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PosterThread
arsipaani 
Re: Gloom Remake
Posted on 5-Apr-2009 13:56:24
#21 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2008
Posts: 120
From: Unknown

FYI

There is few Amiga 3D game remakes:

cytadela
Speed

No amiga ports yet :P

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Gebrochen 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 5-Apr-2009 14:26:52
#22 ]
Super Member
Joined: 23-Nov-2008
Posts: 1410
From: Australia, VIC

@Reynolds

Nice avatar.

Question for you, you did not happen to be part of the making of the cd32 game, the skeleton crew?

Just curious if its just an avatar , or if there is more behind this?

@ Gloom Maps,

Sounds like a nice upcoming remake is possibile, with gloom maps, but newer 3d engine, hence, graphical improvements also yes?

Was wondering, if you are already thinking of remaking, then, could you make the side stepping or straffing a lot nicer, like doom style, rather than having a limit of movement to either side step, or turn, but not both(I used to hate that)

Cheers.

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_Steve_ 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 5-Apr-2009 14:36:55
#23 ]
Team Member
Joined: 17-Oct-2002
Posts: 6784
From: UK

@Hypex

Quote:

Hypex wrote:
@RoqueFort

Quote:
The game was "Zombie Massacre." Not so good, as it was just a Gloom Rehash- same game with different graphics and sound. It had a great intro that was done with AnimatED though! It was by Gareth Murfin.


I agree with it being not so good. Maybe the game was okay but everything else was shocking. I don't know if it came out before OS3.9 but "installing" it ended up destroying system libraries like ASL. I put "installing" in quotes because it didn't actually install the game either, it just wanted to know where to put config files. The game wasn't even installed! I hate games that take up megabytes on the CD and then don't even install themselves.

Honestly, I don't know why these programmers think they need to destroy system libraries just to make an assign or run a game. This game mucked up my A4000. And rendered my friends Sam OS4 system useless. I had to track down what it destroyed and restore it. Not fun!


You have to bear in mind that this was "made" by Gareth Murfin, who has quite a bit of history himself as being a bit of a cowboy (who can forget the classic "new" setpatch, which was the OS3.5 setpatch hex edited to have a new version number) amongst other things. Also note that he didn't "code" Zombie Apocalypse, it was merely a collection of 3rd party maps and graphic alterations to the already existing Gloom Deluxe game. No new code was made. I suspect that he was responsible for the "installer" as well, which may explain why it knackered your system.

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RoqueFort 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 5-Apr-2009 15:24:49
#24 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2004
Posts: 5788
From: Norfolk, Great Britain

Quote:

_Steve_ wrote:

You have to bear in mind that this was "made" by Gareth Murfin, who has quite a bit of history himself as being a bit of a cowboy (who can forget the classic "new" setpatch, which was the OS3.5 setpatch hex edited to have a new version number) amongst other things. Also note that he didn't "code" Zombie Apocalypse, it was merely a collection of 3rd party maps and graphic alterations to the already existing Gloom Deluxe game. No new code was made. I suspect that he was responsible for the "installer" as well, which may explain why it knackered your system.


Oh dear!

I always thought he was quite impressive- from a young age he did lots of coding; demos and little games including a Skool daze clone; dunno if he ever finished that. As a fan of Romero's Dead series, he had a Resident evil clone also on the cards, and wrote scripts for AmiIRC.

He got a fair bit of attention in Amiga Format, I guess he got less welcome attention elsewhere!

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EmperorLongo 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 5-Apr-2009 18:40:54
#25 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2007
Posts: 174
From: Oshkosh, Wisconsin, USA

@Dafs

Much luck on that engine work, and also on getting some word back from Mark

You know, I never played Alien Breed 3D because it was almost impossible to get when I joined the Amiga scene. It's still almost impossible to get. People are not reseling this game. I did try to play TKG, after a kindly expert helped me install it. Would definitely love to see an OpenGL port of both these shooters, but it's never happened even though the sources were released back in the late '90s. I know that many programmers took a look at the TKG sources and decided it was a really big job, so no one ever took it on. Team 17 is getting ready to launch a new Alien Breed 3D this year for the Xbox Live Arcade, but apparently based on the original top-down games.

I've been told that the Breathless sources were released on a CD coverdisk for some Italian Amiga magazine ages ago. The magazine had a very small print run, so finding the sources would be a major task. I contacted a programmer back in the day, and he said no one wanted to mess with the Breathless code since it was all, or almost all, assembler. The original coder, Alberto Longo, completely disappeared, too. Alberto, where are you in our hour of need!

I agree with you about a repository for the Amiga's FPS's, many of which were quite peculiar. I'm thinking of Trapped 2, which had a very nice engine, plus those memorable giant wasps, but was a pretty bizarre game by shooter standards. And then there's the great one that was never finished, IIRC it was called Insanity. I think the developers were from Poland. They appeared to have reverse-engineered the Quake engine -- true 3D engine and even the scrolling skies. Ran ultra-smooth on my '060 A4000T, and it loved my CV64/3D, too.

One thing I've noticed about Amiga FPS's is that the colors seem muted compared to PC games, and sometimes even a little filmy or smeary. Why is that?

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_Steve_ 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 5-Apr-2009 19:17:39
#26 ]
Team Member
Joined: 17-Oct-2002
Posts: 6784
From: UK

@EmperorLongo

While I am lucky enough to own the Alien Breed 3D games in their original form, you can now legally download the games via Dream 17 website.

The IPF images can be found on the following page.

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EmperorLongo 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 6-Apr-2009 23:20:14
#27 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2007
Posts: 174
From: Oshkosh, Wisconsin, USA

@_Steve_

Thanks for the tip! Page bookmarked.

