@Laser

I agree ive been using mag for over 5 years cant remember what os 3.9 is like and how to use it

Magellan rocks

@Laser

I didn't like DOpus mag either when I first installed it, and promptly removed it. However a period later I did give it another go, and although it is still installed on my system, I never use it as a WB replacement. I still prefer using Opus 4 on my WB3.9 over Magellan.

That is not to say Opus Mag isn't good, it is just I preferred the simpler basic file lister approach. Also in light of it not being developed further, and with some of the features of it finding their way into the WB as it updated, the necessity for running Opus Magellan was diminished.

Some people have stated that things like listers should be in the OS and they wouldn't buy AOS4 otherwise. The thing they have to remember is AOS4 is a remake of the actual operating system, not the GUI (Workbench). Refinements to Workbench will take place in the future (as has been stated in the past), but it is not a priority right now. The problem is people forget to disassociate the OS and Workbench and assume they are one and the same (I blame Windows for that mentality).

_________________
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Hyperion acquired the rights to port DOpus Magellan to AmigaOS 4 a few years back. Last time I disussed that with Ben Hermans (many moons ago) it was not decided yet it if it would be included with the OS or distributed as a seperate commercial product. Either way, it will be available for OS 4 sooner or later.

I don't think any work has been put into a port yet, they probably were way to busy playing Quake er.. developing OS4.

@kgrach

"Most of the things you list are in 3.5 and 3.9 already and quite easily could be set up in less time than you spent configuring Dopus."

I am not a huge user of Dopus. The one thing that I am using it for is the ftp. I have found it useful to use the listes. Like from my hd and the ftp site. I then can copy file back and forth. I would like to see and ftp server in OS 4 and then be able to us WB with it. Just my thoughts.

@kgrach

I really loved Magellan II. But I still agree with the guys that think that WB3.9 can do (mostly) everything that Dopus can. But let's face it; Dopus listers rule!

To get that kind of functionallity you'd have to patch Workbench beyond recognition. In Dopus I can transparantlly drag or open a file from a ftp, right-click on a file and do whatever I want. Drag a file to another lister and *Baam* it's pgp-uncrypted and extracted with lha.

That I like.


I really hope Hyerion get Magellan ported/integrated with OS4.x

/shoe

@kgrach


I imagine you could do anything in directly that DOpus can do, but not nearly as easily. FTP being one good example.

I'm a big fan of DO. The reason being that I started programming computers using toggle switches on the front panel of DEC PDP8 computers. We saved our programs to paper tape.

To make a long story short, I've done all the typed commands I ever want to do. The point of computers is to make life easier, so why not use a program that makes all that stuff easier. DO is worth every cent it costs. I also have it on the PC.

Funny, I've never had problems with DO.

@AV

Quote:

@royleith Quote: If listers are frelled, then DOpus is of no use as far as I am concerned. I see this as a major loss. Working with 3.9 and in text mode is no alternative to listers. It's a major loss allright, but it's not OS4 fault.

I cannot agree, more. It wasn't 3.9's fault that Mag had a few niggles, either.

With UAE 6.0 I have decided to run DOpus-free to get used, once more, to living without it. The first day has been like wading through treacle, especially as I am having to reinstate user-startup and want to select the file in a lister and click Edit. I wanted to run a script file to get the assigns and stuff right for editors. I knew I wanted to give it a 'script' property, but did not have my Dopus button! I had to hunt through the DOS handbook to find out how to do it. Then I had to remember where the shell command was hidden.

I am getting there, but in the good old days I would have been up and running in a couple of hours. Now I feel like a Linux newbie.

I am crossing my fingers that Hyperion decide to produce a native version for OS4.0. I'll pay, guys, I really will.

Regards
Roy Leith

@AV

Quote:

@royleith Quote: If listers are frelled, then DOpus is of no use as far as I am concerned. I see this as a major loss. Working with 3.9 and in text mode is no alternative to listers. It's a major loss allright, but it's not OS4 fault.

I cannot agree, more. It wasn't 3.9's fault that Mag had a few niggles, either.

