@_ThEcRoW

He said "The X1000 in my book was dirt cheap". He's also saying you only live once, you can choose to give others your money with nothing to show for it later, or buy a new toy. Some ppl choose to max out multiple credit cards & spend years paying interest, money that far exceeds the price of what they bought. "Cheap" is a relative term, most waste more money over their lifetime, do to making bad choices. Those who are good managing their money do find the x1000 "cheap". I paid more for a fully loaded A4000T back in "95".

I worked with a girl, I asked her if she was putting any money in the companies 401K plan. She said she couldn't afford to take home less every week. I told he she should start with a small amount & see how it worked out & she did. A few years later she told me she was just blown away with her savings to date, $20K, more money then she's ever had in her life. Just saying there are ways to buy those toys without thinking about the cost.

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Hate tends to make you look stupid...

@jorkany

Quote:

@amigakitQuote:If you generate substantial outside interest in AmigaOS before Timberwolf and Gallium et al are ready, you may generate negative attitudes to this fledgling platform before it is ready for the mainstream limelight. Hilarious!

Right, you would never do that, would you....

http://moobunny.dreamhosters.com/cgi/mbthread.pl/amiga/expand/218525

Last edited by sundown on 14-Jun-2012 at 06:39 PM.
Last edited by sundown on 14-Jun-2012 at 06:37 PM.

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Hate tends to make you look stupid...

@sundown

Quote:

Right, you would never do that, would you....

So, is he being wrong pointing out that this statement by Amigkit does not really fit reality of AmigaOS? There are no hidden customers ready to buy AmigaOne X1000 once you get slightly better 3D or newer version of Firefox. There may be a few but I can't see them being scared away by current state of affairs.

Since 17 years now Amiga "market" went from thousands to hundreds. Outside this little crowd there's no one waiting for a X1000. Once we get tired of Amiga the platform is done and gone forever. Amiga has no cult following, no new blood is being introduced. There will be no rebirth of Amiga as you remember it, only a graceful demise.

Post-Commodore Amiga has no legs to stand: OS is closed, expensive, requiring special hardware, software is sparse; hobbits and hackers won't use it, and the John Doe won't. One group got CherryPi while the other dropped "big towers with CPU in them" in favor of tablets and phones.

Amiga community is the only retro-community that believes in some return to the former glory. I don't know why people keep lying to themselves like that.

The world has changed and there's no place for what Amiga has to offer. Same goes for C64 and Atari. But when I talk with a C64 nerd he's not going to tell me that new version of this or that will get them into mainstream. We play Outrun over beers, watch few demos and play around with new hardware addons.

I wish I would stay in C64 community. They are having fun with whatever they find interesting.

PS. I'm so glad you're an avid reader of Moo! Moo: it' like porn for Amigans; you either do it or lie about it!

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Has there been any Amigan during the past 10 years that have believed Amiga to enter back to mainstream? I do not recall.

((( And btw. what is mainstream?
In desktop HW mainstream there is only one - x86 (thousand flavours, but all taste the same).
In dekstop OS mainstream... there is only Windows (with flavours). It has some 95% of the market? Surely the rest few % are not in mainstream. )))

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- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@KimmoK

Yeah exactly even Mac OS X and Linux aren't 'in the mainstream'. Sure, Mac OS X is a more identifiable product or to be more exact Apple is a great brand- but in the desktop space they aren't shifting millions of units. Windows is far too dominate.

Last edited by djrikki on 14-Jun-2012 at 08:58 PM.

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@djrikki

Quote:

aren't shifting millions of units

Yes, they do.

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@opi

Well I said millions, that could be anything from 1 to 9,999 million. However, I think you will agree Windows is the more dominant.

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@opi

Quote:

So, is he being wrong pointing out that this statement by Amigkit does not really fit reality of AmigaOS?

Its not whats pointed out, but WHO points it out, he's a rabid hater of my hobby of choice.

I do not expect the Amiga to gain many new members or return to glory. I do enjoy the chance to beta test a new system. I do respect others choice to use any other OS on the h/w of their choice & I expect others to respect my choice. Do you have a problem with that?

I do have a major problem with slim balls that want nothing more then to kill off what I love.


Quote:

PS. I'm so glad you're an avid reader of Moo! Moo: it' like porn for Amigans; you either do it or lie about it!

Yes, I read it, just to see what new rumors they come up with, pays to know what the enemy is up to. I also enjoy their discomfort in the knowledge that the x1000 is being received so well.

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Hate tends to make you look stupid...

@amigakit

Quote:

This seemingly sparce marketing approach by A-EON and AmigaKit may seem apathetic and non-structured. I understand that it can be frustrating from the Community's outside view looking-in. However, there is a larger plan which will be revealed in due course

Fine wake me up when the 'proper' launch happens and you have a finished product to sell. All this raising money from users to allow the system to finish after a soft launch is all a bit slooow for my liking! The Apple Mac has started to phase out optical disc media and shift to an entirely webstore based model - where is the download verision of Wipeout 2097 to download for the X1000? Where is the stable release of Pagestream for the X1000? Is there a release date for these things?

