@simplex
True. Italians have had many cultural and ethnic influences over a long history. There still are certain features that make people think someone may be Italian. Of the group, I would have guessed Alex Rozenblat as Italian first followed by Christian and Mike who also have German features. John Errico is difficult for me to place but the last name is maybe a hint. They did not dress too much like tourists but their clothing still likely stands out some. As you say, speaking is the sure give away though.

The dark Italian I know is Sicilian showing that Italian diversity. Skin complexion can change in one generation but he has the complexion of his father and brother while his mother is moderately lighter. Oddly, some people mistook my mother as Italian even though she is mostly German while I look more German like my father who is also mostly German. My mom would sometimes prank people with her best Italian accent which was good enough to fool some people here.

@matthey

I've known lots of non-Sicilian southern Italians with dark skin. Northern Italians, not so much. Northern Italians are more likely to have light-colored hair, which is rare among southern Italians. (Not counting highlights: Giorgia Meloni is not a natural blonde, and it's a crying shame that she and so many Italian women dye their hair blonde.)

I was once told that curly hair among southern Italians is typically a sign of Greek ancestry. 'Twas a Calabrian who told me that, Therefore It Must Be True (TM).

Anyway, so many Italians (including southern Italians) now have office jobs that a lot of their darker skin color tends not to stand out as much as it ordinarily would. Exposure to the sun helps bring that out, at least in my experience.

_________________

@simplex

Quote:

Anyway, so many Italians (including southern Italians) now have office jobs that a lot of their darker skin color tends not to stand out as much as it ordinarily would.

THAT IS A SHOCKING NOTION!!!!!!!!

I and the world at large were certain that Italy was a rural economy,
legions of plows plowing through the rich, fertile soil,
women with large waists and floral headscarves scattering seeds under the scorching sun.

Anyway,
congratulations to Matthey on derailing a thread like never a thread had been derailed before,
lecturing on NO LESS THAN SKIN COLORS AND FAMILY NAMES this time!

My friends I truly, TRULY wonder what ailment, what dreadful impairment poisons the mind and the life of this person who genuinely regards himself as a polymath while peddling tires, and almost single handedly destroyed THIS BEAUTIFUL AMIGA WORLD WE ONCE CHERISHED (I'd attribute a good 50% to him, 35% to Cdimauro, 15% to hammmer)


/M~~

Last edited by MEGA_RJ_MICAL on 16-Jun-2026 at 04:33 AM.

_________________
I HAVE ABS OF STEEL
--
CAN YOU SEE ME? CAN YOU HEAR ME? OK FOR WORK

@MEGA_RJ_MICAL

UGH. Rereading this after the fact, I realize that the tongue-in-cheek nature of what I'd written was probably completely lost and could offend some people I'd much rather not offend, so I deleted it.

Quote:

Anyway, congratulations to Matthey on derailing a thread like never a thread had been derailed before, lecturing on NO LESS THAN SKIN COLORS AND FAMILY NAMES this time!

I get what you're saying, but after 26 pages of -- honestly, I can't be bothered to summarize, even if it were humanly possible, perhaps your AI-in-progress can do it? -- isn't it a little much to blame Matthey for derailing this thread by discussing skin colors and family names? This thread had gone off the rails a long time ago.

I'd understand if you were complaining that he had derailed a derailed thread, especially if that derailed thread were somewhat valuable, but... again, after 26+ pages, it's surely a lost cause.

Last edited by simplex on 16-Jun-2026 at 03:47 AM.

_________________

Quote:

simplex wrote: @MEGA_RJ_MICAL UGH. Rereading this after the fact, I realize that the tongue-in-cheek nature of what I'd written was probably completely lost and could offend some people I'd much rather not offend, so I deleted it.

WORRY NOT! I made sure to preserve it in a complete, well documented quote.

Quote:

- isn't it a little much to blame Matthey for derailing this thread by discussing skin colors and family names? (...) I'd understand if you were complaining that he had derailed a derailed thread, especially if that derailed thread were somewhat valuable, but... again, after 26+ pages, it's surely a lost cause.

Friend Simplex,
never a chance to blame such vermin should go wasted.

Valuable or not, this thread or others, the derailing continues relentlessly leaving nothing but a barren land roamed by madmen foaming at the mouth as the babble about picoseconds and 1/4th of cpu cycles.

