Hi everyone,

I am interested in this comparison as I previously own a Pegasos 2 with a 1ghz PPC with 2gb ram and I am looking to get a Amigaone 500 Sam460 system,

I want to know what the comparison of performance would be when running AmigaOS 4.x would it feel much the same or would the Sam460 feel faster?

Also as a side note does anyone own the Sam460 Relec "Red One" I would appreciate if I could see some photos of the case from different angles because the website is none to revealing?

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Amiga A1200T - TF1260 - R9200 - Indivision AGA MK3
Amiga A500 - PiStorm EMU68
Pegasos 2 G4 - AmigaOS 4.1 FE / MorphOS 3.16

@Fairdinkem

I believe they're both pretty similar. However, the Peg II has the advantage that it can run MOS if you so choose, and also any Altivec-enabled programs will be much faster with the Peg II.
Having said that I don't own a 460 and my Peg II is a G3@600 so I could be completely wrong. That's just what I understand. :)

Edit:
Of course if you want to run 3D stuff then the 460ex will in future be MUCH faster as you'll be able to fit a snazzy Radeon HD PCI-E card, whereas the Peg II is limited to older cards using PCI and AGP.

Personally, I'd go for the 460ex.

Last edited by Spirantho on 04-Jan-2013 at 12:03 PM.

I imagine SAM460 should be faster in everything else except things where Altivec gives it's extra.
So, in general, SAM460 should run AOS4 faster while things like mpeg handling is faster on peg2.

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- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@Spirantho

:) except that they've now ported MOS to the 460,so I guess its only altivec between them. oh and the Sam uses more readily available ddr2 sodimm.

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@Fairdinkem

...and the fastest SAM460EX plus R1950Pro earned 7595 points while the fastest PegII with R9800 has 2730 points in 2D benchmark...

http://d7.cf.1243.static.theplanet.com/benchmark/gfxbench2d/OS/AmigaOS

I think its nice to have PCIe
The only problem for me is the lack of overlay or similar hw acceleretion.

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Sam440ep-flex 800MHz 1GB RAM R9250 128MB SB Live!

@mr2

Quote:

The only problem for me is the lack of overlay or similar hw acceleretion.

yes this is where Peg2 pwn3s the Sam

@thread

Thanks everyone for the input.

I like the fact that both machines have the capacity to run MorphOS, I like the fact the Pegasos has Altivec but I like the fact that the graphics card can be heavily upgraded on the Sam460.

3d acceleration will com eventually for the 460 so I am willing to wait for that.

Looks like the Pegasos 2 will be the winner.

I invite more opinions on the matter.

_________________
Amiga A1200T - TF1260 - R9200 - Indivision AGA MK3
Amiga A500 - PiStorm EMU68
Pegasos 2 G4 - AmigaOS 4.1 FE / MorphOS 3.16

@mr2

Who is responsible for the drivers to enable overlay hw acceleration Acube or hyperion?

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Amiga A1200T - TF1260 - R9200 - Indivision AGA MK3
Amiga A500 - PiStorm EMU68
Pegasos 2 G4 - AmigaOS 4.1 FE / MorphOS 3.16

It might be that SM502 can do overlay with AOS4. It's "just" not supported yet on radeon chips.

@Fairdikem
There are several party involved in graphics driver development.
IIRC, Hyperion has done old Radeon support, Hans De Ruiter is doing RadeonHD support and I think SM502 drivers are done by ACube.

Last edited by KimmoK on 05-Jan-2013 at 07:32 AM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@Fairdinkem

Hans is doing the job but he decided not to do overlay. Something different was considered as hw acceleration. Unfortunately its not clear what is the plan now. Its very interesting for me. Much more than 3D support ;)

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Sam440ep-flex 800MHz 1GB RAM R9250 128MB SB Live!

@mr2

Quote:

Hans is doing the job but he decided not to do overlay.

As far as I know - there's no overlay support at all in new Radeons HD so Hans has nothing to decide about. Video (once...) will be rendered straight to a texture surface.

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@mr2

Is it that the overlay will be fixed by the eventuation of Galium or the new Warp3D drivers?

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Amiga A1200T - TF1260 - R9200 - Indivision AGA MK3
Amiga A500 - PiStorm EMU68
Pegasos 2 G4 - AmigaOS 4.1 FE / MorphOS 3.16

@Fairdinkem

The answer is very easy for CPU both have the same speed but in hardware the Sam is the win because it use hardware newest although no as a PC computer.
But other answer is what do you make with the Sam? and if the Sam in that case is better than your Pegasos II.
Also you can wait the MorphOS for the Sam and to see the results, now I waiting it, because I want to gift one to my brother, and he returns to Amiga.

