@bhabbott

Quote:

3D0 was designed by Dave Needle and RJ Mical, who helped develop the Amiga 1000. If their work was 'sci-fi' how come the A1000 wasn't? But 3DO was a commercial failure. Turns out just having 'sci-fi' hardware wasn't enough.

3DO's 2 million units sold are enough to fund 3DO M2, which is sold to Panasonic for $100 million.

Japan Inc's industrialists have told Panasonic not to compete against other Japanese game consoles e.g. Nintendo, Sega, and Sony. Panasonic cancels 3DO M2. Japan Inc's industrialists have some sort of "command and control" over Japanese companies; it's not a true free market.

IBM didn't give up on PPC 602, and it continued into PPE. 3DO M2 has two PPC 602.

Microsoft purchased the 3DO MX project, which later led to the IBM PPE-based Xbox 360. The X86-based Xbox was already at an advanced stage of development to switch over to big-endian PPC based game console e.g. Xbox 360 is big endian.

3DO MX has dual IBM PPC 602 and 128-bit graphics ASIC (led by a former SGI engineer). NVIDIA offered a low clocked 256-bit GeForce 4 Ti ASIC as NV2A with a DDR 128-bit bus (effectively 256-bit SDR). NVIDIA licensed AMD's DDR EV6 chipset technology for the nForce chipset.

NVIDIA easily defeats 3DO MX's ex-SGI efforts on performance vs cost.

AMD's DDR EV6 chipset implementation was supported by a certain C65 engineer who specialized in double-rate processing in CSG/MOS 65xx CPUs.

Reference
http://www.winnetmag.com/Article/ArticleID/17783/17783.html
Microsoft buys the 3DO MX project.


Microsoft reportedly working on game console
A Web Exclusive from WinInfo
Paul Thurrott

Microsoft Corporation reportedly intends to allow its next-generation WebTV device to compete with the Nintendo 64 and Sony Playstation game consoles. The story is rather complicated, but it goes something like this: A few years ago, a company called 3DO was working its own next-generation game console, which was dubbed the M2. The M2 contained three key technologies which were pretty impressive for their day: DVD playback, MPEG3 decoding, and a new chipset called MX. When it became clear that 3DO was going to have to exit the hardware market for financial reasons, it sold the M2 technology to Samsung, which created a division called CagEnt that had two years to make money with it.

CagEnt's MX chipset from the M2 technology utilized two PowerPC 602 microprocessors at the time: the same CPU that powers Apple Macintosh computers. In late 1997, Nintendo visited CagEnt in search of a new 3D chipset since its relationship with Silicon Graphics had fallen apart and sales of the Nintendo 64 were slower than expected. In early 1998, Nintendo officially terminated its relationship with ailing Silicon Graphics and offered to buy CagEnt outright.

While details of the sale continued, Nintendo worked with CagEnt to wrap its MX chipset around a MiPS processor, as the company's consoles use NEC MiPS CPUs, not PowerPC. The plan was for the new MX-based machine, complete with hardware 3D, DVD-ROM, and cartridge capabilities to be ready in time for Christmas 1999. Unfortunately for Nintendo, talks with Samsung broke down within a few months.

That's where Microsoft stepped in.

In Early April, the company bought CagEnt through its WebTV division, acquiring all of the assets of CagEnt and its key personnel. Microsoft's plan is to use the MX technology as the core of its next WebTV device, which will clearly be used for more than Email and Web browsing. In fact, Microsoft has quietly been gaining the knowledge it needs to compete in the game console market through its parternship with Sega and it's likely that a Microsoft-backed, Windows CE-based WebTV device could even be co-created with that company.

All this puts Nintendo in a bind, of course, and the company will be unable to create a new console in time for Christmas 1999 now. Its current plan is for the next device to reach stores in late 2000 instead, though its unclear who they will be able to partner with to make such a goal.


Repost source from https://www.neogaf.com/threads/3do-mx-chipset-the-technology-nintendo-almost-used-in-an-n64-successor-for-1999.350196/#post-14521122

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@matthey

Quote:

The combined IP of the Amiga alliance and the new Commodore business would be impressive and daunting to Commodore/Amiga IP challengers. There is the problem that the new Commodore business is shady in some ways which usually only gets worse. Maybe they will realize they need to become more professional than the original Commodore business in order to correct history and possibly join the Arcadia alliance, perhaps as the Commodore alliance.

The old Commodore gave customers a benefit; Commodore's large buying power reduced prices for potential customers. This new Commodore doesn't have the old Commodore's buying strength.

Broadcom's large SoC production scale and inside connections helped RPi.

The problem is the next step after obtaining the brand IP.

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@Hammer

Quote:

The problem is the next step after obtaining the brand

There are many steps and a lot of paperwork.
People expect this to all be magically accomplished with the wave of a magic wand.

