ATI Radeon X1900?

Last edited by mac6 on 11-Apr-2023 at 05:06 PM.
Last edited by mac6 on 11-Apr-2023 at 05:01 PM.

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pavlor 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 13-Apr-2023 20:32:52
#29 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9494
From: Unknown

@Maijestro

Not an easy task. And even working CL emulation is too limited for today displays.


Other minor issues (some mentioned before):
1) NVRAM emulation (for automatic boot)
--- 2) SFS nad other filesystems support (according to a thread on amiga-news de "-cpu 7447" should solve this problem and provide some speed-up with AltiVec emulation - well, not much on my configuration; will test SFS during the weekend) --- "-cpu 7447" helps here
--- 3) Restart/shutdown is not working (freezes the guest), works on a real Pegasos II --- works in a newer release
+--4) My native screen resolution (1366x768) is not supported by SM501 emulation +-- 1280x768 works OK
5) The menu key is not recognized by Qemu as the right Amiga key - could be solved by keyboard layout settings, didn't try this yet
6) The Qemu build form an amiga-news thread has some issues with fullscreen (starting in fullscreen or entering fullscreen before the AmigaOS4.1 logo appears leads to a black screen/window; entering fullscreen after the logo appears works OK)

Edit: 2), 3) working
Edit: 4) using 1280x768

Last edited by pavlor on 14-Apr-2023 at 08:57 PM.
Last edited by pavlor on 14-Apr-2023 at 06:00 PM.

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Maijestro 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 13-Apr-2023 21:10:05
#30 ]
Member
Joined: 31-Mar-2023
Posts: 20
From: Unknown

@pavlor

Quote:

pavlor wrote:
@Maijestro

Not an easy task. And even working CL emulation is too limited for today displays.


Other minor issues (some mentioned before):
1) NVRAM emulation (for automatic boot)
2) SFS nad other filesystems support (according to a thread on amiga-news de "-cpu 7447" should solve this problem and provide some speed-up with AltiVec emulation - well, not much on my configuration; will test SFS during the weekend)
3) Restart/shutdown is not working (freezes the guest), works on a real Pegasos II
4) My native screen resolution (1366x768) is not supported by SM501 emulation
5) The menu key is not recognized by Qemu as the right Amiga key - could be solved by keyboard layout settings, didn't try this yet
6) The Qemu build form an amiga-news thread has some issues with fullscreen (starting in fullscreen or entering fullscreen before the AmigaOS4.1 logo appears leads to a black screen/window; entering fullscreen after the logo appears works OK)


For quitting under AmigaOs4.1 there is already a patch, how to use it you can see here:

https://osdn.net/projects/qmiga/scm/git/qemu/commits/6e5e911e2d6345ae158b9b686e583741cd3067ba

Just set a resolution which is also available under AmigaOs4.1, I use 1280x720 16bit on Host and Gast.

For the rest I have no solution. You can also write directly to the developer, it's easy to find his email and he will answer you, I'm not a developer, but Beta Testa.

There is a lot of interest already to make the Qemu Pegasos 2 emulation even better, but for that we all have to work together. Good is that you also own a real Pegasos2 then can help.

Here is a short video how the whole thing runs with the -cpu 7447 G4 under my machine.

YouTube: https://youtu.be/9M5r7TV8wDE

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Reth 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 13-Apr-2023 23:02:53
#31 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Jun-2005
Posts: 197
From: Germany

@Maijestro

For me installation is currently unfortunately not working. Wrote it in German at Amiga-News.de but also do here for the English community. All done inside Windows 11.

When starting the QEmu batch file I get the following errors:

Reading W83194 : FAILED.
Setting Front Side Bus to 133MHz... FAILED.

My file looks like this:
qemu-system-ppc -L pc-bios -M pegasos2 ^
-cpu 7447 ^
-bios pegasos2.rom ^
-vga none ^
-device sm501 ^
-drive if=none,id=cd,file=Peg2_AOS4.1FE.iso,format=raw ^
-device ide-cd,drive=cd,bus=ide.1 ^
-drive if=none,id=hd,file=hd.img,format=raw ^
-device ide-hd,drive=hd,bus=ide.0 ^
-device rtl8139,netdev=net0 ^
-netdev user,id=net0 ^
-rtc base=localtime ^
-serial stdio

Is there something I need to change here?


Also by trying to install AOS4.1 from the patched CD I always get the following error:
../Install-AmigaOS4.1: file is not executable
../Install-AmigaOS4.1: return code 10

When starting WB from patched Peg2 CD Image I get a crash on Ramlib and nothing else afterwards really works. System freezes. So I cannot install AOS4.1 from there either.

Any idea about how to get the installation done?

Thank you in advance!

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pavlor 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 14-Apr-2023 16:10:22
#32 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9494
From: Unknown

@Reth

Do you use qemu binary from emaculation site? That one gave me a Ramlib error.

Now, I use this version with only minor issues: Amiga-News.de forum (and even
more recent version)
New binaries are available also here: https://qemu.weilnetz.de/w64/
(will test during weekend)

I recommend to not use 1.2 rom configured in the included batch file (was not even able to boot with it).

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Maijestro 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 14-Apr-2023 22:47:09
#33 ]
Member
Joined: 31-Mar-2023
Posts: 20
From: Unknown

@pavlor

There are some changes regarding Qemu Pegasos 2, you should read this:

https://www.amigans.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?start=60&topic_id=8698&order=ASC&status=&mode=0

Since you own a real Pegasos could you help with your hardware to improve the project?

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pavlor 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 15-Apr-2023 8:19:01
#34 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9494
From: Unknown

@Maijestro

Quote:
Since you own a real Pegasos could you help with your hardware to improve the project?


I will gladly help, but I'm only somewhat experienced user, so my skills are limited. Just tell me what to do and it will be done.


