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Amigaworld.net News   Amigaworld.net News : Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
   posted by amigakit on 22-Mar-2016 17:13:35 (35943 reads)


Introducing Warp3D Nova
Shader based 3D graphics are finally a reality!

A-EON Technology Ltd is pleased to announce that a native 3D Shader-based API has been developed for OS4. Warp3D Nova has been the result of over nine months of hard work by graphics guru and AmigaDeveloper.com Team member, Hans De Ruiter. It offers significant opportunities for exciting advancements in 3D software running on the AmigaOS4 platform.



Why is Nova needed?

The original Warp3D API is over a decade old, and as a consequence, is not based around Shader technology and many related functions that modern graphics cards support. Modern 3D engines require Shaders and having this support on OS4 will remove more obstacles to porting games and applications from other platforms. To further ease porting from other systems, we have contracted Daniel Muessener (GoldenCode.eu) to develop an OpenGL ES 2.0 wrapper for the new Warp3D Nova.

In addition to the coding talents of Daniel, we have been in contact with other prominent 3D developers from across the Amiga community and provided them with early access to the software.


Warp3D Nova Features:

● A modern shader-based 3D graphics API for use by 3D software running on the AmigaOS 4 platform
● Supports vertex and fragment (pixel) shaders giving developers great freedom over lighting models, effects, vertex transformations, etc.
● Hardware accelerated Transformation, Clipping & Lighting (TCL) is implicitly supported (programmed via shaders)
● Uses the SPIR-V standard for shaders. A GLSL to SPIR-V compiler is included
● All rendering is done via Vertex Buffer Objects (VBOs) which can be stored in VRAM for high performance Render state stored in Render State Objects (RSOs). Having no global state avoids state thrashing, and allows multi-threaded rendering. Note: While there's no global state, a default RSO is allocated for convenience
● Includes an SDK with everything needed to start writing apps & games including examples ranging from querying hardware capabilities through to per-pixel lighting with normal mapping
● Can co-exist with the original Warp3D-SI & MiniGL

Special thanks go to Andy Broad for developing the glslangValidator tool.

Thanks also go to Kevin Saunders for the Warp3D Nova logo design and 3D modelling.

Warp3D Nova running under AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition on an AmigaOne X1000: click here



Warp3D Nova libraries, SDK and tools
    

STORYID: 7687
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PosterThread
amigakit 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 10:36:13
#141 ]
Amiga Kit
Joined: 28-Jun-2004
Posts: 2494
From: www.amigakit.com

The black icons were designed for us by the talented icons guru, Mason. We are very grateful for the hours of work he devoted to them. They will feature on AmigaDeveloper.com team releases including the forthcoming Enhancer Software.


_________________
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Massi 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 10:36:44
#142 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 2-Feb-2011
Posts: 627
From: Rome, Italy

I couldn' t find whether it is for free or not, any idea?


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pavlor 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 10:39:27
#143 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9526
From: Unknown

@Massi

I bet it is commercial product. No release for free.

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Massi 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 10:55:49
#144 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 2-Feb-2011
Posts: 627
From: Rome, Italy

@pavlor

Quote:
I bet it is commercial product. No release for free.


Then I am curious about its price.


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pavlor 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 10:57:24
#145 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9526
From: Unknown

@Massi

Quote:
Then I am curious about its price.


I expect in the same league as Warp3D SI.

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BSzili 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 11:25:08
#146 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 446
From: Unknown

@Hans
Quote:
I'm not familiar enough with the R200 to give a breakdown of what it could and couldn't support.
Some basic details:
vertex shaders:
- Up to 128 instructions long
- Only 12 registers, and no memory access
fragment shaders:
- Up to 22 instructions

Neither shaders can handle the full GLSL repertoire (e.g., the Radeon X800 can't do proper for loops, so I doubt that R200 GPUs can either). That's a lot of restrictions, and it's no surprise that ATI never released GLSL support.