@Templario

Quote:

Templario wrote: @Fairdinkem The answer is very easy for CPU both have the same speed .

Thats not true, because the PegasosII CPU is faster - without Altivec a little bit (15-20%) and wit Altivec (e.g. lame) much faster. On the other hand SAM 460 is much faster with graphics, but hasn´t 3D-support at the moment.

I would say, the SAM 460 has the better future options (especially when it comes to the GPU) and is available new with warranty, while the Pegasos II is still a good choice (you have a faster CPU and MorphOS/3D-support now) if you find a cheap offer and don´t care for warranty.

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AmigaOne X5000/40, 2.2 Ghz, 4 GB RAM, Radeon R9 280X, M-Audio Revolution 5.1, 240 GB SSD

For me today this would be SAM. But if I were to have one of the two as my only system there's no question about picking the Pegasos if it was an option somehow. More well-rounded.

_________________
: AmigaOneXE (unmod.) 750FX/512 MB +stuff & AmigaOS 4.(0|1)
: A1200/68060&96MB/SCSI/EM1200-Voodoo3 & OS 3.5
: A500/1MB
: Pegasos (ff) 512 MB & MorphOS
Praise seitan.

To my understanding PPC460 should perform like G3, so in integer I expect it to match with G4 or be slightly faster per Mhz.
G4 is faster in FPU & Altivec using processess.

Some example benchmarks from Mac side:
http://www.barefeats.com/g400.html

(+one must take into account that PPC460 is many ways more advanced than G3)


In Blender:
540s blender 2.48 MacMini 1420Mhz
591s blender 2.48 A1XE 1000Mhz (should be identical with 1ghz Peg2!!)
629s blender 2.49 SAM460 1.15Ghz
710s blender 2.49 SAM460ex 1Ghz
1180s blender 2.48 SAM440 800Mhz (AOS4)

So, it should be safe to estimate that G4 1Ghz is about 20% faster in average FPU & Altivec using application than PPC460.
(difference can be bigger in things that fit better in G4's larger L2 cache, otherwise PPC460 memory interface is a lot faster and makes things more even. And in those cases where Altivec code has been hand optimized, G4 is more ahead.)

Last edited by KimmoK on 05-Jan-2013 at 01:08 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 05-Jan-2013 at 01:07 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 05-Jan-2013 at 01:06 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 05-Jan-2013 at 01:03 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 05-Jan-2013 at 01:00 PM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@AP

I'm sorry I haven't one Pegasos and I not remember its CPU speed, here I try to give ideas, because with the heart always I recommend the Sam, because I'm Sam users and Sam fan.

@KimmoK

Quote:

To my understanding PPC460 should perform like G3, so in integer I expect it to match with G4 or be slightly faster per Mhz.

Nonesense.

460 scores 2 DMIPS/MHz
G3 (750FX) scores 2.32 DMIPS/MHz

460EX has only 256 kB L2 cache (like 750CXe in Pegasos, A1-SE). 750FX (A1-XE, uA1) has 512 kB L2 cache and 750GX (some uA1) even 1 MB.

So, G3 is generaly faster per MHz than 460EX.

@Radov

...and your point is? RadeonHD is his work so...let me rephrase this. Hans thinks that there is a better solution than overlay...

@Fairdinkem

Quote:

...Overlay has been superceded by textured video, which does everything that overlay does using the GPU...Textured video is the avenue that I am exploring, but I make absolutely no promises as to when/if that will be ready. Development of something this complex needs to be done one step at a time. In the meantime, the current drivers are very usable even without this feature.

Quote:

... understand why users are interested in overlay or an alternative. I want it too. However, this is an incredibly complex driver, and so development can only ever proceed one step at a time...

Quote:

...One more thing. Some people seem to think that overlay support could be slapped together quickly, whereas textured-video will take a long time. In reality, textured-video would probably take less time to implement than overlay. There really is no technical or practical reason for wasting time on implementing overlay. It's obsolete, and won't get you better video playback any sooner...

You can find more below but if you want to ask somethink better post on Amigans
http://www.amigans.net/modules/xforum/viewtopic.php?post_id=71900#forumpost71900

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Sam440ep-flex 800MHz 1GB RAM R9250 128MB SB Live!

@Fairdinkem

Altivec and video overlay support in the current common configurations give the Pegasos 2 the edge certain applications now.

Long term the Sam460ex should get Textured Video and OpenCL functions with Radeon HD video cards.
These will put the Sam460ex in a much higher performance class than the Pegasos 2 .

Last edited by Spectre660 on 05-Jan-2013 at 04:10 PM.

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Sam460ex : Radeon Rx550 Single slot Video Card : SIL3112 SATA card