All I expect to get in return is.... .... boring

How to turn an exciting launch such as the X1000 is a slow A1 type stalemate! I really am interested in this machine but I really feel like I should as a customer be 'sold' this machine a bit more, especially if it costs around £2000!!! What the hell does the Xena do? When is dual core support/Timberwolf and Hardware accelerated 3D/DVD decoding come online? These are BASIC questions. We shouldn't have to buy first and wait with baited breath to see when our machines will be finished!!!!

I'm tempted to just save up for a refurbished last of line MacBook Pro with optical drive included and am getting excited about Colonial Marines on the Wii U and SC2: Heart of the Swarm looks sweet. I'm enjoying getting to grips with Photoshop on the Mac and enjoy messing with animation on Deluxe Paint 5 on my Classic 'miggy. Lifes to short to wait for the X1000 to be finished, in fact do we think the intention is to finish the machine or just to use it as a test bed for the next model with different CPU?

If you want my money;

1)Stick the machine in the 'Amiga One / Sam > OS 4.1 Systems' section of categories bar on the AmigaKit page where it belongs! With a total price and expected availibility!

2) Release a Webstore with Classic/New software for sale!

3) Release some hobby kits to utilise the Xena stuff! Why does this all take so long?

Last edited by BigD on 14-Jun-2012 at 09:20 PM.

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"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@djrikki

I don't really know what you're trying to argue? That Amiga is not in a mainstream, as is Mac and Linux? No, both platforms are mainstream (you can get commercial support, buy stuff, get software, you can make a living out of administrating it).

Windows is a dominant desktop platform. There are around 1 billion of x86 computers running it, half of that being somehow current. The world is changing and "desktop computers" are not what people buy. One million 3G enabled Android devices are being activated daily. Apple sold over 30 million of their iPads. The pie of future computing is so big you can live like a king by having just few percents.

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@opi

Lol just over the definition I guess. Mac is not used 'in the main' because it has a tiny share of 5% or so, foreinstance you don't find a Mac in every office in the world, but you will find a PC. Commercial support etc.. is not the same as being 'in the mainstream'. You mention mobile devices etc.. fine.. but they don't run a conventional 'desktop' OS so they are not 'a Mac'.

Last edited by djrikki on 14-Jun-2012 at 09:28 PM.
Last edited by djrikki on 14-Jun-2012 at 09:27 PM.

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@djrikki

Quote:

Mac is not used 'in the main' because it has a tiny share of 5% or so, foreinstance you don't find a Mac in every office in the world, but you will find a PC.

The Mac is a single platform entirely manufactured by a single company retaining control over R&D and hardware/software direction. This causes it to be over controlling at times (see lack of Blu-Ray drives or optical drives period as of June 2012) but also gives it greater freedom in design and ergonomics. Supporting the Wintel monopoly is not giving Dell the returns it once did. Apple have the profit margin and the control of the platform, an enviable position! Small their market share may be if you count OS X vs Windows. But it's competitive it is if compared on the grounds of unit sales per quarter with other computer companies!

Last edited by BigD on 14-Jun-2012 at 10:01 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 14-Jun-2012 at 10:01 PM.

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"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@thread

Tempting.

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I'm an antique. Don't light my fuse

@opi

Quote:

So, is he being wrong pointing out that this statement by Amigkit does not really fit reality of AmigaOS? There are no hidden customers ready to buy AmigaOne X1000 once you get slightly better 3D or newer version of Firefox. There may be a few but I can't see them being scared away by current state of affairs.

while its quite obvious that there is no market for the likes of x1k outside of os4 community, im not sure if this is applies like that for os4 in general or another amiga like systems. im also not entirely sure it depends on third party elements like a browser (firefox port), office suite or hardware 3d support (gallium) that is already taken as granted outside os4 anyway.

of course most important chance is amiga-genuineness smartly combined with contemporary usability, all that in nice compact and finished form. being closed source and "commercial" being a significant handicap still.

besides it has been proven that there is some amount of non genuine amiga users coming as well to os4 as to alternatives. i believe for instance eliyahu belongs to them.

so i think yes, the current state of affairs scares probably potential customers away. but i dont think with the attitudes given it is ever gonna change.

@opi

Quote:

Since 17 years now Amiga "market" went from thousands to hundreds. Outside this little crowd there's no one waiting for a X1000. Once we get tired of Amiga the platform is done and gone forever. Amiga has no cult following, no new blood is being introduced. There will be no rebirth of Amiga as you remember it, only a graceful demise. Post-Commodore Amiga has no legs to stand: OS is closed, expensive, requiring special hardware, software is sparse; hobbits and hackers won't use it, and the John Doe won't. One group got CherryPi while the other dropped "big towers with CPU in them" in favor of tablets and phones. Amiga community is the only retro-community that believes in some return to the former glory. I don't know why people keep lying to themselves like that.

