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Amigaworld.net News   Amigaworld.net News : Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
   posted by DaveyD on 1-Sep-2003 15:26:50 (6292 reads)
Session 18 of the Fortnightly Questions and Answers sessions with Amiga's Chief Technology Officer Fleecy Moss are now online.

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GadgetMaster 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 2-Sep-2003 23:14:10
#21 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 26-Dec-2002
Posts: 566
From: TrustVille

Hey falemagn !

Nobody around here is challenging you or your chosen platform.

I think you have the wrong idea about the users of this site.

Being interested in a certain technology whilst preferring to be non-confrontational does not automatically amount to being an "Angry Red Troll" who is just waiting to pounce on anything Morph related.

I respect the efforts of programmers on both sides. It's only hardware and software at the end of the day.

Nothing religious or "CHOSEN" about it.

Take a chill pill, relax.


_________________
Cheesy Smile of the century

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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 2-Sep-2003 23:22:24
# ]



Hmmm, I don't like this... falemagn simply states some technological facts and every one her ejumps down his throat.

What's the point?

IF you can't handle the truth, don't read the facts.

 
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Messiah 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 1:41:13
#23 ]

Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 102
From: Unknown

facts???

opinions and assumptions isnt realy part of what I would call facts, then again what do I know I only work on AG2

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Bodie_CI5 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 1:44:08
#24 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Jul-2003
Posts: 6739
From: Unknown

@ messiah



(I think the above sums up my feelings :P)


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CodeSmith 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 7:32:22
#25 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 3045
From: USA

@drebben:
Fabio has worded his facts in such a way as to arouse an emotional response, that's why people reacted in an emotional way to him. I could say there's a generic term for posts worded in this way, but I won't. Some examples:

In other words, every visual device will be treated in an homogeneous way, like windows does with GDI.

Sure, bring up the OS we all love to hate. Well, Windows is not the only computer to do this - the NeXT cube does this exact same thing with its display postscript, and I bet lots of other OSs do so too.

Was all that "buzziness" really necessary? I sense an attempt at making people go "woooow, I don't know what he said but it sounds so coool" there.

woooow, did this guy just waltz in here and insult all of us? coooool...

Also, I don't know if you guys noticed, but all he's saying is basically that the old APIs are being put in the trashcan

There's a nice image - take the APIs we all like, and throw them in the bin.

I can't help but notice the hypocricy that permeates this whole situation: how can they even dare to criticize the boxed approach of MOS, if they are basically going the same way?

woooow, he insulted us AGAIN! cooool... btw, this "how can they even dare" thing just shows his "my #### is bigger than yours" attitude. Feel the rage, baby.

But, hey, "they have two kernels, it MUST be bad, there's only one true exec!". Yes, right, whatever.

Who the hell ever said THAT!?!

I guess I probably shouldn't, but here is my lame contribution to this lame argument:
so, when is the Q-Box ever going to be finished? all I hear from the MOS crowd is (admittedly deserved) criticism about how the Amiga's unprotected memory causes loads of problems, but I have yet to hear about solid effort being put into making the Q-Box as functional as the A-Box. If that were the case, wouldn't all new MOS software be written for the Q-Box? after all, the A-Box is unstable, but it's just so ppl can run their old stuff, right?

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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 7:38:48
# ]



Quote:
opinions and assumptions isnt realy part of what I would call facts, then again what do I know I only work on AG2


Yeah, sure you do!

Go on then, give us the facts....


Did you know that I work for IBM, and I invented a reality distortion field... but we sold it to apple

 
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CodeSmith 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 7:40:46
#27 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 3045
From: USA

I think a piece of it got stuck on your hat...

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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 7:45:43
# ]



Don't be a twonk, of course he said Windows!!! every one uses windows, it's just about as widspread as possible... NeXT.... hands up here who's using a NeXT box?

If you make a new API... then what are you doing? don't worry, I'll answer that... putting the old API in the bin. That's right you are gettign rid of it. He even said that he thought AG2 was a good idea, but you just had to jump down his throat probably cos he said a naughty word.... ooooooo... MorphOS....

Who gives a crap about QBox?

Quote:
woooow, he insulted us AGAIN! cooool... btw, this "how can they even dare" thing just shows his "my #### is bigger than yours" attitude. Feel the rage, baby.