JOIN ME, AND TOGETHER WE WILL RULE THIS PARTICULAR, NICHE, MOSTLY FORGOTTEN GALAXY


~~~~ MEGA (RJM) ~~~~

_________________
I HAVE ABS OF STEEL
--
CAN YOU SEE ME? CAN YOU HEAR ME? OK FOR WORK

@simplex

I guess people complaining about the derail of a thread are more on topic somehow... like, by magic

_________________
Indigo 3D Lounge, my second home.
The Illusion of Choice | Am*ga

secret is known now

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixD_fqrnA_c

a reduced smartphone with blocked functionality and a different OS (Sailfish OS). Browser and social media are blocked on system level so it seems you cannot activate them even if you want. Price starting with 499 $

Nothing for me...

@OlafS25

it seems no 5G support

@OlafS25

Heise.de has an article about it:

heise.de (English)

Despite forgoing Android, the phone is said to be compatible with over 99 percent of all Android apps via the Android runtime environment. Commodore names WhatsApp, Maps, Uber, and Spotify, among others.

Heise.de deutsch

@OneTimer1

it is on system level blocking functionality like browser

so what does this 99% say?

I would have used android instead and install less

so customer can iadd themselves what they want (or not)

besides the too high price for a second device

@MEGA_RJ_MICAL

Quote:

WORRY NOT! I made sure to preserve it in a complete, well documented quote.

That might be very helpful, actually. Once people see the sorts of things I say & withdraw lest someone be offended, I should be forever inoculated against accusations that I say something genuinely offensive.

Then again, the world has gotten so much stupider over my lifetime, so maybe not.

Quote:

JOIN ME, AND TOGETHER WE WILL RULE THIS PARTICULAR, NICHE, MOSTLY FORGOTTEN GALAXY

Would that I had the time & talent for humor. I mean, aside from the stepping-on-a-rake-that-smacks-you-in-the-face type of humor. All too good at that.

_________________

@OlafS25

I'm kind of glad to see Sailfish OS is still kicking around. I don't think it's available where I live, but I'm not a big of either Apple or Google, even more so after my experience trying to develop Android apps. So I would love to use a device of theirs if one day they sell it here. Even if they branded it Commodore.

_________________

@matthey

Quote:

There still are certain features that make people think someone may be Italian.

🤌🤌🤌

_________________
B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC

@thread

I'm perplexed about the C= Callback. The Clicks Communicator, which was created according to the same "disconnect" philosophy, has a better keyboard and screen for only $199 USD. The Commodore branding does not give it an additional $300 of value, does it? A basic flip phone is a bargain at under $50 bucks. I'm perplexed? Perhaps the Callback has ZORRAM?

_________________
I sold my SAM460ex lite... waiting for money to buy a Raspberry Pi... or a Classic A1000 with Buffee... or an A1222... and OS4.3 FE update 11

@PhantomInterrogative

Yes, C= Callback for 499 doesn't make much sense.
maybe for lt. 200$, SailfishOS + Webbrowser but as an
Ex-User of an Ubunto OneTouch phone I'm skeptic.

Clicks Communicator, looks interesting.

Last edited by OneTimer1 on 16-Jun-2026 at 11:37 PM.

CHRIST ALMIGHTY WHAT A SPECTACULAR FAILURE

Every """company""" who carried the name Commodore in the last couple decades was spit upon for the heinous act of just slapping a Commodore logo on some random unrelated device.

So what does the oh so righteous, oh so loyal to the users Peri Fartic do?
A FIVE HUNDRED AMERICAN DOLLARS FLIPHONE

that among other things manages to make sure not to please ANYONE:

we greybeards old timers are comforted by retro looks, so they made it look somewhat modern, with a touch of those RGB leds that 15 years old gamers love so much.

young people and generally speaking people who like to actually use the devices they buy need connectivity and compatibility, so they stripped it off essential applications and used a non-100% Android compatbile OS.

WELL DONE!!!!!!!

Reminds me of NG Amigas:
None of the looks or feeling of what made legacy Amigas unique,
none of the power and usability of a modern computer.

TREVOR!!!!!!!!!YOU SHOULD JOIN MR. FARTIC, TOGETHER YOU MIGHT OR MIGHT NOT RULE SOME GALAXY what I used this recently GOODBYE



/M!!!!!!!!!!!

_________________
I HAVE ABS OF STEEL
--
CAN YOU SEE ME? CAN YOU HEAR ME? OK FOR WORK

@MEGA_RJ_MICAL

Quote:

MEGA_RJ_MICAL wrote: Reminds me of NG Amigas: None of the looks or feeling of what made legacy Amigas unique,

Well, depends on what you define as " feeling of what made legacy Amigas unique"

A huge crowd is would define it as beige keyboard cases.

Quote:

MEGA_RJ_MICAL wrote: none of the power and usability of a modern computer.

If you want to have power and usability of modern computers you need the same hardware like a modern computer and for usability, you would need software with a lot of built in features that didn't exist in bare Amigas.

OneTimer1 Quote:

If you want to have power and usability of modern computers you need the same hardware like a modern computer and for usability, you would need software with a lot of built in features that didn't exist in bare Amigas.