There is a new corporate entity in Delaware for example. There are assets to be officially transferred, which is different than just stating ownership. It's a long list...

#6

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@number6

It made a good YouTube video. I'm bored now. It's a very expensive gamble to own a logo that reminds me personally of Mehdi Ali and Irving Gould! I know there's some old patents but they don't apply to the Amiga as Acer got those from Gateway! Sad! They'll soon find the nightmare of IP trolls quite hard to bear without the turnover of all the cheap tat merchandising that they can muster! It is all very well having principles before the lawsuits begin!

Last edited by BigD on 10-Jul-2025 at 03:40 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 10-Jul-2025 at 03:39 PM.

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"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@thread

The patreon preview thought to be scheduled for yesterday (Thursday) was cancelled due to...
reasons.

It might appear today or prior to the public release of part 3 tomorrow.

#6

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@BigD

Quote:

BigD wrote: It's a very expensive gamble to own a logo that reminds me personally of Mehdi Ali and Irving Gould! ...

and Jim Butterfield and Chuck Peddle ... that where the times when C= was big.

@OneTimer1

Chuck was treated like a criminal for leaving for Apple and then coming back cap in hand! He was a pioneer of the computer industry and they treated him like dirt!

The Chicken Lips brand is a bit toxic if you ask me!

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@thread

Website to be unveiled tomorrow.

Tone of postings (700 hundred or so) from somewhat negative old school fans, turned on a dime.

Stay tuned.

#6

Added link:
patreon postings etc.

Last edited by number6 on 11-Jul-2025 at 06:22 PM.

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*Secrecy has served us so well*

@number6

More details including new product

#6

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@thread

Are not words vs reality amusing?

Quote:

ust to avoid people getting confused, and with people already commenting on posts. The recent news ref the Commodore brand has no real relevance to us, nor the pending THE A1200, nor in fact any of our products in general. We will be making announcements on our revised release timeline soon, but to be very clear once again, the Commodore brand news is not relevant to our releases, but to also be very clear all is well with all our pending releases, keep watching

Source June 28

Yet now less than 2 weeks later:

Quote:

as well as The64Mini and TheC64 Maxi from Retro Games Limited, so they have obviously struck a partnership deal with them as well.

Source today

And yes, you can take the above posting to the bank.

#6

Last edited by number6 on 11-Jul-2025 at 08:20 PM.

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@thread

See prior post for reference please.

Are you working with Retro Games Ltd.?

Exactly as expected.

#6

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@thread

Quote:

There is a new corporate entity in Delaware for example. There are assets to be officially transferred, which is different than just stating ownership. It's a long list...

That one confirmed too at the bottom of every page.

#6

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@matthey

thinking back to your list

funny. I mentioned somewhere that where RJ goes, likely others would follow. Nice to see Haynie at Commodore once again.

Also the Tramiel family etc.

Quote:

Leonard Tramiel CTO (Chief Tramiel Officer)

#6

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#6 Quote:

thinking back to your list funny. I mentioned somewhere that where RJ goes, likely others would follow. Nice to see Haynie at Commodore once again.

RJ was an Amiga Corporation software engineer while Dave was a Commodore hardware engineer so they likely barely knew each other. RJ is not on the new list ... yet.

https://www.commodore.net/team

There are several new names not on my list including Sean Donohue (Co-Founder & COO), John Errico (Legal Counsel), Leo Nigro (Co-Founder & Lead Engineer), Colin Proudfoot (Co-Brand Ambassador & Strategic Advisor), Alex Rozenblat (Co-Founder & CFO), Jake Young (CTO) and Leonard Tramiel (Chief Tramiel Officer).

#6 Quote:

Also the Tramiel family etc. Quote: Leonard Tramiel CTO (Chief Tramiel Officer)

Joke but confusing as CTO is normally "Chief Technology Officer" and Jake Young is listed as CTO. It would be nice if ceremonial/advisory/consulting roles were separated from officers. They did separate "launch partners" and "support staff" this time which is helpful. That would be quite a payroll if they payed everyone on the list, especially considering they may not have sold 5,000 Commodore computers yet between the Commodore 64X and Commodore 64U. Peri is doing a good job of promoting, connecting the heritage/legacy and has more "faithful" hardware with the FPGA based Commodore 64 Ultimate now which is more appealing to Commodore fans. I like what the new Commodore is doing better than the new Atari with their deep pockets (deep pockets, non-faithful hardware and market control reminds me of Trevor's AmigaNOne). The prices are not bad for the Commodore 64 Ultimate considering it is faithful hardware but it could be better. Amiga Corporation may be able to produce Amiga A1200 MiSTer+MiSTress boards in larger quantities for cheaper, perhaps even for a similar price, although they would fall short of being an Ultimate Amiga with the 68k Amiga able to deliver much more value. There is a bar which shows how many of the Commodore 64 Ultimate preorder lots are available and likely indicates preorders.