You must have something missing in your head? Since when did posing a question become an insult?

I agree some of my reality distortion field must be stuck to my Hat since I can't believe what I'm seeing here.

 
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CodeSmith 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 8:00:07
#29 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 3045
From: USA

Don't be a twonk, of course he said Windows!!! every one uses windows, it's just about as widspread as possible... NeXT.... hands up here who's using a NeXT box?

I must admit to never having met a twonk, but I suspect they're not very smart... anyway, hands up here, who wants to see Bill Gates tarred and feathered? how about Steve Jobs?

If you make a new API... then what are you doing? don't worry, I'll answer that... putting the old API in the bin. That's right you are gettign rid of it. He even said that he thought AG2 was a good idea, but you just had to jump down his throat probably cos he said a naughty word.... ooooooo... MorphOS....

Well, there's something people do to old APIs when they make a replacement for it, it's called phasing out. I don't think anyone here particularly thinks MorphOS is a naughty word (BTW, I think the 'o' key is stuck on your keyboard), it's just another OS. Some of its proponents are a bunch of twonks, but the OS itself is probably OK.

Who gives a crap about QBox?

Well, let's see... those crazy guys running MorphOS.net seem to
"The core functions of the OS, also called the QBox, include new API's that are under development, which will provide a step up from the classic APIs while running side by side with the classic APIs. This is how MorphOS plans it's migration for the future, new APIs running alongside the classic software without limiting the potential of either."

Since when did posing a question become an insult?
It's not the question, it's the delivery... "how can you even dare" to ask such a thing?

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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 8:11:21
# ]



Steve and Bill? Sure, I'd pay to see that.

I see no problem with depreciating an API... But why reinvent the wheel... twice? And then again just for the hell of it....

There was a staple stuck under the key.

I still don't care about the Qbox, try harder.

Living and working in England, I know that that phrase is never regarded as an insult. I use it al the time.

 
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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 8:35:57
# ]



OT:

If you want to bring MorphOS into MorphOS unrelated threads, do it here

If you want to flame/stereotype on about what you think other people think and feel, do it here

If you want to rave on about freedom of speech and how innocent unrelated flamatory questions are, do it here

If you don't know the meaning of "It's not about what you say, it's about how and when you say it" then stay at this place

If you want to troll and otherwise seek negative reactions from other people, do it here

If you can't keep your mind on anything else but what AmigaInc and associated has or hasn't been saying or doing then stay at this place

/Björn

 
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Bodie_CI5 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 8:41:35
#32 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 29-Jul-2003
Posts: 6739
From: Unknown

LOL orgin, that was bloody brilliant!


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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 9:12:22
# ]



@drebben

Firstly Id like to second, nay third what Orgin said.

Secondly Id like to call you out on this re-invent the wheel stuff.

Do you actually know what Q/Box is? What came first? Who is re-inventing the wheel? Perhaps we should all be using ENAIC because everything else is re-inventing the wheel.

Finally Id like to point out that Messiah is an employee of Amiga Inc and has been working on the AG2 technology for some time.

You also do not work for IBM, I checked that in BluePages this morning. The only reality distortion field is Im afraid politicos such as yourself who believe that "facts" are what Fabio put in his posts.

Coming from England I know what "Twonk" means, it means someone who is mentally challenged, although I heard it first on Red Dwarf many moons ago it is actually quote commonly used in Birmingham.

You saw fit to demonstrate clear as a bell that you had failed to read diddly squat of what was put in the thread by posting this: "he said a naughty word.... ooooooo... MorphOS....". You should also steer clear of suggesting that people have things missing in their heads. Resorting this personal suggests you are out of your depth and, well, looking to cause trouble for the sake of it. Neither are welcome on AmigaWorld. I don't know if you have been warned by a moderator, but I guess you need to tone it down a bit before you are.

Now you had your 10 minutes of fame, how about you troll along to ANN? I certainly will be skipping over posts with your name in future and Im sure Im not the only one.

 
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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 13:53:27
# ]



Quote:

facts???

opinions and assumptions isnt realy part of what I would call facts, then again what do I know I only work on AG2


I merely pointed out 2 facts, certainly not opinions.

