Click Here
home features news forums classifieds faqs links search
5616 members 
Amiga Q&A /  Free for All /  Emulation /  Gaming / (Latest Posts)
Login

Nickname

Password

Lost Password?

Don't have an account yet?
Register now!

Support Amigaworld.net
Your support is needed and is appreciated as Amigaworld.net is primarily dependent upon the support of its users.
Donate

Menu
Main sections
Home
Features
News
Forums
Classifieds
Links
Downloads
Extras
OS4 Zone
IRC Network
AmigaWorld Radio
Newsfeed
Top Members
Amiga Dealers
Information
About Us
FAQs
Advertise
Polls
Terms of Service
Search

IRC Channel
Server: irc.amigaworld.net
Channel: #Amigaworld
Channel Policy and Guidelines

(Uses JAVA Applet and Port 1024)
Visit the Chatroom Website

Who's Online
 49 guest(s) on-line.
 0 member(s) on-line.



You are an anonymous user.
Register Now!
 Jasper:  5 mins ago
 Barret:  5 mins ago
 freak:  12 mins ago
 gregthecanuck:  35 mins ago
 ggw:  36 mins ago
 Sir_RUSH:  1 hr 21 mins ago
 DustyA1200:  1 hr 22 mins ago
 TRIPOS:  1 hr 59 mins ago
 A1200:  2 hrs 7 mins ago
 Rob:  2 hrs 8 mins ago

/  Forum Index
   /  Amiga Gaming
      /  Does TFX work on a 060?
Register To Post

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 Next Page )
PosterThread
OneTimer1 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 5-Sep-2017 15:06:57
#21 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 228
From: Unknown

@BigD

The Cyberstorm MK1 does not have any build in 68040.libraries therefore a lot software will fail when used without startup-sequence ... (very uncomfortable when booting games from floppy)

And it is worth checking if the libraries are installed correctly (you may remember the special Phase5 68040.library).

If you ran in troubles using older software you can disable some of the caches.

--

Never ever try to modify the card with faster clock chips, this is a synchronous design and it will not work with you main board when used wit a wrong clock chip.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 5-Sep-2017 15:13:46
#22 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@OneTimer1

Quote:
And it is worth checking if the libraries are installed correctly (you may remember the special Phase5 68040.library).


No I don't really remember a 'special' library. TFX is not optimized for 060 so why should it be a surprise it trips over itself? The coder admitted that the 040 patch (executable) wasn't meant as a 060 patch and that none of the executables had ever been tested on a 060 while in active development

I have no intention of overclocking the mk1 as I've heard about the issues. Also the SCSI drives produce enough heat without the 060 being pushed too hard

Last edited by BigD on 06-Sep-2017 at 11:37 AM.
Last edited by BigD on 06-Sep-2017 at 11:35 AM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 6-Sep-2017 11:36:05
#23 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@Thread

TFX would have been a great game to show the potential of an 060 Amiga but it won't run and even if it did it probably wouldn't far exceed the performance of a 030 50Mhz 'miggy with FPU (which I can use to play the game)! It begs the question; why should I bother hacking the 060 to work?

Can NovaCoder get hold of the sources and weave his magic to create a 060 executable?

Last edited by BigD on 06-Sep-2017 at 11:39 AM.
Last edited by BigD on 06-Sep-2017 at 11:38 AM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Daedalus 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 6-Sep-2017 13:41:41
#24 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Jul-2003
Posts: 1586
From: Glasgow - UK, Irish born

@BigD

I've never had any trouble running the FPU or non-FPU version on my Blizzard 1260. When you say you don't remember any special libraries - you do need the correct 68040, 68040dummy and 68060 libraries to be able to use an '060 properly. Are they installed correctly? You'll need to check the file sizes and versions against a known good installation to be sure, or else just install them from scratch, but the standard 68040.library from AmigaOS *will* crash. Thor's MMU libraries package can also be used, but I don't know if that has any problems with TFX (I haven't run TFX since I installed the MMU package), so probably best to try it with the most up-to-date phase5 libraries first.

Anyway, as flight sims go it's alright, but it's absolutely crippled by running on AGA - if there was an RTG version it would run like greased lightning.

_________________
RobTheNerd.com | InstallerGen | SMBMounter | Atoms-X

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 6-Sep-2017 14:03:10
#25 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@Thread

Got Oxypatcher installed because MuRedox was a nightmare configuring FPFS Resources etc!!!

Now I can get music with every executable other than 040 version but not graphics just stays on the Workbench screen!!!

