@pavlor

Ha-ha, go to eBay and search.

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Moxee
AmigaOne X1000
AmigaOne XE G4
I'd agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong.

@damocles Quote:

Then how many do you think they will sell to the OS4 community?

I'm not looking at things in black & white: When I say "we are NOT targetting the outside world", I mean normal computer users. Surely we can hope to attract some ex-Amigans back, who generally know what to expect from AmigaOS (and may be pleasantly surprised to see stuff like a Firefox port).

It's a case of us gradually increasing the attractiveness of Amiga OS 4 & apps, so that small (but gradually larger) parts of the "outside world" might find us an attractive alternative. I just don't think we should put the cart before the horse, and start trying to sell it to everyone in the "outside world" straight away. First we start with easier targets like ex-Amigans.

Last edited by ChrisH on 10-Jan-2010 at 10:35 AM.
Last edited by ChrisH on 10-Jan-2010 at 10:26 AM.

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@ChrisH

Quote:

I'm not looking at things in black & white: When I say "we are NOT targetting the outside world", I mean normal computer users. Surely we can hope to attract some ex-Amigans back, who generally know what to expect from AmigaOS (and may be pleasantly surprised to see stuff like a Firefox port).

They want to play their old games, Amiga Forever is far cheaper. You think they are going to spend that much above and beyond what their PS3/xBox360 costs and not get the killer games? Will Timberwolf come with all the plugins they are use to?

Quote:

It's a case of us gradually increasing the attractiveness of Amiga OS 4 & apps, so that small (but gradually larger) parts of the "outside world" might find us an attractive alternative. I just don't think we should put the cart before the horse, and start trying to sell it to everyone in the "outside world" straight away. First we start with easier targets like ex-Amigans.

Those ex-Amigans were A500/A600/A1200 owners. They bought those systems because they were cheaper then the big box Amigas. You expect them to purchase a ultra high priced box to play those same games on in this economy?

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Dammy

@damocles Quote:

They want to play their old games,

Wow, you are psychic, you know what everyone thinks!

When I say "ex Amigans", I am *obviously* talking about those who actually used it for serious stuff and/or had Towered A1200s, etc. There's a lot of those, who I think would be quite interested in OS4.

_________________
Author of the PortablE programming language.
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue...

@ChrisH

Quote:

Wow, you are psychic, you know what everyone thinks! When I say "ex Amigans", I am *obviously* talking about those who actually used it for serious stuff and/or had Towered A1200s, etc. There's a lot of those, who I think would be quite interested in OS4.

Which was a tiny percentage of Amiga owners. If they had serious stuff on it, they long ago left to do serious work on PCs or Macs and are unlikely to return because they have serious stuff to do. If they bought a A1200 and towered it later on, that would be a good indication that they did not have the money to purchase an expensive big box Amiga and built it as they had time and money. Of course, if they had such a burning desire for something like this, why didn't they all buy SAM440s already? I know the main reason I bought my Amiga was for gaming and ATPIT, the only thing of significant interest for me is old games, there are no apps left worth while to be using nearly 20 years later.

It sure does look like there is a marketing failure somewhere, and I don't think it's on my side of the board.

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Dammy

@damocles
You're so cynical, it seems you wouldn't believe in a unicorn if it bit you on the nose :P . I hope you enjoy predicting the final days of the Amiga, whatever positive stuff happens...

Quote:

if they had such a burning desire for something like this, why didn't they all buy SAM440s already?

Hint: I said ex-Amigans.

_________________
Author of the PortablE programming language.
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue...

@vox

Quote:

vox wrote: @AmigaHeretic ... I like that people would pay whatever needed for new Amiga system but in Eastern half of Europe salary is 300-500 euros.

Well, salary in the eastern part of Europe actually was even less than the figures you cited, e.g. roughly a twentieth in the GDR back in 1985 (400 MDN = 40 DM = 20 ¤).

Put the fact on top that 1985 were no Amigas available at all in the Eastern Bloc and you'll get the picture...

Quote:

vox wrote: Not to mention Latin America, Africa and Asia.

They were in nearly the same econonic situation back in 1985 like they are in today (perhaps except China and India, which are just taking off). Haven't heard of them having had an economic miracle since then...

Quote:

vox wrote: So, announcement "it will cost slightly less then A1000" is rip off for today prices of hardware.

Obviously not for Amiga hardware. Just think of the A1 prices or the overpriced low-end Sam...