With UAE 6.0 I have decided to run DOpus-free to get used, once more, to living without it. The first day has been like wading through treacle, especially as I am having to reinstate user-startup and want to select the file in a lister and click Edit. I wanted to run a script file to get the assigns and stuff right for editors. I knew I wanted to give it a 'script' property, but did not have my Dopus button! I had to hunt through the DOS handbook to find out how to do it. Then I had to remember where the shell command was hidden.

I am getting there, but in the good old days I would have been up and running in a couple of hours. Now I feel like a Linux newbie.

I am crossing my fingers that Hyperion decide to produce a native version for OS4.0. I'll pay, guys, I really will.

Regards
Roy Leith

@_Steve_

Quote:

Some people have stated that things like listers should be in the OS and they wouldn't buy AOS4 otherwise. The thing they have to remember is AOS4 is a remake of the actual operating system, not the GUI (Workbench).

I agree with your distinction. The OS is not the graphical operating environment. In fact, by separating the two you permit the user to select among many OE's to find one to suit their taste. Third parties can quite readily play with the look and feel of GUI systems, whereas the insides of the OS are what I'd hope Hyperion have spent their time improving.

However... It is important to have a decent, usable and powerful GUI for when someone "tries out" the system. It may not be entirely to everyone's taste, but it's got to be reasonably good enough to allow them to feel the potential. I think the general proposed look for OS4 goes some way to address this (compared to a default OS3.1), but how much of the actual functionality has changed I am not sure.

As a direct example, I used to be one of those users who could not live without the Shell. As soon as I wanted to do anything more complicated than run a program or copy a file, I would open up a shell and do it using the command line. I still have my Shell icon sitting ready, I still have assorted custom scripts, but now I hardly ever use it. I've found that the presence of Mag II (now I've set it up to my liking) simply removes the need to resort to the shell for all but the most occasional tasks.

I should point out that I used (and liked) DOpus 4 and it's traditional filemanager style for many years. At least 80% of the "good bits" of Mag II could be addressed by bundling a competent filemanager with the OS. However, the integration of Mag II in WB-replacement mode, and the "infinite" listers concept just adds that extra something that stops me reaching for the CLI. MS Windows has gone much the same way, with almost all manipulation operations being done in a variant of Explorer, the desktop being little more than pretty pictures. I'd hope the Amiga concept of giving more power to the user, and the use of the very flexible-sounding dock program could make the experience even better.

@Laser

The Shell is mightier than the WB .

From the early days it became apparent the Workbench was rather limited. In came the freeware/shareware/commercial file managers. I used extensively/played with/customised to death most of them. Too many to remember. Most of them focused to file management and application launching. BrowserII changed my thinking of whether a workbench replacement could be useful. And despite my lukewarm first reaction to DOpus 5.11 (maybe because I never liked DOpus4), I became thrilled with its potential and addicted by version 5.5.
DOpus Magellan is indispensable to Workbench, at least for me. Having to live without it is like browsing WWW on a peecee without Opera, fixing a bad disk without disksalv, tv zapping without a remote control, ...

@cgutjahr

Edited

Found an answer for my question from the dopus ml itself (there is no dopus).

Edit Part II

If anyone still interested for dopus please read this: Dopus for sale

@itix

Quote:

If anyone still interested for dopus please read this: Dopus for sale

Thanks for the post. I do hope that someone will be able to buy it.

Hi,

Greg Perry once said he would not program for the Amiga until OS 4 actually arrived.

Given the amount of time it took him to port DirOpus to the PC and the number of bugs he had to squash to get it running well on the PC he might very well find it attractive to port back to the Amiga (tends to take a lot less time and work better).

As you have just demonstrated he also has a loyal following for the Amiga... he could easily build on that (existing customers).

DirOpus was originally meant to be part of OS4 (Greg offered it gratis) but for whatever reason it doesn't seem to have made it in.

Don't know where Jonathan Potter stands in all this as I've never had the opportunity to touch base with him in any meaningful manner.