I read posts about faster than WinUAE performance, sadly not a case on my host hardware - pure CPU benchmarks are nearly exactly as fast on both emulators. However, GFX speed and internet download speed of Qemu build I'm using right now are really nice in comparison to WinUAE/OS4.

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Maijestro 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 15-Apr-2023 17:59:42
#35 ]
Member
Joined: 31-Mar-2023
Posts: 20
From: Unknown

@pavlor


I would like to get back to you when it is ready, at the moment some patches/scripts are being written that need to be run under real hardware to get more information, it is about improving the firmware emulation and 2 gigabyte support.

Also this might be interesting for you it's about your keyboard layout problem...

https://lists.nongnu.org/archive/html/qemu-devel/2023-04/msg02190.html

And please don't expect Qemu to reach the level of an AmigaOne X5000 on your "old notebook", this can't work. But compared to WinUae some parts should already run better under AmigaOs4.1.


@All

I can only reiterate that help is needed to get the 3D support ready. Simple work has already started, just have a look at the documentation.

https://osdn.net/projects/qmiga/wiki/AmigaOSGfx

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pavlor 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 15-Apr-2023 18:46:34
#36 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9494
From: Unknown

@Maijestro

Quote:
I would like to get back to you when it is ready, at the moment some patches/scripts are being written that need to be run under real hardware to get more information, it is about improving the firmware emulation and 2 gigabyte support.


2 GB RAM do not work reliably on a real hardware. Lets hope emulation can improve upon it.

Quote:
Also this might be interesting for you it's about your keyboard layout problem...


Nice!

Quote:
And please don't expect Qemu to reach the level of an AmigaOne X5000 on your "old notebook", this can't work. But compared to WinUae some parts should already run better under AmigaOs4.1.


Qemu already overachieved my expectations (graphics speed), I didn't expect diference in CPU speed in comparison to WinUAE/OS4 (CPU emulation is mostly the same). If you want to try to stress your emulation by some harder "application benchmark", you may try the blender benchmark I added to post 21. Be warned, it may take dozens of minutes...

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Maijestro 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 15-Apr-2023 20:35:22
#37 ]
Member
Joined: 31-Mar-2023
Posts: 20
From: Unknown

@pavlor

Quote:

pavlor wrote:
@Maijestro

Qemu already overachieved my expectations (graphics speed), I didn't expect diference in CPU speed in comparison to WinUAE/OS4 (CPU emulation is mostly the same). If you want to try to stress your emulation by some harder "application benchmark", you may try the blender benchmark I added to post 21. Be warned, it may take dozens of minutes...


That's interesting, I'll run this benchmark test and share the result here later....

Thanks for the tip

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Reth 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 16-Apr-2023 1:38:07
#38 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Jun-2005
Posts: 197
From: Germany

@pavlor

Thank you. Version from Amiga-News.de forum worked for me too. So installation was done - but now I am struggling to boot from installed version. Did not manage that yet. Biggest problem seems to be the missing installation of the BOOT partition where for Peg2 the amigaboot.of but also the entire kickstart directory including the kicklayout file and loader.of is copied. That part of the installation does not show up at all when the installation script runs. Just copying over the amigaboot.of to the BOOT: partition does not help of course. When trying to boot the installed version via boot hd:0 amigaboot.of it just claims all the files to be missing from System/Kickstart/ (like loader.of, kernel, etc. etc.).

So dont know how to best solve it: Either creating a System/Kickstart/ directory at BOOT-partition and copy the appropriate kickstart folder from Peg2-CD-Image or what else to do.
Interestingly on my Peg2 CD (and hence its image) in both folders (so CD:Kickstart and CD:System/Kickstart/) the Kicklayout file contains all entries with syntax: "MODULE System/Kickstart/..." so neither one has "MODULE Kickstart/...".

ATM I got somewhat stuck. Got AOS4.1FE installed fine. Partitions are correct and also having correct filesystem IMHO (at least I followed the instructions from Amiga-New.de + the linked PDF for partitioning + the linked video) but no chance yet to boot the installed version. I only can boot from CD image.

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pavlor 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 16-Apr-2023 7:41:33
#39 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9494
From: Unknown

@Reth

I assume you modified both kicklayout files, right? Maybe you copied the same kicklayout file to both dorectories.

Copying amigaboot.of to boot partition manualy should work OK (I did it myself and it is also required for one of the later 4.1FE updates).

Boot sequence probably doesn't see a correct kicklayout file (expects files in System/Kickstart/ as in the wrong kicklayout file, but installation puts them to Kickstart/ - as in the correct kicklayout file).

Try rewrite the kicklayout file on your Sys: partition, so it has "MODULE Kickstart/..." in every entry. Note I think there may be some differences between both original kicklayout files on the CD, but this rewrite should allow you to boot from the HDD. Best would be to copy the correct kicklayout file (in CD0:System/Kickstart/) from the unmodified CD to Sys:Kickstart, then modify this file to support SM502/PCIGraphics.

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Reth 
Re: Tutorial: Installation guide for AmigaOS 4.1 under QEMU 8
Posted on 16-Apr-2023 20:17:56
#40 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Jun-2005
Posts: 197
From: Germany

@pavlor

I figured my mistake. I had the CD Image patched wrongly. I accidentially copied the same version of the kicklayout file to both locations (Kickstart and System/Kickstart) which broke things eventually.
Was my stupid and dumb mistake. :)

Now it works and I can finally boot from HD. But whenever I have the Peg2CD image also as part of my starting batch file of QEmu and try to boot from HD it just reads the kickstart from HD BOOT partition but then still boots from CD. Maybe due to boot priority, missing NVRAM settings of the Peg2 BIOS or due to the fact that CD and HD have same folder structure (or anything else).

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