RPi hardware was initially barely modern using antiquated smartphone SoCs. The original RPi single scalar ARM11 CPU was in many ways less advanced than the 68060 with lower integer performance/MHz. The key to success was aggressively lowering the price and standardizing the hardware. A small memory footprint of 512 MiB was an important part of this strategy by choosing a 32-bit cut down Linux OS and ARM Thumb-2 ISA. Eben Upton tried to further reduce the footprint with a cut down 256MiB SBC and a version of RISC OS for RPi MCUs but Linux is too fat to work well on the former and the original ARM Archimedes spiritual inspiration did not have the code density of the 68k Amiga for the latter.

The new Commodore Callback phone is a minimalist smartphone in functionality but is it in hardware? The same SoC that powered the original RPi likely could be used for the phone and 512 MiB should be more than enough right? It likely has much more expensive hardware though.

What is the minimum memory for the most recent Sailfish OS?
Google AI Overview Quote:

While the core Sailfish OS itself can run on 2 GB of RAM, 4 GB to 6 GB of RAM is the realistic minimum for smooth, modern usage. If you plan to use Android apps or memory-heavy web browsers, 4 GB is the recommended floor, and 6-8 GB is preferred to prevent crashes. Hardware & Storage Requirements o RAM: 4 GB or more is recommended by Jolla documentation for a stable experience. o Storage Space: You will need at least 15 GB of free space for a default Sailfish installation. o System Partition: The core system root requires at least 4 GB. o User Data: For photos, videos, and app data, 32GB+ of storage (or a MicroSD card) is recommended.

The Sailfish OS supports ARM 32-bit (Thumb-2) but it is fat and if 4 GiB is required to run well, a 64-bit version of the OS compiled for ARM AArch64 likely requires at least 20% more memory. The problem is that, "It is Linux-based with AppSupport, a proprietary compatibility layer for Android and custom user interface by Jolla." A 32-bit Linux OS with a GUI on a RPi SBC with 512 MiB is already tight for memory but then we add this "compatibility layer for Android". Android uses a virtual machine with Dalvik bytecode. The JIT virtual machine is like AmigaNOwhere or a 68k Amiga virtual machine where the A600GS uses 4 GiB of memory to provide 1 GiB of memory to the virtual 68k Amiga. The Dalvik bytecode is not actually an 8-bit byte code like JVM but uses a more efficient 16-bit fixed length encoding like SuperH and the original ARM Thumb that was replaced by the more efficient yet 16-bit variable length encoding (VLE) of Thumb-2. A 16-bit VLE is considered state of the art for compresses ISAs like Thumb-2, RVC (RISC-V compressed) and the ignored 68k despite potentially having the best code density with room for improvement.

Are Dalvik byte code programs or 68k programs smaller on average?
Google AI Overview Quote:

68k (Motorola 68000 series) machine code is smaller on average than Dalvik bytecode. Because 68k instructions are heavily compressed and variable in length (often spanning just 2 or 4 bytes), they represent a highly dense instruction set. In contrast, Dalvik bytecode uses fixed, 16-bit units for most instructions, with some requiring 32 or 64 bits explicitly to encode register locations, object references, and literals. o 68k (Motorola): A CISC (Complex Instruction Set Computer) architecture that prioritizes saving encoded instruction bits over larger silicon die sizes. It has a minimum instruction length of 16 bits but heavily relies on short 2-byte opcodes for basic operations, resulting in very compact binary footprints. o Dalvik Bytecode: The intermediate distribution format for Android apps. To make interpretation and JIT/AOT execution faster on mobile processors, Dalvik utilizes a register-based architecture where most instructions are encoded in 16-bit (2-byte) code units. However, the bytecode must explicitly encode source and destination registers, making individual instructions longer on average compared to traditional, tightly packed assembly.

Thumb-2 or even Thumb native code would have been more compact and was supported by most of the smartphones but there was a lack of standardization among smartphone SoCs. ARM64/AArch64 later addressed the lack of CPU standardization with a fat 64-bit standard using a 32-bit fixed length encoding with a mediocre code density. The result is a lack of smartphones with small memory footprints executing native code and the virtual machine requiring much more powerful CPUs than would normally be necessary.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalvik_(software)#Performance Quote:

Tests performed on ARMv7 devices in 2010 by Oracle (owner of the Java technology) with standard non-graphical Java benchmarks showed the HotSpot VM of Java SE embedded to be 2–3 times faster than the JIT-based Dalvik VM of Android 2.2 (the initial Android release that included a JIT compiler). In 2012, academic benchmarks confirmed the factor of 3 between HotSpot and Dalvik on the same Android board, also noting that Dalvik code was not smaller than Hotspot. Furthermore, as of March 2014, benchmarks performed on an Android device still show up to a factor 100 between native applications and a Dalvik application on the same Android device. Upon running benchmarks using the early interpreter of 2009, both Java Native Interface (JNI) and native code showed an order of magnitude speedup.