If a few people were to write to Greg he might put out an OS4 version.

Certainly in the past he has updated stuff that he insisted he never would... setting a fortunate precedent.

Quote:

If anyone still interested for dopus please read this: Dopus for sale

and this: Dopus for sale II

maybe hyperion can give a statement about these posts?

no native dopus for os4 by hyperion?
is this really true? :(

byebye...

_________________
Michael Merkel
(Michael.Merkel@gmx.net Home)
Member of Amiga-Freunde Pfalz, OS4 Welt

@MichaelMerkel

Quote:

no native dopus for os4 by hyperion? is this really true? :(

Dopus / OS4

(Posting is from Dec 2002)

Could be Hermans/Friedens commented this in ANN.lu already (in dec-2002/jan-2003), can't remember...

@toRus

Workbench is very powerful and quite easy to use. "THE" and Deficon would give you the same power and more. Dopus users have spent months learning Dopus yet are ignorant of the power and ability of the newer workbenches. AOS4.0 has lots of options. No I disagree Dopus had it's place in the past, But has since been made largely obsolete. listers have a limited use and place on your Amiga. Dopus fails miserably on one of the more powerful features that a lister actually should have been built in since day one.

The only lister I use is ordering launched from a hot key from workbench. Because ordering actually does something intelligent. it gives me the ability to list in the lister window, The version numbers of the files so I can quickly compare version numbers of libraries and files.

Version in Dopus gives you a very retarded usage. It gives you the version of your workbench. We all know having a button that displays that is very useful in case I forget what version of OS I am using. Because we all know having to remember what version you are running after all the upgrades come at a blistering pace of one every three or four years. So it is easy to get confused. NOT!!!!
The guy who thought that was useful must have been brain dead. So do you want trust your Amiga to a programer who thought that was useful to ANYONE.

Yes I know you can make a script that pops up a window to display a version number of the file in question but that is reeally not very helpful if you are trying to compare more than just one file.

So Dopus in my mind fails at was it was meant to be a file utility. I dont' see why clicking a button is easier then pressing on a icon. Setting up Amidock is far easier than dopus and more intuitive. Fkey gives you the ability to open any program or script with a hotkey. Been around since 3.0 and THE is even more powerful but a litlle more complicated to set up using than Fkey.

I know that everybody is different and has their preferences but right now there is absolutly NOTHING you can do with dopus that can't be done right now with workbench. Nothing posted here has convinced me otherwise.

But if it makes it easier on you I can Post some button shaped icons you can use in Amidock so when OS4.0 come out so you don't feel home sick.

Also Diskmaster has been ported to OS4 and ordering works so you have file listers if you need one.

Kgrach

@Eagle

Dopus's FTP ability was nice but not compatible with all servers I found that out the hard way. Like I said a file lister has it usages. But saying you won't buy an AMigaone if it doesn't have dopus is silly because it really is not that indespensible.

Your agument about making life easier I agree with you 100% but dopus doen't really make life easier because of the learning curve to set up to do the same things. Like I said everything on my Amiga is either hot keyed or Amidocked.
I am willing to bet give any user your machine and mine. They would not want use your machine over mine becuase of the speed and ease of use of my set up.

Really folks have any of you looked at the tools and Arexx scripts included with 3.5 & 3.9.

you would be amazzed at what you can do.


kgrach

My 2p (Pounds Sterling)

In all honesty, I don't think I'd still be using my Amiga if it wasn't for DOpus. In the past ten years I've been exposed to most versions of Windows, MacOS 9.x and 10.x, and used Debian Linux on my AmigaOne for 8 months. And they've all showed me how easy it is for big companies and large groups of people to get file management wrong.

Workbench is functional, but you really need to start installing hacks and extras in order to get the functionality you get with DOpus. Dopus itself has *never* been responsible for any instability on my system, and has made my daily tasks more productive. Sure, initially you have to sit down and tweak things til you fingers are raw, but once you've got that right config, you never need to touch the prefs again.

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After a decade away from the scene, I am back!