Even ARB assembly was kind-of dodgy on R200, I hardly think anyone could write a GLSL compiler for it, even for the oldest standard.
The X1800 (R500) had a new architecture, and it definitely had a working GLSL shader compiler (although a very buggy one, thanks to ATi), so that could be a possible upgrade path for old motherboards. Plus it works with MorphOS too, for those who want to run both on a Peg2. Who wants to write a driver for it? :)


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This is just like television, only you can see much further.

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pavlor 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 11:40:02
#147 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9526
From: Unknown

@BSzili

X1800 (R500) works in Pegasos 2? I thought there was firmware limitation for anything higher than R300.

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gregthecanuck 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 13:14:10
#148 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 30-Dec-2003
Posts: 846
From: Vancouver, Canada

I can sort-of understand the "obsession" with getting older Radeon cards working with Nova. But with the low user base and the actual developer time/cost involved an attempt to support older cards just doesn't make sense.

Provide a software/hardware bundle at a subsidized price. I suspect it would be much less expensive and more expedient to offer discounted up to date graphic cards than try to sink money into drivers for near-obsolete cards.

I have used a similar method to get some of my clients to dump old versions of server hardware. It was costing me $$ to keep supporting the development toolchain, porting costs, etc... Was better to just give the customer a deal on their maintenance to push them to upgrade. Everybody wins.

For users without PCI-e slots I provided a link to an adapter that may solve that issue, but it is untested as far as I can tell, so give it maybe a 50% chance of working.

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BSzili 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 13:28:24
#149 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 446
From: Unknown

@pavlor
Quote:
X1800 (R500) works in Pegasos 2? I thought there was firmware limitation for anything higher than R300.

Ooch, you are right. I forgot that these cards use PCI-e to AGP bridges. So much for having a least common denominator on the Pegasos.


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BSzili 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 13:34:20
#150 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 446
From: Unknown

@gregthecanuck
Quote:

I can sort-of understand the "obsession" with getting older Radeon cards working with Nova. But with the low user base and the actual developer time/cost involved an attempt to support older cards just doesn't make sense.

Provide a software/hardware bundle at a subsidized price. I suspect it would be much less expensive and more expedient to offer discounted up to date graphic cards than try to sink money into drivers for near-obsolete cards.

I have used a similar method to get some of my clients to dump old versions of server hardware. It was costing me $$ to keep supporting the development toolchain, porting costs, etc... Was better to just give the customer a deal on their maintenance to push them to upgrade. Everybody wins.

For users without PCI-e slots I provided a link to an adapter that may solve that issue, but it is untested as far as I can tell, so give it maybe a 50% chance of working.

I'd happily dump my Radeon 9250 if I had something else that works, but Pegasos II / Sam 440 / AmigaOne XE/Micro users doesn't have a lot of choice. Maybe adding a Radeon HD card using the PCI-e to PCI adapter as a secondary card could work? I know it does in PowerMac G5s under Linux. I'll have to ask Hans about this.


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Spectre660 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 13:43:09
#151 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 4-Jun-2005
Posts: 3918
From: Unknown

@BSzili

Currently only the Sam440ep-itx (with unreleased Uboot) and Sam440ep-flex.
Radeon HD 7750 card did not work when I tried with a Sam440ep-Flex 2 years ago.
May need a Uboot update. Cards up to Radeon HD 6000 series do work.

http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=36053&forum=14&start=140&viewmode=flat&order=0#759758


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Tomppeli 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 14:11:05
#152 ]
Super Member
Joined: 18-Jun-2004
Posts: 1649
From: Home land of Santa, sauna, sisu and salmiakki

Quote:
I'd happily dump my Radeon 9250 if I had something else that works, but Pegasos II / Sam 440 / AmigaOne XE/Micro users doesn't have a lot of choice. Maybe adding a Radeon HD card using the PCI-e to PCI adapter as a secondary card could work?

I was testing and using HD2400 PCI card in A1-SE years ago. But that model doesn't have Warp3D support.


_________________
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"Anyone can build a fast CPU. The trick is to build a fast system." -Seymour Cray

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QuBe 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 14:23:15
#153 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Dec-2006
Posts: 1073
From: Dunes of Uridia

Well done guys, this is a really big deal for the Amiga. Another step forward. Congrats to all involved.

Q!

