@Cod3r

the problem with changing of aros license was as far as i understood, that every contributor would have to agree, too many of them to trace and ask everyone. thet is of course a dark side of open source..

@wawa

My friend, I TOTALLY understand what you are saying, but I have ZERO control over what my bosses want to hear or believe. I wish I could have taken a picture of his face when I told him the code wasn't GPL.

If you worked for the guy, trust me, you wouldn't push the issue either. The job market is tight here in the States. I don't want to go from upper 5 figures a year, to programming the menus for cash registers at McDonalds for $10 an hour

Quote:

wawa wrote: okay, thats another reason to talk directly to jason as he was taking major part in licensing discussion lately. im quite sure this can be worked out, if both sides (ie cod3r and aros team) take it serious and show some insight. aros is being made with openness in mind in the end. but, cod3r, you will need somehow to prove you are serious too to aros team if you want their support in such an essential matter. therefore i encourage you again to register and talk about it at their forums. it has no reason to discuss it here as neither os4 nor mos comes into question for technical and licensing reasons. os4 as example only supports hand chosen ppc hardware, the team makes port themselves and let them pay good money, some 50k eur as one of betatester confirmed. the only alternatives that come to my mind is to 1)look for another hardware, which means practically start another project from the scratch 2) keep your hardware and license directly original amiga kickstarts, at best from cloanto, as jens shoenfeld, individual computers, seems to proceed: http://www.amiga-news.de/en/news/AN-2012-07-00058-EN.html Quote: We're currently negotiating about including Kickstart licenses into the ACA500, so the built-in flashrom can be pre-loaded with different Kickstart licenses. but it will likely meet same distrust on part of your employer. 3) regard this board (which is an attempted amiga 4000 accelerator, you will need the original machine), which is just in an early project stadium now, eventually join the team and base your 68k solution on that. you might even be able to earn some money here, i dont know.. http://ultimateppc.nl/

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@Franko

You said it, not me. I will try my best not to "observe" and say too much around here. It is a bit hard to believe you've been banned, you seem quite even keeled. Was your evil twin the guilty party?

Quote:

Franko wrote: @Cod3r I know your mew to the whole online Amiga scene but as you have found out yourself now, "just saying it like it is" is a big No No in online Amigaland... Even though I've been an Amiga user for over 26 years non stop, I've only been part of the online Amiga scene for just over 2 of them and in that time I've had a lifetime ban and countless other bans for "saying it like it is"... You see no matter what your told by those wielding the tiniest bit of perceived power in online Amigaland, there is one rule for one lot and a different set for others, as you in your short time here have sadly found out... Why it's that way I could say but I'd better not as it usually leads to another ban... I just hope your experience here so far has not put you off with your project and you shrug it off and continue with your project...

@Cod3r
Looking forward to seeing your video.whatever you decide to do is cool.i try not to take amiga.org too seriously.If a person beavers away on a good project eventually all the naysayers will quietly stump up cash for it anyways.Ill bet for example alot of people will buy the fpgaarcade once they see how cool it will be.Actually it might be worth talking with mike j to see if you can help out with the fpgaarcade or what not.http://www.fpgaarcade.com/

@wawa

They would REALLY have to ask everyone who ever contributed? If so, that's highly unlikely and improbable.

GPL has the FSF and their legal backing, so that is a good and safe license for coders, but some companies (clients of my company) find the GPL to be like a virus.

Often they want to base their proprietary works on GPL code, but they can't, because they would have to release it all to the public if they distribute it outside of their organization.

That's why from time to time, I am asked to re-implement stuff to circumvent the GPL requirements. My company even has a GPL-free Linux kernel, though i've done very little to contribute to it.

@Cod3r

Off-topic regarding your posts #259 and #262.

You have "hanging quotes" which affect the page layout.

Simple fix. Edit post and add a space before your end quotes, which follow your links.

Thanks and back to topic.