https://www.commodore.net/product-page/commodore-64-ultimate-basic-beige-batch1 Quote:

9713 C64s left on the launchpad - Batch 1

Maybe 287 of 10,000 Commodore 64 Ultimate basic units preordered?

https://www.commodore.net/product-page/commodore-64-ultimate-starlight-edition-batch1 Quote:

9844 C64s left on the launchpad - Batch 1

Maybe 156 of 10,000 Commodore 64 Ultimate starlight units preordered?

https://www.commodore.net/product-page/commodore-64-ultimate-collectible-founders-edition-batch1 Quote:

6172 C64s left on the launchpad

Maybe 228 of 6,400 Commodore 64 Ultimate gold founders units preordered?

That would be 671 units preordered total. The sales will be interesting to watch as Peri releases videos to the public. I expect Commodore will sell thousands and may eventually sell out the first batches. I doubt it will reach THEA500 Mini territory, likely in the hundreds of thousands of units sold, do to the price, the Amiga brand being better today and the Amiga being more modern and usable. More faithful hardware than THEA500 Mini at a lower price and with much better value is possible too which may reach millions of units sold with toy/RPi prices. Price and value are very important.

Last edited by matthey on 12-Jul-2025 at 05:03 PM.

@matthey

Indeed the list changed. There are imo...
(1)name drops going back to vid 1
(2)supporters
(3)actual workforce

I think this is still evolving.
If you look at the comment section of the commercial vid on the home page, you'll see even more
current information.
Also what the patreons are posting does not match what the store illustrates.
Again I just think things are happening faster than they can keep up with.

Let's give things a chance to settle down. heh.

#6

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@matthey

Beyond $100 disposable price range and below Apple's status symbol high-price products, most customers will be looking at value vs performance factors.

As of my post for https://www.commodore.net/product-page/commodore-64-ultimate-collectible-founders-edition-batch1

5995 C64Us are left on the launchpad.

US$499.99 asking price for a slowish C64 FPGA + C64 clear RGB case + China assembly is not competitive.

C64U's FPGA is built around an AMD Artix 7 FPGAS.

QMTECH's AMD Artix7 XC7A15T SDRAM Core Board has US $29.90 on AliExpress.

Specs of Commodore 64 Ultimate from https://www.tomshardware.com/video-games/retro-gaming/the-commodore-64-ultimate-computer-is-the-companys-first-hardware-release-in-over-30-years-pre-orders-start-at-usd299

200+ DMIPs AMD MicroBlaze softcore can run on Artix 7 FPGAS. Cite from https://www.xilinx.com/support/documents/product-briefs/artix7-product-brief.pdf

The MicroBlaze V processor is AMD's RISC-V compatible processor IP implementation.


https://www.amd.com/en/products/software/adaptive-socs-and-fpgas/microblaze.html#details
A table for MicroBlaze V processor's DMIPS vs Mhz vs FPGA scaling.

FPGA 68080 V4 (via Intel Cyclone V) reaching 110 MHz is within the ballpark of FPGA MicroBlaze V's 128 Mhz (177 DMIPS) to 343 Mhz (473 DMIPS) for "Application Processor" use case.

Last edited by Hammer on 13-Jul-2025 at 01:49 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 13-Jul-2025 at 01:47 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 13-Jul-2025 at 01:34 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 13-Jul-2025 at 01:09 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 13-Jul-2025 at 01:08 AM.

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@thread

The Cost:

Quote:

Yes, the equivalent of $ 2,160,000 US dollars was quoted in the Computes! Gazette Magazine #1 feature article, so that is correct.

Patreon post quoting the exclusive Compute article

#6

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@matthey

£220+ for another C64? Didn't C= try that with the C128 and C65? Why is this better than the RGL THEC64 which is around £130? That's one hell of a C= tax! I get it, computing was less distracting when we just had a Basic screen on booting but you are paying through the nose for this! Built on pure nostalgia! I'd prefer a new Vectrex!

Last edited by BigD on 13-Jul-2025 at 08:45 AM.

_________________
"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@BigD

Because it's not FPGA?

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@BigD

Quote:

BigD wrote: Why is this better than the RGL THEC64 which is around £130?

From a comment forum:

Quote:

The circuit board works with actual C64 cartridges and peripherals, which is something that an emulator would never do. $299 is a pretty good price I think. For comparison, the TheC64 Maxi from RetroGames Ltd which does emulation on an ARM chip,, a rubber-dome keyboard, and no support for original peripherals (without the use of external adaptor) used to cost $120 when it was released, but is often listed for over $250 now.

Source:
https://www.tomshardware.com/video-games/retro-gaming/the-commodore-64-ultimate-computer-is-the-companys-first-hardware-release-in-over-30-years-pre-orders-start-at-usd299