Fact 1:

Fleecy has used a lot of buzzwords to describe what in essence is a very simple concept, already implemented in various operating systems. The only reason for doing that is to make unattentive people drool and generate some hype. If you have any other plausible explanation, feel free to provide it to me, otherwise just accept that this is a fact.

Fact 2:

AG2, from the descriptions so far provided (you can't blame me for basing my thoughts on the details you are providing), sounds like being a cool thing, only it's going to be something totally different from what people have been used so far. All I did was pointing this fact out, and comparing it with the MOS approach: both OSs decided it was better to diverge from the way things are currently done in AOS (which is a good thing, imo), thus I find higly ipocrite do criticize MOS and applaude AmigaOS for the same reasons.

I've seen a lot of bold claims about the boxed approach for MOS coming from you guys, and provided you, in other places, with explanations of why they are bold and why they are nonsense. If you want I can repeat it here.

There are no opinions here, only reasonings. You can argue I'm wrong, but then you have to prove it.

 
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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 13:57:14
# ]



@Fabio

So, if its your opinion, its fact and people have to prove otherwise, but if its someone elses opinion, they have to prove themselves right?

This is a fact:

Quote:
Fleecy has used a lot of buzzwords to describe what in essence is a very simple concept


This is conjecture on your part, aka opinion:
Quote:

The only reason for doing that is to make unattentive people drool and generate some hype. If you have any other plausible explanation, feel free to provide it to me, otherwise just accept that this is a fact


Unless you can start to learn to differentiate between them don't expect people to take you seriously.


[quote]

 
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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 14:07:13
# ]



Quote:
Fabio has worded his facts in such a way as to arouse an emotional response, that's why people reacted in an emotional way to him. I could say there's a generic term for posts worded in this way, but I won't. Some examples:


You are putting on me the responsibility for other people's reaction. It's not my fault if people react emotionally, I explicitely asked to give me a non emotional response.

Quote:

In other words, every visual device will be treated in an homogeneous way, like windows does with GDI.

Sure, bring up the OS we all love to hate. Well, Windows is not the only computer to do this - the NeXT cube does this exact same thing with its display postscript, and I bet lots of other OSs do so too.


That's a perfect example of what I wrote above: is it my fault if you decided to see in my words an attempt at stirring troubles just because I mentioned windows? That's called "paranoia", if you ask me. Windows just happened to be the first example I could think of, the real point I tried to get across was the "fuzziness" part, which you took as an offense (see below).

Quote:

Was all that "buzziness" really necessary? I sense an attempt at making people go "woooow, I don't know what he said but it sounds so coool" there.

woooow, did this guy just waltz in here and insult all of us? coooool...


In what way I insulted "all of you"? I just criticized Fleecy's wording and behaviour, do you feel so attached to him to take the thing so personally? And is it forbidded to criticize Fleecy for the things he says and the way he says it?


Quote:
Also, I don't know if you guys noticed, but all he's saying is basically that the old APIs are being put in the trashcan

There's a nice image - take the APIs we all like, and throw them in the bin.


A colorite wording, I admit it, and so what? Would have it been any better if I said "dismissed"? The end result is the same, and that's the point you should have focused on, it's not my fault if you decided to jump on the word "trashcan", instead.
Quote:
I can't help but notice the hypocricy that permeates this whole situation: how can they even dare to criticize the boxed approach of MOS, if they are basically going the same way?

woooow, he insulted us AGAIN! cooool... btw, this "how can they even dare" thing just shows his "my #### is bigger than yours" attitude. Feel the rage, baby.


You clearly have some problems with people having different opinions than yours, and exposing them not in the softest language. Please, don't blame me for this your problem, try to solve it instead.

Quote:
But, hey, "they have two kernels, it MUST be bad, there's only one true exec!". Yes, right, whatever.

Who the hell ever said THAT!?!


They, of course, although with different words. Perhaps the quoting mislead you, I wasn't quoting them word by word, I used the quoting just to emphatize the message.

 
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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 14:18:39
# ]



@Fabio

Man walks into an Irish pub. Sayes, "look guys, I want a non emotional response to this."

"Irish people are hypocritical ####s! The Irish PM deliberately obfuscates to sound interesting! The Irish should just give up, we did it all in Greece first! The Irish make stupid claims about Greeks!"

