@Chuckt

Quote:

If you want to use this product, let me see your creation. Amuse me.

When my own creations are ready they will undoubtedly amuse. Until then you may be amused by some of these:
http://www.engadget.com/2014/09/11/edison-projects/

_________________
All the way, with 68k

@cdimauro


Quote:

Some of these other forums have turned the blog comments off because they don't want the users saying anything negative that Intel won't like.

I never eared of such thing. Do you have some source for this?

Why would you be surprised?


http://www.adafruit.com/blog/2014/01/07/breaking-news-intel-edison-an-sd-card-sized-pc-for-wearable-computing-ces2014-wearables/

At the above link, click on it and on the top right it says, "comments off".

It is sort of like this: Million dollar companies use blog posts to interest their customers. They invite the creators of these projects to come on their blog or show and all it takes is a couple of users with negative reviews to upset them or upset business.

Read the comment policy on Hackaday:

http://hackaday.com/2011/07/27/hackaday-comment-policy-were-cleaning-up/

I can almost guarantee you that if you say something negative there, your comment will be deleted by the next business day or sooner.

They are not the only company with this policy.

@agami

Quote:

agami wrote: @Chuckt Quote: If you want to use this product, let me see your creation. Amuse me. When my own creations are ready they will undoubtedly amuse. Until then you may be amused by some of these: http://www.engadget.com/2014/09/11/edison-projects/

If there is an application like BASIC or "C" then maybe someone will be able to do something with it if it is simple.

The reality is there are microcontroller forums that never grow. I see the same users posting.
Why is that? They are hard to learn and few people can make the jump between a basic understanding and programming one. Even though this company has 200 people going to visit them at these exhibitions, there are few new members to their forums because learning at the chip level is hard and it takes a long time. Even Nerdkits went out of business. Look at their forum and see if you can actually buy something.

This is what people to go school for.

I bought a microcontroller and they had a package to get started. I had to complain because it didn't come with a power supply even though one was listed. Then they sent me the wrong one and I had to try three times before they gave me the right one. Then when I couldn't learn it they told me that I bought the wrong package after I took their member's advice in the forums in getting the right one. The story goes on and on. My microcontroller didn't come with a book that teaches microcontrollers and it was for beginners. I complained and nothing happened.

A lot of these sites say they are beginner friendly but they have instructions on how to build a certain project. There are no instructions on how to connect the dots in order to learn how to do something greater.

I bought a soldering iron at radio shack and it was too big for soldering electronic projects.

Do you have a 1K resistor in your parts drawer? If not, you have to go shopping.

I bought a bunch of LEDs but didn't realize that you need to use resistors with them or you can burn your microcontroller out.

Basically I've been studying microcontrollers for years by reading the blog posts. Almost no one tells you what you need to get started. I can't get anything done at home because I'm interrupted before I can read two pages.

On top of that, I need a $75 program called "Diptrace" because it may be the only one I can afford to make my own boards. Then you have to send your board out to a fab house. It costs money and it takes days or weeks to get your board back. Ordering stuff takes days or weeks and unless you have the right part on hand, you have to wait.

Do you have a digital oscilloscope? A good one costs $400. They are helpful in understanding what is going on with your project. I could literally spend $1,000 trying to get up to speed in able to do this hobby.

So what do you need to know how to program these things if you didn't know what you need to know? I asked that question:

http://dangerousprototypes.com/2011/10/12/what-are-the-topics-you-need-to-know-to-master-microcontrollers/

Anyway, unless the Edison board comes with a bootloader, I think that this board is not for beginners. If there is a bootloader, you can cut and paste some code from the internet and pretend that you have arrived when in fact, you don't know what you are doing.

Last edited by Chuckt on 12-Sep-2014 at 05:11 AM.
Last edited by Chuckt on 12-Sep-2014 at 05:09 AM.

@agami

Quote:

agami wrote: @Chuckt Quote: If you want to use this product, let me see your creation. Amuse me. When my own creations are ready they will undoubtedly amuse. Until then you may be amused by some of these: http://www.engadget.com/2014/09/11/edison-projects/

The reality is that if someone was given a bare board, they wouldn't know what to do with it. If I gave someone a 9V battery, how would they get the power down to 3 or 5 volts for this unit? They have no clue how to hook up a voltage regulator because no one has taught them. If I have to add a resistor, what kind of value does it have to have to not blow the circuit and how do you do the math?

Most users don't have a multimeter or know how to read a schematic. Those skills take time because you have to learn all of the symbols.

Unless someone here has done it before, 99% of the users here aren't going to tell me because they are beginners and they don't know how to do this so they won't tell me.

If you mess up each time, you lose a $50 board unless it has some kind of voltage protection.