While what you say has a lot of truth to it, you are ignoring past users who "might" be willing to come back to the platform if they have some interesting new hardware to play with. Old ex-Amiga users have grown up, had kids, sent them packing and some have lots of disposable income.

Whatever Barry Altman's faults were, he recognised this and hoped that his line of rebadged PCs with an Amiga-like OS would appeal to them and allow him to sell hundreds of thousands of units.

Well, I'm not that delusional, but I can't help thinking there must be a few hundred or more ex-uses we could tempt back into the fold.

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AmigaOne X1000, A4000(T), A3000, A2000, A1200(T), A1200, A500, CD32, Minimig+ARM, FPGA Arcade, Chameleon64, C-One, C128, C128D, C64C, C64, VIC-20, CBM 8032, CBM4032, Efika, Ultimate64

@Darrin

Quote:

Well, I'm not that delusional, but I can't help thinking there must be a few hundred or more ex-uses we could tempt back into the fold.

i think you might be right, but the entry level is not to inviting, due to price of hardware, closeness of the system, it being incomplete work in progress with no user observable current of progress, ... and last but not least hardware incompatibility to what a genuine user would regard a "real amiga"

edit: i have the feeling such audience is better addressed by fpgaarcade with os3.x, or perhaps even by aros68k even if not at its current state, i must admit.

Last edited by wawa on 14-Jun-2012 at 10:34 PM.

@wawa

Yes, you're right that the price is a major hurdle. I hold out hope for the fabled "OS4 Netbook" to give curious users an entry level machine.

As for the FPGA Arcade, I have very high hopes for that, not just as an Amiga, but also because it will have the ability to perform as several systems and as classic games consoles. It is at a price where people could actually use it to make a great retro console machine pre-loaded with several games and installed into a cabinet.

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AmigaOne X1000, A4000(T), A3000, A2000, A1200(T), A1200, A500, CD32, Minimig+ARM, FPGA Arcade, Chameleon64, C-One, C128, C128D, C64C, C64, VIC-20, CBM 8032, CBM4032, Efika, Ultimate64

@number6

Quote:

It was quite similar during the A1 project, with exposure and demand out pacing available product to purchase. You can prove this by reading posts about the short time period when the Micro A1-C was front and center.

Wasnt this because Eyetech was collecting more orders to produce next batch? In small scale business it is quite normal product is unavailable longer or shorter periods.

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Amiga Developer
Amiga 500, Efika, Mac Mini and PowerBook

@itix

Quote:

Wasnt this because Eyetech was collecting more orders to produce next batch? In small scale business it is quite normal product is unavailable longer or shorter periods.

I think it's similar to what Trevor has to do gathering interest and sure...normal.

#6

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@Slayer

Quote:

Slayer wrote: Why on earth do people "like myself" that have never felt dispair or uttered a degrading word about an Amiga ever have to put up with this constant BS from the masses outside the fence looking in? Don't you people understand you have ALL had the same choices, you've all had the same chances. You hesitate you miss out, you don't have enough money, you're out of the niche market, you don't LIKE the Amiga systems of today, what are YOU doing here? The X1000 in my book was dirt cheap, if you can't produce a lousy couple of grand to chuck on a bet take a good look in the mirror, you've obviously made some bad choices in your life (or blame your parents if it is more applicable). But to label people who have/create financial freedom a "rich boy [club]" is pure self pity. As far as being Elitest, I've felt Elitest ever since I brought my first A500. Who gives a Frak it's all in my head, isn't YOUR perception of Life ALL in YOUR head? Of course it is, stop buggering around wasting your energy on boards like this and GO and get something that works for you and Enjoy! Hey Trevor, put me down for 2 of the next X rendition! More Amigas!

What a weird and utterly nonsensical statement...

Not elitist eh... you just proved that statement to be completely false with your utterings about people who are less fortunate than you for whatever the reason may be, that they can't afford to spend a couple of grand on a new computer...

Then you tell folk who don't fit in with your elitist views on things to go elsewhere because for some weird and incomprehensible reason you obviously think this site is only for a tiny minority of people who like the same particular things as you...

In case you hadn't noticed this site is called Amigaworld.net and not OS4world.net nor the A-EONX1kworld.net, take a look around open your blinkered elitist eyes and you'll find there are even sections here, dare I say it for CLASSIC users...

Your madcap ramblings about everyone having the same "choices" & "chances" in life just show how ignorant you are in your knowledge of life in general and an obvious disregard & disdain you have for people who aren't as privileged as you claim to be...

I aint bothered whether you can afford to by one, two or more A1K's or if you've got as much money as me (which I doubt) but I can't be arsed with elistist comments from folk like you who somehow think that having a few grand to spend on a computer makes you think your better than them...

So please don't insult others just because you think your better than them and because you think you have more money than them to spend (note the word THINK)...

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