Dalvik bytecode was not compact and did not result in good JIT performance so it was replaced by the Android Runtime (ART) using ahead of time (AOT) compilation in Android but not for Sailfish OS. ART generally uses more memory at run time and more storage which it trades for performance and reduced power consumption so it does not solve the inefficient virtual machine problem.

Existing Commodore retro customers may have been happier with a much cheaper C64 64 kiB of memory phone. OS and compiler support are difficult with the 6502 family of CPU cores though. Also, the 6502 family is so primitive that it is difficult to upgrade, memory bank switching is needed for addressing more than 64 kiB of memory and it does not have good code density. The next best option for Commodore retro appeal is the 68k Amiga which is modular and easily upgradeable, has a large flat 32-bit address space (and could be upgraded to 64-bit better than x86-64), has Thumb-2 like code density with better performance potential, has good OS and compiler support and is easier to use. The 68k Amiga would make a super minimal smartphone but it would still be difficult to compete in that market without a small footprint destroying Android compatibility layer. As with the Commodore Callback, a smartphone that can not fulfill all of a customer's needs is likely a pass as few people carry multiple smartphones with them. This is also why the "digital detox" strategy of arbitrarily limiting the phone is a fail too along with the decreased value. We need more open and usable hardware, especially from the hardware we bought and own, although this has to be balanced with security which is difficult. I understand the unhealthy dependency on smartphones and smartphone apps that some businesses likely deliberately require for access but removing the access altogether is not the answer.

So why a Commodore phone? The same reason there was a C64X before the C64U. It is easier to use commodity hardware with free software to slap a label on than to innovate, acquire and develop which requires economies of scale with computers. The C64U won over many skeptical 8-bit retro fans and Christian claims financial success but does not talk about a profit.

https://commodore.net/where-does-commodore-go-from-here/ Quote:

We’re officially out of pre-order mode for some models, although they are selling out fast themselves, and we’re coming really close to the final Founders Edition of the original breadbin being sold out. So if you’ve had your eye on that golden goodness — well, it’s time to act now. We’ve manufactured over 30,000 new Commodore 64s and counting, with revenue that puts us in the top 0.01% of startups — making Commodore a bit of an extreme statistical outlier. We just launched on Best Buy as well, and we got a ten-out-of-ten review from many outlets, including that one from IGN, who called it a masterpiece. Which is… yeah. No words.

It looks like the new Commodore has done an amazing job at manufacturing but it is difficult to make a profit with just 30,000 units sold. It has likely not been a profitable enough product for follow on retro products either like a C65 or C128 and Commodore experience is not to Osborne the current product like the Amiga 1200 announcement did to the Amiga 600, a major contributor leading to Commodore's demise. Dave Haynie made a comment to a C128 request in the Commodore reveal video.

MartinAlejandroLiguori Quote:

Please don't use the commodore brand for this... we want a commodore 128... an amiga 500, 1200... a phone??? ... I hope this is a joke...

DaveHaynie Quote:

I think "we" also want Commodore products that assure we get more Commodore products in the future. Would I love a new Commodore 128? I would. But Commodore only sold about 6 million Commodore 128s... if you simply scaled the C64U sales vs original C64 sales, it doesn't make a great deal of sense to make a new 128. Just not enough people who know what a C128 was... and as the #2 HW guy on the C128, I'm not saying this with any happiness in my heart. Just the reality... I want them to succeed. Already, Peri is doing something that Commodore didn't do in the 11+ years I worked there: planning products at the corporate level, with an overall strategy. Back in the day, it was Engineering pushing this or that and trying to confuse, coerce, cajole, or confound the management into letting us at least build a "trial balloon" prototype and get it front of marketing people at Commodore and buyers at CES, CeBit, etc. But I digress...

Commodore: The Next Chapter Unfolds | Official Reveal Video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixD_fqrnA_c

Dave understandably did not address the Amiga request which is common in the largely negative comments. The flexibility and upgradeability of a 68k Amiga has the potential for mass appeal and the small footprint could find its way into cheap embedded products but only if ditching these virtual machines, returning to innovating & engineering and refocusing on value again. Commodore selling some Commodore branded merchandise to help pay for retro products is understandable but I still feel like the Commodore Callback misses the mark as a minimalist bloated smartphone, especially if minimalist efficient handheld hardware could be in the future.