@Rob

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AmigaOS is a bit of a joke on mainstream sites at the moment because it lacks hardware.

I have also noticed that. The situation surely _is_ bizarre, isn't it? A tiny company keeps coding an OS for 6 years and when it is finished and they have spend 500.000 EUR for development, they don't sell it and don't port it to the hardware it can run on? A lot of mainstream people _do have_ noticed that OS4 is released. But instead of arousing interest, all it did was making people laugh and chuckle. Some were even asking
"So where can I download it, I wanna try it out!" or
"Great, I have an old PPC Mac, that should do it!"
It doesn't really take a rocket scientist to figure out how to really make some _sales_ out of OS4. Ok, it's pretty outdated compared to most other OS out there and there isn't much features why one "must-have" OS4, but at least there are some retro style people who think it's kinda funny to use an odd non-mainstream OS. And there are us (1000-2000 people) who could buy it. Are we enough to keep Hyperion alive? No. Is it enough to create a market where up to date software can be developed? No. Will many people buy mainboards running around 400-700 Mhz that cost 3 times more than 3 times faster x86 hardware? No. Does it make sense to clinge to PPC when the companies behind it have already declared it as dead for the desktop market? No. Will I shut up now? Yes.

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Expensive Amiga hardware will be difficult to sell as it is. There is no point in making that job even harder.

But this is what they are doing. Looking at the ongoing licensing troubles, they make it even hard to sell OS4 for the most uncompelling hardware that one could imagine. Oh yes, sure, I forgot, the hardware is for teh-embedded-people and also Hyperion's only target is the embedded market where they will make great sales with OS4 components. *sigh*

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@polka.

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Will many people buy mainboards running around 400-700 Mhz that cost 3 times more than 3 times faster x86 hardware?

haven´t you see the prices on ebay of 266 mhz powerpc accelerator?

The MHZ are not all.There are other considerations like power dissipation and all that lower dissipation imply, less money to pay to your electrical company, less noise..........AmigaOS lacks a lot of things, sure, but all other operating systems lacks the most important thing: I want all computing power for my applications, not for the OS, the OS it´s only the interface between the apps/hardware and the human.But nowadays seems that it´s the human who serve to the OS

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No PowerPC, No Fun
Make Amiga Great Again

@Fransexy

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There are other considerations like power dissipation and all that lower dissipation imply, less money to pay to your electrical company, less noise.........

Yes, and in respect to power dissipation and noise, X86 is far more advanced than PPC now. There are x86 CPUs that run much faster than PPC, while consuming less power and generating less heat. Since a long time already, PPC is behind x86 as a desktop CPUs. Apple drew the conclusions from it and left PPC. Now it is time for you to realize this.

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.AmigaOS lacks a lot of things, sure, but all other operating systems lacks the most important thing: I want all computing power for my applications, not for the OS, the OS it´s only the interface between the apps/hardware and the human.

This argument is completely irrelevant when you are tied to run AmigaOS on slow and outdated PPC hardware.

Last edited by polka. on 18-Mar-2007 at 12:52 PM.
Last edited by polka. on 18-Mar-2007 at 12:49 PM.
Last edited by polka. on 18-Mar-2007 at 12:47 PM.

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@polka.

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This argument is completely irrelevant when you are tied to run AmigaOS on slow and outdated PPC hardware.

Not when you do simply task faster on slow machines than on faster ones.My 66 Mhz AmigaOS 3.1 is faster in certain task than my coreduo 1,66 mhz running Windows.For example if i want only copy a few files to a media, in the time windows boots, i have switched on , copied the files and switched off the Amiga.Obviously if a want to render a complicated scene in a few minutes the PC is better in the same way as an all terrain car is better for drive in a stony land, but you cannot compare the feeling of drive a sport car on other type of roads even if that sport car is less poweful and more expensive than the all terrain car.

Last edited by Fransexy on 18-Mar-2007 at 01:06 PM.

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No PowerPC, No Fun
Make Amiga Great Again

@polka.

i guess we must wait for aos5.0 that will be for the x86 platform.... and that will happen in year 3010...

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I was a ZX Spectrum owner....

@Fransexy

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Not when you do simply task faster on slow machines than on faster ones.My 66 Mhz AmigaOS 3.1 is faster in certain task than my coreduo 1,66 mhz running Windows.For example if i want only copy a few files to a media, in the time windows boots, i have switched on , copied the files and switched off the Amiga.

Yes and for coding a BASIC program that prints out "Hello Fransexy", my C128 beats your Amiga hands down. Booting your Amiga and starting BASIC on it takes just too long.
What I am aiming at: You didn't state any reason why PPC would be more compelling than x86 for any desktop task, you only spoke about the OS. The fact that you might be able to copy a few files to media some seconds faster with AmigaOS than with Windows has no relevance to a PPC vs. x86 discussion.