#6

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@Cod3r

Quote:

My friend, I TOTALLY understand what you are saying

and i have about zero influence on aros team. i only provide you with information ive red on the dev list, in case it might be useful to you.

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@adrianbrowne

Thanks. I am trying to get myself ready for the criticism about why didn't I film it better/with more lighting/better camera once it's done. I didn't have a tripod, so I had to lean the camera on a coffee cup.

Problem is, whether they like it or not, I can't sell the board anyway since it isn't my design.

BTW, have you ever realized how slow YouTube can be for uploading?! This is ridiculous. 15 minutes of video is taking an eternity. I bet if I were uploading a Kim Kardashian video, it would encode instantly

Quote:

adrianbrowne wrote: @Cod3r Looking forward to seeing your video.whatever you decide to do is cool.i try not to take amiga.org too seriously.If a person beavers away on a good project eventually all the naysayers will quietly stump up cash for it anyways.Ill bet for example alot of people will buy the fpgaarcade once they see how cool it will be.Actually it might be worth talking with mike j to see if you can help out with the fpgaarcade or what not.http://www.fpgaarcade.com/

@Cod3r

With 14 pages of responses in this thread, I can only imagine that your project and this discussion has stirred up a lot of interest. Either that, or there are just the same few posters who you are writing back and forth with in this thread. I have not had the time to read through all of the pages of replies in this thread.

I do hope that there has not been too much negative remarks to dissuade you from continuing your project.

I am sure you have probably had a chance to realize by now that there are all kinds of Amiga users who populate these forums. It is probably best to take all of them with a bit of skepticism, at least until you get to know them better. You can include me in your skepticism too, if you like, until you have had a chance to learn more about me as well.

The Amiga community is definitely not a place for the faint of heart and many get scared off by the criticism and naysayers, before they have a chance to even get close to succeeding with what ever project they are proposing, or working on.

Good Luck, and please keep us posted on your progress and any changes that might come up.

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@Cod3r

Quote:

I am speaking in the sense of being officially recognized as something other than a "hobby" OS.

I think we argue a lot about if AmigaOS can be ever anything else then “Hobby” OS maybe start a new topic on that, because I believe there are some technical issues.

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@Crumb

“Off Topic”
Quote:

I heard SMP support will also come with auto-stack enlargement, Pixel Shades and full memory protection too, right?

Don’t be stupid, I did not say anything about automatic stack enlargement or pixel shades.

Unless you somehow enforce a policy of no local address can be passed as pointer to OS functions, developer won’t be able to detect what they are doing wrong.

So “automatic stack enlargement” is doable, but not practical, and that is probably way it is not yet implemented.

Maybe one day at the expense of pissed off user who knows, it’s a nice feature to have and will solve many unexplained problems that we have today.

I know Hanz was interested in “shades” and it was one of reasons way Hanz wanted to develop the Radeon HD driver, let’s wait and see, no one has promised anything that I know off.

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@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

Unless you somehow enforce a policy of no local address can be passed as pointer to OS functions, developer won’t be able to detect what they are doing wrong.

The OS should not enforce developers to not use local address but it should instead convert local address to global address (AllocMem + CopyMem).

It is not the user software what is broken -- it is the OS that is broken. Like I already pointed out in another thread the OS itself is already violating its own rules and passing file names and what not directly to filesystem handlers.

(Local/global address is not exactly correct terminology but everyone knows what is meant here, yes?)

_________________
Amiga Developer
Amiga 500, Efika, Mac Mini and PowerBook

After I fell asleep waiting on the video to finish uploading/encoding, I awoke today and found it had completed. Here is the YouTube link:

http://youtu.be/mrBvJozVpcA

Now I know i'm probably still going to get flack, i'm not a movie producer. I even take bad protographs. I had no tripod, and I had half of a lunch break to do it.

I even got this message from YouTube "We detected that your video may have bad lighting. Would you like us to fix that?"

I don't know what it will do if I did "fix it", so I said no because I don't have another day to waste on a video proving what I know I have already done.

Last edited by Cod3r on 18-Jul-2012 at 01:00 PM.