Last edited by BigD on 06-Sep-2017 at 02:08 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 6-Sep-2017 14:07:46
#26 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@Daedalus

i installed the 060 and dummy library as per the requirements for a MK1. Why would I mess with that? The MuRedox 060 and 040 libraries definitely don't work

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 6-Sep-2017 14:23:44
#27 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@Thread

Oh yeah and the configure file hangs the Amiga if I try and use that first!

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Hypex 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 6-Sep-2017 15:52:51
#28 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 8625
From: Greensborough, Australia

@BigD

Did you grab the latest from here?

http://phase5.a1k.org/

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 6-Sep-2017 16:20:26
#29 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@Hypex

Yes, I did just update the libraries. No difference. Strange I can no longer get to the menus on the non-FPU executable! I've gone backwards! However, I now get the menu music on everything but the 040 executable which hangs and the updated (patched) FPU executable which gives a "cannot read did &.pam" or something like that! I guess that Oxypatcher is at least fooling it I have a 68881/2 FPU?!

Last edited by BigD on 06-Sep-2017 at 04:24 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 06-Sep-2017 at 04:23 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
rvo 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 6-Sep-2017 18:11:37
#30 ]
Member
Joined: 27-May-2009
Posts: 75
From: Amsterdam

@BigD

I am running the FPU version since the 040 version never worked for me. but at least that works and I'd say it is quite performant.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 6-Sep-2017 18:35:49
#31 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@Thread

Ok, gave up on OS3.9 & BB 1 & 2 for this game and tried Workbench 3.1 with updated 060/040 libraries Oxypatcher, Setpatch enabled and my User_Startup copied from OS3.9 (yes not everything is recognised but it was a simple way to Assign the correct TFX directory).

Now the TFX_68000 executable works! I've got the Arcade menus and actially into a F-22 cockpit!!! Now need to re-read the manual / CU Amiga Magazines again to fugure out the controls!!

It's a bit laggy (no faster than the 030 from memory) and the flight instrument fonts are all flashing at me like it's Christmas but IT IS WORKING!

Although Oxypatcher is partially working it is telling me that MMU mode is not working when Workbench boots! And when I click on the TFX_FPU (patched_ executable it tells me it can't open the DID &.pam file whatever that is!!!

But hey that is good progress for today. The 040 executable still misbehaves and crashes the machine

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 6-Sep-2017 19:41:48
#32 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@Thread

So could it have been the fact that the game isn't coded to switch back to an AGA screen mode from a Picasso IV RTG one? Strange problem on OS3.9! That's the only thing I can think is an obvious issue as the Worbench 3.1 partition boots to an High Res AGA screen mode rather than a RTG Picasso IV one.

Last edited by BigD on 06-Sep-2017 at 11:22 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OneTimer1 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 7-Sep-2017 19:01:43
#33 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 228
From: Unknown

@BigD

Quote:

BigD wrote:

No I don't really remember a 'special' library. TFX is not optimized for 060 so why should it be a surprise it trips over itself?


A program doesn't need a special optimisation for the 060, it needs the 68040/68060 library that will fix some incompatibilities.



Quote:

BigD wrote:

i installed the 060 and dummy library as per the requirements for a MK1. Why would I mess with that? The MuRedox 060 and 040 libraries definitely don't work


Keep away from uncertain 3rd party software as long as your libraries are not installed properly.

Quote:

BigD wrote:

... is telling me that MMU mode is not working when Workbench boots ...


A lot of tools are reporting the MMU as 'not working' because you have not installed a program that is using it.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 7-Sep-2017 20:30:03
#34 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@OneTimer1

Quote:
A program doesn't need a special optimisation for the 060, it needs the 68040/68060 library that will fix some incompatibilities.


The 040 executable doesn't work so people with a 060 have to use either a FPU version written for a 68881/2 FPU that the 060 doesn't fully support in an like for like full instruction manner, or a standard Non FPU version. Both these executables mean the 060 is functioning at less than its optimal and yes NovaCoder has stated that a lot could be done to 'optimise' for the 060 if the source code was released.

Using the most up to date Cyberstorm libraries did nothing to improve the stability of the game only reverting to Workbench 3.1 made ANY difference (with the same libraries in use)!

Quote:
A lot of tools are reporting the MMU as 'not working' because you have not installed a program that is using it.


Since this is referring to an error message during booting I'd say it IS an setup issue and could effect the ability to run MuRedox as far as I understand. As it stands I'd rather cut off my arm than try and get this buggy game working with my OS 3.9 boot partition or to further try and / or get Oxypatcher/MuRedox working properly so that I can run the FPU version! It all sucks and takes too much time. I'd rather just play the game even if its the crippled Non_FPU version.