"i am home"

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kyle 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 18:21:46
#154 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 15-Oct-2006
Posts: 866
From: Livorno, Italy

Great work Hans, thank you!

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Hans 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 20:42:17
#155 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 27-Dec-2003
Posts: 5047
From: New Zealand

@lylehaze

Quote:
If I am curious about how to write a program that uses this, but I'm not yet ready to ask for the SDK, what would you suggest I could read or study to learn about this?

GLSL is what you'll be using to write the shaders, so have a look at that.

Quote:
Finally, The recenly passed Christmas saw my stock 4000 series graphics card replaced with a "R9280X". My music scrolls (fairly) smoothly towards the clef already. I wonder if (either)Warp could help me scroll more smoothly in 2D, or how a 3D option might affect the render?

Warp3D Nova can quite comfortably be used for 2D. There's even a mode that will disable frustum clipping and give you a plain 2D coordinate system (so no rescaling needed).

I agree with broadblues that CompositeTags() should be your first port of call with 2D, though. Use Warp3D Nova for effects/processing that the graphics library doesn't do.

Talking about 2D uses, here are two that I'd like to see:
- Accelerate AmiVNC by using shaders to detect changes on the GPU (so that only changed areas get copied to RAM
- Do the same for SRec, but also use Warp3D Nova to perform RGB => YUV420p conversion on the GPU

Hans


_________________
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https://keasigmadelta.com/ - More of my work.

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Hans 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 25-Mar-2016 21:04:23
#156 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 27-Dec-2003
Posts: 5047
From: New Zealand

@BSzili
Quote:
I'd happily dump my Radeon 9250 if I had something else that works, but Pegasos II / Sam 440 / AmigaOne XE/Micro users doesn't have a lot of choice. Maybe adding a Radeon HD card using the PCI-e to PCI adapter as a secondary card could work? I know it does in PowerMac G5s under Linux. I'll have to ask Hans about this.

Unfortunately, the Pegasos II firmware doesn't look behind a PCI-to-PCI(e) bridge, so it doesn't even detect the card. If someone could get there hands on the firmware's source-code, then maybe this could be fixed. Fixing the firmware would definitely be easier than writing an R300 driver (which I think is AGP 2x compatible, and does *NOT* use a PCI-to-PCIe bridge).

Sam440 machines can use PCI-to-PCIe adaptors, but I've been told that UBoot doesn't like Southern Islands GPUs. Spectre660 will be able to tell you more.

As for the A1-XE/micro. I used an A1-XE without the DMA fix for initial development of the Radeon HD driver. No idea if it still works. The DMA fix (both XE and micro) causes lockups.

@gregthecanuck
Quote:
Provide a software/hardware bundle at a subsidized price. I suspect it would be much less expensive and more expedient to offer discounted up to date graphic cards than try to sink money into drivers for near-obsolete cards.

Yes, I also think that it would be less expensive.

Hans


_________________
http://hdrlab.org.nz/ - Amiga OS 4 projects, programming articles and more. Home of the RadeonHD driver for Amiga OS 4.x project.
https://keasigmadelta.com/ - More of my work.

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eder 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 26-Mar-2016 7:49:53
#157 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Mar-2004
Posts: 280
From: Unknown

Great, finaly a reason to get rid of my peg2 and buy a x5000.

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hotrod 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 26-Mar-2016 10:15:12
#158 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Mar-2003
Posts: 2988
From: Stockholm, Sweden

Regarding the Radeon 9250, can it be used at all to speed up scrolling and video playback in browsers? That would be a very nice boost to have on any machine.

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TRIPOS 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 26-Mar-2016 10:29:08
#159 ]
Super Member
Joined: 4-Apr-2014
Posts: 1204
From: Unknown

@eder

Quote:
Great, finaly a reason to get rid of my peg2 and buy a x5000.


What reason?

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TRIPOS 
Re: Introducing Warp3D Nova for OS4
Posted on 26-Mar-2016 10:30:36
#160 ]
Super Member
Joined: 4-Apr-2014
Posts: 1204
From: Unknown

Quote:
Regarding the Radeon 9250, can it be used at all to speed up ... video playback in browsers?


Yes.

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