In other words, most users are going to have to follow instructions and work inside parameters until they learn enough to branch out and when they are nothing more than script kiddies, they are just consumers and not inventors or makers.

Last edited by Chuckt on 12-Sep-2014 at 01:47 PM.

@Chuckt

BTW:

Quote:

Some of the smallest chips I deal with have a 300 page datasheet. When you get to be my age, by the time you get around to reading those datasheets, you are ready for bed.

You're doing well. In my spare time a novel that size could take me a month.

Quote:

If there is a bootloader

This is what I wonder. How does the card then boot? Does this just mean that it has a boot ROM that resets the board and then sits on a serial terminal? Or the user needs to JTAG a bootloader across? I really should read more bout it.

Last edited by Hypex on 12-Sep-2014 at 03:21 PM.

@Hypex

You have to read the datasheet or documentation because it would be hard to proceed without it.

If one of the Amiga boards wanted to donate a couple of forums for microcontrollers then it would add weight to getting one but I am guessing most users are consumers and not makers so a forum would not be needed which makes the case for getting one nil.

I already have two Microchip Pics, two Arduinos, an Attiny, STM32, Ti, Stellaris Launchpad, Propeller, Teensy 2.0+, and two more chips by Ti.

The reason why my family doesn't want to get involved with electronics is because it is hard and takes a lot of time. The chip makers don't help because it means paying an engineer at their salary and Engineers are not cheap. I doubt they would even answer the phone which is why you need to only buy electronics from a store that will give you a datasheet.

Why use a $30 microcontroller to blink a bunch of LEDs when all you need are a couple of transistors, capacitors and resistors? When you choose a microcontroller, you don't select one that is too large for your project or you are wearing it out and wasting money. Why waste a $50 Edison when a $2 Microchip Pic might do? You are basically throwing away money.

The truth is that you need a fundamental chip with staying power. There are parts that are discontinued and you don't want that. You want a chip that has been around 20 years and which will continue being made. Why buy the Edison if it is going to be upgraded and discontinued because then you need the upgraded compiler and the upgraded tools and paying for all of that because they make you take a ride.

The other thing is that a $50 Edison is going to come with more expensive tools than a $2 Microchip Pic. The more complicated they make it, the more money you are going to spend when a smaller chip may do. A 32 bit Microchip Pic has more expensive third party accessories and products than an 8 bit Microchip Pic. It is just the way it works.


Quote:

Hypex wrote: @Chuckt BTW: Quote: Some of the smallest chips I deal with have a 300 page datasheet. When you get to be my age, by the time you get around to reading those datasheets, you are ready for bed. You're doing well. In my spare time a novel that size could take me a month. Quote: If there is a bootloader This is what I wonder. How does the card then boot? Does this just mean that it has a boot ROM that resets the board and then sits on a serial terminal? Or the user needs to JTAG a bootloader across? I really should read more bout it.

Quote:

Chuckt wrote: @cdimauro [quote]I never eared of such thing. Do you have some source for this?

Quote:

Why would you be surprised?

It CAN happen, but I asked for a source about your previous statement, which was:

"Some of these other forums have turned the blog comments off because they don't want the users saying anything negative that Intel won't like."

Quote:

http://www.adafruit.com/blog/2014/01/07/breaking-news-intel-edison-an-sd-card-sized-pc-for-wearable-computing-ces2014-wearables/ At the above link, click on it and on the top right it says, "comments off". It is sort of like this: Million dollar companies use blog posts to interest their customers. They invite the creators of these projects to come on their blog or show and all it takes is a couple of users with negative reviews to upset them or upset business.

The link that you provided is about a blog which talks about several technologies, and many of them do NOT come from "million dollar companies". Like Intel, right?

Quote:

Read the comment policy on Hackaday: http://hackaday.com/2011/07/27/hackaday-comment-policy-were-cleaning-up/ I can almost guarantee you that if you say something negative there, your comment will be deleted by the next business day or sooner. They are not the only company with this policy.

I read the whole post, and it seems that the reason were very different from your original claim. There's also a Jeri Ellsworth's tweet which was reported as a picture of the situation with bad comments.

Again, it seems that has nothing to do with your original statement.

So, I repeat my self: do you have any (REAL) source that it's Intel which has asked to block comments for the negative ones?

P.S. The Intel employee has also deserved negative comments about Edison. So it should be fired now, right?

How to get started with the Edison:

https://communities.intel.com/docs/DOC-23147

@cdimauro

Quote:

cdimauro wrote:So, I repeat my self: do you have any (REAL) source that it's Intel which has asked to block comments for the negative ones? P.S. The Intel employee has also deserved negative comments about Edison. So it should be fired now, right?

Did I say they did?

@Chuckt: (only) the last sentence was a joke...