Quote:

vox wrote: For such price, it would need to be as revolutionary as A1000, which it will not be ...

Well, at least the specs and perspectives sound revolutionary to me. I'll have to wait and see if the actual hardware can live up to the specs and perspectives...

Quote:

vox wrote: Yes, I do understand small quantities, unpredictable investment, global crisis, taxes etc. but I hope it will bring SAM to be chaper having a competition and it will be pleasing to use and powerful to demonstrate. But I expect from Hyperion a final OS4 optimised and bugless for SAM first and then something made for new Miggy. Yes, I am glad about it.

You can't always have what you want.

Look, since 1998 (when I got my A4kPPC) I always wanted an up-to-date high end Amiga and still have to wait for it.

You already have your overpriced low-end SAM with a working OS 4.1, while I still have to mess around with OS 3.9 and OS 4.0 classic on my A4000PPC after 12 years of waiting.

Just try to be a bit more broad-minded towards long waiting "high-end Amigans" like me...

Quote:

vox wrote: ... Dont forget, in a real world for such price of $2000 you could add some more money and get MacBook Pro with MacOS X and this solely a board price.

If I would want a Mac I would certainly do that.

Quote:

vox wrote: To be at least useful, next to Firefox we need OpenOffice and some decent burning software ports- And Java and Flash off course.

Well, if you really need those apps you should buy a Wintel- or Linux-x86-PC.

For my general computing needs even my good old A4kPPC with OS 3.9, IBrowse and FinalOffice97 is still sufficiant. For not so general tasks that require certain apps or raw cpu power I remote-control (RDesktop) the XP-PC below my desk from my Miggy...

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Dandy
__________________________________________
If someone enjoys marching to military music, then I already despise him.
He got his brain accidently - the bone marrow in his back would have been sufficient for him!
(Albert Einstein)

@damocles

Quote:

They want to play their old games, Amiga Forever is far cheaper. You think they are going to spend that much above and beyond what their PS3/xBox360 costs and not get the killer games? Will Timberwolf come with all the plugins they are use to?

I can't pretend to be typical, but I *am* an ex-Amiga user. I used my Amiga's up until about '98. By then I was comfortable enough with Linux that I was ok with that since I needed more powerful hardware for what I was doing, but still detested Windows.

I could care less about the games - as you say, I can sort that out without new hardware. But I know I'm not the only ex-Amiga user that still whinges to everyone that will listen about all the things that I miss from my old Amiga's even today.

Quote:

Those ex-Amigans were A500/A600/A1200 owners. They bought those systems because they were cheaper then the big box Amigas. You expect them to purchase a ultra high priced box to play those same games on in this economy?

I had a A500 at first, then a A2000 and a A3000. Like many of my friends I started out doing mostly games, but I also did programming and a lot of other things, and the A500 vs. the rest was not about wanting to buy something cheaper, but not affording anything more expensive.

The X1000 is the first piece of news that has been exciting enough to stand a good chance of enticing me back. If the price isn't too outrageous (I'm fully prepared to spend far more than on a equivalent PC) I'll buy one. Now I *can* afford it.

Amiga users were a very diverse bunch, even those using the low end machines. Many of us were at an age were lack of money was the only thing preventing us from buying largers, more expensive Amiga's.

I wouldn't expect a massive resurgence off the bat, but if it's reasonably priced I do think the X1000 will bring back more ex-Amiga users than just me.

Personally, I'm hoping to do some development as well. (For fun, though, so while I will release it if I do write anything interesting, it will depend on how much spare time I have... I already have a long list of ideas, starting with porting an up-to-date Ruby version and adding support for various Amiga libs)

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@andres

Quote:

andres wrote: Quote: Yes, Fiat Punto sold a ton more than Ferrari F360 Modena too...(Fiat must have done something right ) Yes but Ferrari is Fiat too...

They're still different brands - it's not a Fiat Ferrari...

The brand Ferrari is just owned by Fiat. Just like the Commodore brand was owned by Tulip...

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Dandy
__________________________________________
If someone enjoys marching to military music, then I already despise him.
He got his brain accidently - the bone marrow in his back would have been sufficient for him!
(Albert Einstein)

@Amiga1200Mark

Quote:

Amiga1200Mark wrote: @damocles On Hyperions website it says they want to revive the Amiga platform. That would indicate to me that they are aiming outside the Community in a bid to help the platform grow. If this is the case the X1000 will have to be priced competitively in order for the platform to grow.

