@andres

So what people here are saying is that AROS is cr@p and yet Commodore can be sued because 'it is substantially similar to OS4'.

Well, apart from the flawed logic, above - it's obvious that Hyperion cannot sue Commodore. They have no relationship with them and Commodore are not using trademarks licensed to them by Amiga Inc.

As for Hyperion suing Amiga Inc. Well Amiga Inc. do not develop or supply any software remotely AmigaOS like.

I suggest Hyperion review the SCO case - SCO burned through millions of pounds and lost.

@Manu
I didn't mean it like that. What i meant as a Direct reply to the first post (in which the starter claimed to feel somewhat defrauded by this whole mess) was that "if you have my same concept of Amiga" (described above as my own personal opinion) than you'll be fine...

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SamFlex Complete 800Mhz System + AmigaOS 4.1 Update 4
Amiga 2000 DKB 2MB ChipRam GVP G-Force040 Picasso 2 OS3.9 BB2
AmigaCD 32

@whatever!

Quote:

In case you hadn't noticed but Commodore have a license to ship official Amiga computers

Sure

Quote:

and they will be using AROS as the official Amiga operating system.

No. They don´t have licence for any "Amiga operating system". They can (maybe) sell their Amiga computers with AROS (as Amiga inspired OS). (Amiga.Inc can´t use or licence phrase "Amiga operating system".)

As I see, you really enjoy your stay here.

@Manu

Yeah, that's gotta suck. I can't understand why, knowing recent history, CUSA didn't send off an email to Hyperion and just made sure feathers weren't ruffled. They might be 100% within their legal rights to do what they did, but in a community this small one has to be diplomatic. This (and the subsequent handling of OSNews) tells me that CUSA aren't too concerned about burning bridges and that doesn't bode well for the future.

@DAX

In the meanwhile I have an "Amiga priority list":

1. Official Amiga-branded custom hardware with official branded AmigaOS, running natively (I have three of them, see sig.)
2. Official AmigaOne-branded custom hardware with official branded AmigaOS, running natively (don't have this combination...).
3. Technical similar (to 2., see above) custom hardware (SAM, PegasosII) with official branded AmigaOS, running natively (have two of them...).

That's *my personal* "what-is-an-Amiga-list".

This list might grow, if:

The Natami comes to a buyable product with an natively running official branded AmigaOS and/or in some future day a custom Intel hardware might be operating a full natively official AmigaOS.

This does not effect the fun I have or might have with - for example - MorphOS on my PegasosII (or AROS on my Netbook...).

BTW: Following my own list, my PegasosII morphes (!) from being an "Amiga - Priority 3" while running OS4.1 to an "PegasosII" when booted into MorphOS -

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X1000|II/G4|440ep|2000/060|2000/040|1000

@pavlor
Indeed, they just licenced a sticker for Commodore USA cases. Inside you will find a chinese intel PC that can host any operating system including Aros.
If I will ever buy an Aros pre-built system I will get one of Steve's fine efforts (an iMica Atom netbook would be quite nice).

@cha05e90
Gotta buy an OS3.9 BB4 Natami myself when it'll be available as a commercial product (I love custom HW running AmigaOS can't help it )

Last edited by DAX on 02-Sep-2010 at 10:14 AM.

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SamFlex Complete 800Mhz System + AmigaOS 4.1 Update 4
Amiga 2000 DKB 2MB ChipRam GVP G-Force040 Picasso 2 OS3.9 BB2
AmigaCD 32

@pavlor

Quote:

No. They don´t have licence for any "Amiga operating system". They can (maybe) sell their Amiga computers with AROS (as Amiga inspired OS). (Amiga.Inc can´t use or licence phrase "Amiga operating system".)

Well, I am not a lawyer!

However I thought I understood that Hyperion had a license to use the phrases AmigaOS and Amiga OS. I didn't notice Amiga Operating System.
Anyway that is for Commodore to worry about. They can call it Amiga AROS system or whatever. It is still the system that will be shipped with the official Amigas.

@DAX

Quote:

If I will ever buy an Aros pre-built system I will get one of Steve's fine efforts (an iMica Atom netbook would be quite nice).

I wouldn't be suprised if Commodore worked with Steve at some future point. His expertise goes back a long way in Amiga. He is also involved in a similar operation and is liked by AROS devs, users and generally.

I for one have a wedge of bolivars with Commodore Amigas name on it waiting to be spent in time for Christmas.

@whatever!

Quote:

However I thought I understood that Hyperion had a license to use the phrases AmigaOS and Amiga OS. I didn't notice Amiga Operating System.

September 30 Agreement prohibits A.Inc use of the phrase "Amiga operating system".

Quote:

They can call it Amiga AROS system or whatever.

If they have such licence from A.Inc (CommodoreUSA claims that their licence is for all-in-one computers).

Quote:

It is still the system that will be shipped with the official Amigas.

It will be (probably - there are some concerns) OS shipped with Amiga branded computers.

@Wizzard_o

Quote:

Well if it is true about the other threads... I invested in OS4, I invested in OS4.1 (twice) I invested in a Micro A1, I invested in a Sam-Flex. Now it seems I've wasted my time, money and faith in this platform. I have an X1000 beta test contract in front of me. Should I bother signing it?

No, the folk who have, possibly, been stabbed in the back are the iMICA people. They worked with the AROS contributors to produce the hardware and drivers required. C=USA don't seem to have contributed much in this way (although they are a start-up and have not had much of an opportunity). However, I suspect they are going to borrow much of that hard work.