Last edited by BigD on 07-Sep-2017 at 08:53 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 07-Sep-2017 at 08:42 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 07-Sep-2017 at 08:33 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OneTimer1 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 8-Sep-2017 15:29:33
#35 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 228
From: Unknown

@BigD

Quote:

BigD wrote:
@OneTimer1

Quote:
A program doesn't need a special optimisation for the 060, it needs the 68040/68060 library that will fix some incompatibilities.


The 040 executable doesn't work so people with a 060 have to use either a FPU version ...



It's not only for the FPU, the 68060 can run into exception when jumping in a command that was loaded and pre decoded before.

Jumping in a code was a common optimisation technology on program code used in assembler, compilers and even the original ROMs.

And beside this cache exceptions there might be troubles with caches or MMUs set to unknown values.

Let me repeat the three most important advices for Cyberstorm MKI users:

You must install the Libraries

You must install the libraries

YOU MUST INSTALL THE LIBRARIES

Last edited by OneTimer1 on 08-Sep-2017 at 03:53 PM.
Last edited by OneTimer1 on 08-Sep-2017 at 03:30 PM.
Last edited by OneTimer1 on 08-Sep-2017 at 03:29 PM.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 8-Sep-2017 16:36:55
#36 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@OneTimer1

I don't know why you are banging on about this library point I HAD 060 and dummy 040 libraries installed and now I have the latest Phase 5 060 and dummy 040 libraries installed. So what is your point? Is this purely academic advice you're giving out? I simply tried the 'Boot without startup sequence' as a possible way of getting the game to load and yes after running Setpatch, etc I actually got further with that than with OS3.9 so it WAS worth doing. All the libraries (060 & dummy 040) installed on Workbench 3.1 was the solution however so you are now giving me the same advice after I've solved the problem! My hunch is that the game had issue with switching from RTG to AGA screen modes! If you want to help me to get the FPU executable working fair enough but I think most of us here know that a Phase 5 060 accelerator requires 060 and dummy 040 libraries installed in Libs to function!

I just had a go at the first F22 mission having found my old CU Amiga magazine guide / manual and also my old save game files (I've already completed the training back in the late 90s). It is fun and the laser targeting of ground targets came back to me. The sound seems to be a bit intermittent and I don't seem to be getting missile fire sound effects or the robotic flight computer / AWACS alerts of fighter aircraft approaching etc. It seem reasonable smooth even with all the gouraud shading, textures and field of view settings maxed out!

Last edited by BigD on 08-Sep-2017 at 04:54 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OneTimer1 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 8-Sep-2017 20:30:02
#37 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 228
From: Unknown

@BigD

Quote:

BigD wrote:
@OneTimer1

I don't know why ..



Because you where acting like someone ignoring it ... and showing no understanding in basic Amiga knowledge.

Last edited by OneTimer1 on 08-Sep-2017 at 08:30 PM.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 8-Sep-2017 22:33:11
#38 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@OneTimer1

You completely misunderstood what I wrote and then got fixated on 060 libraries rather than the ACTUAL problem i.e. getting a buggy game working that never made it out of beta and has a well known issue with it never being optimised or even tested on a 060 by the DiD coders!!! Thanks but your advice just became a lecture and no one needs that. Have you even played the game?

Plus Daedalus clarified whether I was using the up to date libraries and I confirmed that I was. Hypex even provided the link! Thanks guys by the way

Last edited by BigD on 08-Sep-2017 at 10:35 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 08-Sep-2017 at 10:35 PM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
BigD 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 8-Sep-2017 22:44:56
#39 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 4072
From: UK

@OneTimer1

P.S. If you actually wanted to help you could have offered some advice on the benefits of Oxypatcher versus MuRedox for 68881/2 compatibility!

As it happens I've now read in the CU Amiga TFX manual that they recommended Oxypatcher and a program called MCP to attempt to get the FPU version working well on a 060 machine. It's probably not going to help me if the TFX_FPU executable just fails reporting it can't open this DiD ?.pam file though

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Pixar Animation Studios

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
rvo 
Re: Does TFX work on a 060?
Posted on 9-Sep-2017 9:15:19
#40 ]
Member
Joined: 27-May-2009
Posts: 75
From: Amsterdam

@BigD

hmm that missing .pam file error sounds awfully familiar but its many years ago since I got it working. I remember there were various patched versions of the game of which one at least was working for me.

as for the screenmode issue, I wrote a little starter script that first switches to a PAL screenmode before starting the game because otherwise my monitor switcher did not recognise the PAL signal and just stayed at a frozen workbench screen.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 Next Page )

[ home ][ about us ] [ forums ][ classifieds ] [ links ][ news archive ] [ link to us ][ user account ]
Copyright 2000 - 2017 Amigaworld.net.

Amigaworld.net was originally founded by David Doyle