Last edited by polka. on 18-Mar-2007 at 02:00 PM.

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@polka.

Yes, and in respect to power dissipation and noise, X86 is far more advanced than PPC now. There are x86 CPUs that run much faster than PPC, while consuming less power and generating less heat. Since a long time already, PPC is behind x86 as a desktop CPUs. Apple drew the conclusions from it and left PPC. Now it is time for you to realize this.

You need to do a little more research before making such a claim!

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@AmigaMac

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You need to do a little more research before making such a claim!

And you could at least provide us with some facts or figures to counter my statement. The times when PPC was king regarding performance per watts ratio have been basically over since the G5-sauna made it to the market.
No surprise Apple left the PPC market for good. The CPUs weren't compelling anymore and they did not have any competitive CPU they could use in their Powermacs.

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@polka.

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'But instead of arousing interest, all it did was making people laugh and chuckle. Some were even asking "So where can I download it, I wanna try it out!" or "Great, I have an old PPC Mac, that should do it!"

I have also seen a few people who have asked where they can buy the OS and AmigaONEs and they seem shocked when they discover that it is impossible to actually buy OS4 and that hardware does not exist even though OS4 has been officially released.
There are infact people who want it, but simply cannot get it due to no hardware.

@AmigaMac
What about the VIA ones? They use very little heat and can even run without fan and still they are faster than the AmigaONE.
The newer PPC cpus are infact very power hungry and give out alot of heat.

Last edited by Tomas on 18-Mar-2007 at 02:32 PM.

@polka.

Well, with the PASemi pwrficient line, they may have jumped a bit soon. If the guys at PASemi can stay ahead of the game, they have one very nice processor in the PA6T- 1682M (dual core - 2GHz w/ 13W typical). If you look at the pdf overview, you will see that this CPU can hold it's own pretty well for the time being. Of course, Intel and AMD are not going to sit idle.

This is just a topic question, but shouldn't Amy05 now be Amy07??

@polka.

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And you could at least provide us with some facts or figures to counter my statement.

The Power (they don't say PowerPC any more) range comprises all sorts of chips from several different manufacturers.

Look up the 460 series at IBM, they run cool enough to use in Mobile phones.

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The times when PPC was king regarding performance per watts ratio have been basically over since the G5-sauna made it to the market.

The G5 uses around 125W in it's fastest version, same as AMD. There are also much cooler versions some of which would be fine for a laptop. They're not quite as powerful as a Core 2 duo but they'd have been fine until the PASemi chips appear.

--


BTW shouldn't the last 2 words of the thread title be removed?

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Whyzzat?

DonnieA2:
Amy'05 was announced in 2005 to be released before new-year.
Early in 2006 when it was still not released a line was added to their
website FAQ:
"The '05 is just a designated number".

That question has now been removed from the FAQ. I guess you
can figure out yourself what they meant with it..

@minator

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BTW shouldn't the last 2 words of the thread title be removed?

Why?

If Amy05 doesn't appear this spring, maybe in spring 2008, and we can use this thread next year too.

Recycling is

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@yak

It's also important to remember that we are a hobbiest market and the chance of becoming even a niche player are long gone. Sad, but 12 years of nothing, well we no longer have a killer app.

At least new hardware would be appreciated.

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@Rogue

We do look forward to it Rogue -- thanks for your dedication!

I have my a3000 up and listening to old tunes fron Sonix, DMCS and mods.... Remembering the good old days.

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@A500
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@Rogue We do look forward to it Rogue -- thanks for your dedication!

Just a little reality check here - you do realize the post you're replying to is a year old, right?

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Here for the whimpering end

@jorkany

In the Amiga Calendar, that's a short period of time. It took 10 years for a new OS, I figure another 10 for harddware is about right.

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@polka.

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Yes, and in respect to power dissipation and noise, X86 is far more advanced than PPC now. There are x86 CPUs that run much faster than PPC, while consuming less power and generating less heat. Since a long time already, PPC is behind x86 as a desktop CPUs. Apple drew the conclusions from it and left PPC. Now it is time for you to realize this.

That's BS and mere propaganda. You don't get more efficient CPUs, just "faster". There is a reason all these people build mini PCs based on lame VIA chips. There is no x86 solution for fanless operation. Intel could make all the claims it wants about being more efficient at 5GHz or boasting about the "core" architecture. That doesn't really matter to someone who is old enough to remember Intel's policy and attitude all over the years. Do you trust the wolf in sheep's clothing ?

Nevertheless, if PoiwerPC failed, Apple has a lot to do with it as well since it was a member of AIM. I still believe PPC had much more potential running energy-efficient home PCs than x86 ever had. Unfortunately, Intel and AMD capitalised on Micro$oft's power-hungry OS in order to force their noisy crap CPU offerings to the easily-intimitated and highly-ignorant consumer.