I tried a 'live' version of AROS some time ago, but it was missing a lot and was slow because it was running off a CD. It was still impressive and I find the iMICA very interesting. It would be a nice thing to have if I was unhappy with OS4 and WinUAE, which I am not. I cannot try Morphos to compare it, but I find that OS4 is the best of the bunch that I have been able to try by a wide margin. I can imagine AROS working well on its own native hardware. Mind you, I have Linux running on an Atom system and it is good, but no ball of fire.

Sign up for the X1000 beta test. I will buy one eventually, but I would like to see the problems ironed out some more. I was an earlybird A1XE buyer and I was glad I skipped the A1SE beta stage. Even the earlybird machines had their problems as you may remember.

I think that a SAM plus OS4.0 will be the best, currently available, Amiga experience until the X1000 arrives.

My thoughts go with the potential customers of Commodore USA. We think that AROS is interesting and showing real progress. We know what its limitations are. How many of Commodore USA customers will imagine that they will be able to run all the software that they remember from the old Commodore International days? The hardware and case may need to be custom to look like the old all-in-one machines like the A1200. We know that custom means cost. I think C= customers will be disappointed with what they buy.

Regards
Roy Leith

@pavlor

Quote:

September 30 Agreement prohibits A.Inc use of the phrase "Amiga operating system".

and also, from andres' post:
Quote:

... the Amiga Parties shall during the term of this Agreement not commercialize anywhere in the world (including through sub-licensing), distribute (free of charge or otherwise) or make available to the public (free of charge or otherwise), in any way or form (including but not limited to Object Code and Source Code form), on any medium (now known or otherwise) and through any means (now known or otherwise) the Software (in part or as a whole) and any Operating System exhibiting a Software Architecture substantially similar to the Software Architecture of the Software as described in the Documentation, to the extent that such Software Architecture is protectable under the copyright laws of the United States (a "Substantially Similar Software Architecture"

So using "Amiga" name plus AROS (3.x API clone for which Hyperion has exclusive rights => "Substantially Similar Software Architecture") could mean trouble in court?

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PowerBook 5.2 MorphOS 3.15
PowerBook 5.8 MorphOS 3.15
Amiga 1200 BPPC/BVision AOS4.1 FE

@emeck
In my opinion, clearly YES.
If they mentioned the use of AROS for AMIGA systems in their license, this could be already a violation.

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A1200/020+68882 - 6 MB RAM - AmigaOS 3.0

Home Recording Audio

@andres
Probably they cannot licence the Amiga name to a product that ships with a clone of "The Software" (as they call it in the settlement) as they would be associating the Amiga name with a substantially similar OS3.1 clone.

I also believe they have a non-interference deal about "not confusing" Hyperion's target audience (or something like that), and this deal can confuse some people.

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SamFlex Complete 800Mhz System + AmigaOS 4.1 Update 4
Amiga 2000 DKB 2MB ChipRam GVP G-Force040 Picasso 2 OS3.9 BB2
AmigaCD 32

@Manu

Quote:

Manu wrote: @andres Quote: andres wrote: In my opinion, they cannot use AROS for AMIGA branded machines: I think so too, possible reasons might be Amiga Inc want to drag Hyperion to court again.

AFAIK they ehre talking about "The software" this is defined somewhere before in the settlement, and "the software" was defined as AmigaOS (I don't remeber if AOS3.x or AOS4.x ) but they didn't mention AROS.

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AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

@Arko
"The Software" it's Aos 3.1, and they do not limit themselves to it, but to "anything else substantially similar to it" (I guess Aros fits the latter description)

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SamFlex Complete 800Mhz System + AmigaOS 4.1 Update 4
Amiga 2000 DKB 2MB ChipRam GVP G-Force040 Picasso 2 OS3.9 BB2
AmigaCD 32

@andres

Quote:

andres wrote: "any Operating System exhibiting a Software Architecture substantially similar to the Software Architecture of the Software as described in the Documentation"

OK then I'm waiting for HyperionMP official announcement about AROS being "substantially similar" to AmigaOS, maybe this announcement would harm Hyperion more than just staying quite.

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AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

@royleith

Quote:

I tried a 'live' version of AROS some time ago, but it was missing a lot and was slow because it was running off a CD. It was still impressive and I find the iMICA very interesting.

Yes, AROS is much slower when run off a Live CD, But if you're hardware is working with the live CD then it's easy to install on your HD alongside Windows. And then it's real fast.

It takes some courage, a few backups, and GPARTED Live (for preparing the HD)
Just wanted to point that out.

Last edited by Manu on 02-Sep-2010 at 11:51 AM.

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AmigaOS or MorphOS on x86 would sell orders of magnitude more than the current,
hardware-intensive solutions. And they'd go faster.-- D.Haynie

@Arko
Hyperion will decide how to proceed against them, but from what I read, I think the violation is clear.
Clearly, it will be a court to decide if AROS is substantially similar to the Software Architecture of the Software, but considering that AROS is an AmigaOS clone, and it's AmigaOS 3.x compatible, I think there are few doubts about it.

Last edited by andres on 02-Sep-2010 at 11:56 AM.
Last edited by andres on 02-Sep-2010 at 11:55 AM.

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A1200/020+68882 - 6 MB RAM - AmigaOS 3.0

Home Recording Audio

I only hope for friendly co-existence & co-operation amongs Amiga flavours.

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- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@Wizard_o
Yes, you and everyone else who invested in the Amiga OS 4 stream should feel stabbed in the back.

@andres your legal contract excerpt starts with "Amiga parties shall..."
Commodore USA is not an Amiga party.
Furthermore, AROS is not an Amiga party, and the OS is already bundled with a commercial hardware offering.

@Wizard_o
And another thing, where do you get off asking for @mods to shut down a thread just because you've had enough. Who died and made you king of discussions?

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All the way, with 68k