@itix

Can’t strings be handled in the ELF loader?

I was thinking about all the initXXX() commands in exec.library and miss use of this in applications, when I wrote what I did.

But also code like:
Struct MsgPort localport;
msg = WaitPort(&localport);

Anyway everything that was intended to be global has to be globalized, everything that can’t be globalized has to be forbidden, so developers know what to fix and what not.

Basically the idea that application has its own memory space does not exist, but it’s needed to take memory virtualization to the next step.

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If someone is interested:
http://acp.atari.org/about.html

http://medusacomputer.com/firebee.html

Make a AROS bounty and you are done

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about firebee... eur600 for a 266Mhz 68k system...

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@amigadave

Apparently it has. I am astonished at the interest and attention, regardless if it is from the skeptics or anyone else.

How i'll proceed with my work is another thing. There is many, many things to be considered, and with all the different Amiga camps, extremely hard to focus on any one aspect of Amiga.

IMHO, some unification is necessary for the platform not to fragment into even smaller groups. Maybe a specification, since the platform only counts its users in the thousands at best.

Fifty different projects with different objectives (and architectures) just seem like a waste of resources to me. Duplicating efforts repeatedly instead of bring a few to fruition is just ridiculous.

But i'll stop there before I get attacked again LOL.

Quote:

amigadave wrote: @Cod3r With 14 pages of responses in this thread, I can only imagine that your project and this discussion has stirred up a lot of interest. Either that, or there are just the same few posters who you are writing back and forth with in this thread. I have not had the time to read through all of the pages of replies in this thread. I do hope that there has not been too much negative remarks to dissuade you from continuing your project. I am sure you have probably had a chance to realize by now that there are all kinds of Amiga users who populate these forums. It is probably best to take all of them with a bit of skepticism, at least until you get to know them better. You can include me in your skepticism too, if you like, until you have had a chance to learn more about me as well. The Amiga community is definitely not a place for the faint of heart and many get scared off by the criticism and naysayers, before they have a chance to even get close to succeeding with what ever project they are proposing, or working on. Good Luck, and please keep us posted on your progress and any changes that might come up.

@Cod3r

I see that you are "new" here . Nice idea and of course sensible but you will not come very far. You will not persuade Hyperion or MorphOS team to open their sources I fear.

@KimmoK

Truth be told, I saw that project a while back, and scratched my head at the whole concept.

They could have adapted a Freescale development board with the same capabilities for less than a third of the cost. Why pay to have custom hardware made, when you could have made external interfaces/dongles and software drivers to accomplish the same result? Waste of resources for the sake of vanity, if you ask me. Or maybe the organizers of the project just don't know better.

The "hobbyist" communities should use some common sense. Dell, IBM, Apple and everyone else does. Why manufacture custom hardware that does nothing new, when all the big corporations use the same manufacturer? All they do is slap their name on the board. Do you really need an outdated "new" design at an out-of-touch price?

It would be different if you had access to manufacturing facilities, but they are paying for things that don't affect the performance. I could care less if the motherboard in my computer said "ACP ColdFire" or "Tayagushi Computer Co."

BTW, 266mhz ColdFire emulating a 68k cpu runs a little less than half of the native clock speed. But I believe they are compiling new apps for ColdFire.

Quote:

KimmoK wrote: about firebee... eur600 for a 266Mhz 68k system...

@OlafS25

My friend, I don't want or need their sources. They haven't done anything to make anyone in the industry stand up and notice. In case you haven't noticed, nearly every desktop OS has progressed far beyond what Amiga OS and MorphOS can do.

They have a market of sentimental old Amiga users, but no newcomers are impressed, I guarantee you that.

They can sell to those who like the Amiga OS. There is nothing wrong with that. It just isn't groundbreaking.

For example, they are still barely implementing multiprocessing, but Haiku OS has been doing SMP since God knows when. And it is open source.

The problem is that the Haiku GUI is ugly, and they don't have any real applications worth running.