Sorry - but from my POV only dummies lokk at the price alone.
More educated people look what they get for the money or in other words they take the specs into account.

As long as there's something unique that enough custromers desperately want and can get nowhere else it still can be competetive with a higher price.

Quote:

Amiga1200Mark wrote: I don't think anyone is saying that Msoft are to be beaten etc. But the more competitively priced the X1000 is, the better it is marketed, will reflect in good sales, a growing userbase and hopefully long term profit for hyperion/A-EON. With short term over the top prices, no marketing etc the machine will sell well short term but once it has satisfied the userbase/catchment then things will slow down.

Just lets wait and see...

Quote:

Amiga1200Mark wrote: It is my belief that hyperion have to be ambitious and push this machine to its limit as i think it has a lot of potential. So in short and to sum up, a good price at the start may make for a loss in the short term, but a growing userbase and excellent price and product plus excellent software being developed will lead to success and profit long term for A-EON/Hyperion.

...provided they have a strong enough financial background to bridge an period of loss of unspecified duration.

Quote:

Amiga1200Mark wrote: The more homes the X1000 is in, the better, and word of mouth will then come into the equation and the machine will market itself. ...

How about industrial/military customers?

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Dandy
__________________________________________
If someone enjoys marching to military music, then I already despise him.
He got his brain accidently - the bone marrow in his back would have been sufficient for him!
(Albert Einstein)

@ChrisH

Quote:

@damocles You're so cynical, it seems you wouldn't believe in a unicorn if it bit you on the nose :P . I hope you enjoy predicting the final days of the Amiga, whatever positive stuff happens...

If I was in the middle of the ocean and he swam over to my boat and did that, yeah, I'd say I had not enough water and too much sun. If I was in the middle of a forest, maybe, because that would the environment I could be they be in. That is the issue I have with $2500 systems (I hope it's a full system and not just CPU/Mobo) as only the very pro OS4 people are going to be plunking that type of money in this economy. So now your dealing with a subset of a small group of people that most likely have already a sizeable investment with SAM440 or A1s. So how many with an existing OS4 machine will pay $2,500? Tiny subset of a small group of people. Where is the money in that for Ben and partners for a ROI?

AFAIK, desktop sales continue to decrease and laptop/netbook/smartphones (and soon to be tablets) sales are increasing. Mobility is what going to make future sales as prices continue to drop. Six months when the X1000 is going to be shipping, so should netbooks who probably equal the X1000 in horsepower, if that hasn't already happened based on Intel's Atom.

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Dammy

@thread
There are a lot of ex-amigans around but there is a clear difference on how they experience computing today.
Some are now adamant Windows supporters and PC gamers to boot and you guessed it, we won't win many of those back (hope is not lost though, I'm one of them and yet, here I am typing on my Sam! Sometimes the love for Amiga is just to strong too oppose ).
Some seek alternative platforms and play with consoles. These are accustomed to use WindowsXP in the office, and either Linux(Debian/Ubuntu or other stuff) or MacOS at home + PS3/X360 (the first probably as this bunch generally doesn't like Microsoft) for gaming.

If the Amiga platform will evolve in the right way (and I have all the reasons to believe it will), the above bunch has enough users to significantly grow the actual Amigans population (we don't need huge numbers to quadruple what we have today), and that is what Hyperion should aim at in the coming years (one step at a time).

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AmigaCD 32

@WillKar

Quote:

WillKar wrote: ... I for one am not willing to puncture another hole in my belt this time, i'd rather save a bit more just in case i can replace my now tweakin' and squeekin' automobile..

Replace it with a bicycle (like I did) if you can and you'll be able to buy two X1000...

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Dandy
__________________________________________
If someone enjoys marching to military music, then I already despise him.
He got his brain accidently - the bone marrow in his back would have been sufficient for him!
(Albert Einstein)

@Dandy

You have two X1000s? Can you open up the box and tell us what the processor is?

@persia

Quote:

persia wrote: @Dandy You have two X1000s? Can you open up the box and tell us what the processor is?

What made you jump to this wild conclusion?


I wrote:
"Replace it with a bicycle (like I did) if you can and you'll be able to buy two X1000..."

That means that I replaced my car with a bicycle and saved so much money by that, that I will (Future!) be able to buy at least two X1000 from the money I saved.

_________________
Ciao

Dandy
__________________________________________
If someone enjoys marching to military music, then I already despise him.
He got his brain accidently - the bone marrow in his back would have been sufficient for him!
(Albert Einstein)