Note I see no emotional response to you, just questions as to why you think your posting consituted reasonable behavior.

You are right now way OT, you have failed to substantiate your claims for which you use as a basis to call Fleecy and Amiga Inc hypocrite, you are coming across as arrogant as hell and seem to be angling for moderation - probably just so you can go and bleat on ANN about how "biased" and "unable to cope with facts" AmigaWorld.net readers are.

We have heard it and seen it done a million times over, this isn't my site, I am not a moderator, but give it a rest - you are fooling no one here.

Given that you are this OT, and you clearly feel the need to talk about it, why don't you PM the people involved in the discussion with you, email etc?

 
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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 14:27:11
# ]



Go to Ann? hell I came from there, fed up with all the trolling against Amiga inc. But comming here has turned out to be worse!!

I thought, that I might find a better calss of person. But as soon as any one says anything interesting or states adn facts that don't fit with your personall lines... everyone starts screaming RED TROLL!!!

This is so sad, the Amiga community used to be such a great place, now it just seems to be a bunch of names callers and people who can't see past their own limited understanding.

I have not recieved a warning froma moderator yet, and fankly I don't see whay I should, since I'm not using inappropriate language, no personall attacks, I'm certainly not trolling for newbies... lighten up, this should be about what we all have in common not about how one group can score points off another.


I expect I'll have to look for another Amiga site now, because this one just has too much hate

 
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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 14:32:12
# ]



Quote:

So, if its your opinion, its fact and people have to prove otherwise, but if its someone elses opinion, they have to prove themselves right?


When did I state that? I reported facts, you can't argue with them. I also reasoned, not exposed opinions. Opnion would be "I think that...", reasoning is "given these facts, we conclude that...". Now, all I said is that you can argue that my reasonings are wrong, but then provide me with an explanation of why they are wrong, just like I provide you with an explanation of why i think they are right.


Quote:

This is a fact:

Quote:
Fleecy has used a lot of buzzwords to describe what in essence is a very simple concept



That is a negative fact, is it not? Using buzzwords to explain to your customers what your product does is a negative thing.

Quote:

This is conjecture on your part, aka opinion:

Quote:
The only reason for doing that is to make unattentive people drool and generate some hype. If you have any other plausible explanation, feel free to provide it to me, otherwise just accept that this is a fact



I invited him to provide me with a different explanation. Do you have one? If not, do you think mine is bad? If yes, why? If not, why are you arguing?

See? There's a lot you have to do to contraddict me, you can't just say "you're wrong", please contribute to the dicussion in a constructive way and explain why I am wrong: I'm perfectly ready to take it back if you prove I'm wrong.


Quote:
Unless you can start to learn to differentiate between them don't expect people to take you seriously.


Thanks, but a lot of people take me seriously already, and this your "suggestion" only goes to prove how full of yourself you are. I mean, I bet you yourself would find it arrogant generalizing like that, if I had done it.

 
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Anonymous 
Re: Fortnightly Q&A with Fleecy Moss - Session 18
Posted on 3-Sep-2003 14:33:37
# ]



Drebben

Im looking for the hate you claim and can only see it in you, and Fabio.

I have pointed out your personal attacks above, so don't come the innocent.

If you had actually said something pertinent, laced with a bit of the old jousting I wouldn't have batted an eyelid.

Looking through your posting history, I see an attack on Ray Akey moderated down, I see sarcastic remarks on the "hyperion" thread.

Are you a red troll? Where are people screaming "Red Troll"?

Where are the "name callers" and the people of "limited understanding"?

Looks again like you are doing just what you are complaining about.

Fabio is doing his best to turn this into an "Amiga Inc evil hypocrits and so is anyone that doesn't choose MorphOS" advocate bit that we have seen for years on ANN. You are basically trying to lend his rants credibility by calling them "facts" and deliberately miscategorising the discussion so far as people leaping on anyone saying "MorphOS".

People are asking you, if you want to start fires, to go elsewhere. If you want to debate civilly, without trying to make personal remarks or score points, stick about. No one here gives a toss what you discuss so long as its on topic.

As for trolling for newbies? Yet more diversionary tactics. Please, don't take us for idiots.

 
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