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Dafs 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 7-Apr-2009 0:57:42
#28 ]
Member
Joined: 16-Apr-2004
Posts: 47
From: UK

@Gebrochen

Graphical improvements will include
-bilinear filtered/mip-mapped textures
-realtime lighting (projectiles and gun pickups will act as light sources)

Some ideas that I may or may not implement
-ligtmapping (light sources derived from textures)
-optional replacement of sprites with 3d objects.
-high quality textures (normal-mapped?)

The controlls will be nice I promise.

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Hypex 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 7-Apr-2009 14:37:04
#29 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 10309
From: Greensborough, Australia

@_Steve_

Yes that installer would explain a lot. But as to why the game wasn't even installed. Well: After reading his "profile" from your post I wonder if he did actually put work into the eariler Gloom code. When I was testing CIAgent I found GloomIII added a CIA interrupt with a name full of swear words and the worse was that it located the keyboard interrupt in the CIA resource and hacked it! No wonder RTG and RTA didn't take off on the Amiga! With games like this we had no hope! If it wasn't hacking 68000 interrupt vectors while the Workbench was still around it was hacking the OS in various wayss.

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Yssing 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 18-Aug-2010 12:22:06
#30 ]
Super Member
Joined: 24-Apr-2003
Posts: 1048
From: Unknown

@Dafs

How is your project going mate?

There are a few 3D games I like on the PS1, Alien and Space hulk. Would be awesome to have those on the amiga.

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Arko 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 18-Aug-2010 21:24:18
#31 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Jan-2007
Posts: 1989
From: Unknown

@Dafs

The "lowres" Gloom palette oriented GFX on modern OpenGL system seems to be an anachronism. Especially because OpenGL allows (and always uses) free positioning for 3D objects, they are not bound to the limitations that where invented to make Wolfenstein3D (and Gloom) possible.

Wouldn't it not be better to use textures that are just inspired by Gloom without falling back into the old limitations ?

Do you plan to make your game compatible for Gloom WADs ?
Are you using OpenGL or DirectX (that includes parts of OpenGL) ?
Do you plan to publish the code under some sort of OS license ?

BTW.: Nice screen shot of the level editor

Sorry for re-awakening this old thread
It seems the project is dead, Google did not find anything about a Gloom remake for Windows.

Last edited by Arko on 18-Aug-2010 at 10:15 PM.

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I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

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Rudei 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 19-Aug-2010 6:51:57
#32 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Nov-2002
Posts: 3589
From: Dallas, Texas

@Yssing

Quote:

Yssing wrote:
@Dafs

How is your project going mate?

There are a few 3D games I like on the PS1, Alien and Space hulk. Would be awesome to have those on the amiga.


I agree, any news?

Rude!

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ChrisH 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 19-Aug-2010 9:02:06
#33 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2005
Posts: 6673
From: Unknown

@Arko Quote:
The "lowres" Gloom palette oriented GFX on modern OpenGL system seems to be an anachronism. Especially because OpenGL allows (and always uses) free positioning for 3D objects, they are not bound to the limitations that where invented to make Wolfenstein3D (and Gloom) possible.

Ummmm, because there are pre-existing maps, so he can get something fun-to-play much quicker? (And have you tried getting people to make sound, graphics & levels for you? This is VERY hard to do for a free project.) Because he can add greater map complexity later? Because some people still like Gloom?

Last edited by ChrisH on 19-Aug-2010 at 09:02 AM.

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ddni 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 19-Aug-2010 14:04:41
#34 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 11-Jan-2007
Posts: 818
From: Northern Ireland

@ChrisH

John Girvin did some work on nice Gloom levels.

http://www.girv.net/amiga/games/gloomy-breed.html

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MaximvsPayne 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 19-Aug-2010 19:58:00
#35 ]
Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2010
Posts: 60
From: Germany

great would be some kind of scummvm for old amiga fps games. that on amigaos4 (and maybe morphos, aros etc.) would be so cool - with updated 3d-engine.

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Dafs 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 19-Aug-2010 20:54:34
#36 ]
Member
Joined: 16-Apr-2004
Posts: 47
From: UK

@Arko

Not exactly dead but low on my priority list. Allthough this thread has re-kindled my interest slightly.

The primary intention for the project was/is to be an .exe drop in replacement for the existing amiga executable. To basically make gloom multiplatform and to add tcp/ip multiplayer.

Enabling user-defined textures would be a trivial matter of dropping in hires alternatives. Likewise sprites could be replaced with quake2 models (MD2).

Quote:

Do you plan to make your game compatible for Gloom WADs ?

100% compatible. I have even managed to obtain some cross-platform crunchmania depacker code so Gloom datafiles can be used unmodified. I have documented the file formats for all of Glooms datafiles with the exception ofthe Pre Gloom Deluxe fonts.

Quote:

Are you using OpenGL or DirectX (that includes parts of OpenGL) ?


I have implemented the basis of a software raycaster which i believe is probably quite faithful to the original renderer in terms of implementation. It's purely guesswork as the gloom sources are not available and I have barely touched 68k or any assembly in my life so no dissasembly/reverse engineering here. Performance is good at low to medium resolutions but sub-optimal due to the nature of raycasting against arbitarily sloped walls and software rendering.

There are some hurdles involved in creating an (efficient) OpenGL renderer allthough honestly I could just throw the entirety of the most detailed gloom maps at a modern GPU and it wouldn't break a sweat. I won't do that though because an efficient culling and caching algorithm would enable a more efficient backend for a better software renderer and suited to handheld performance.

Quote:

Do you plan to publish the code under some sort of OS license ?


Possibly GPL if it gets to release.

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Dafs 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 19-Aug-2010 21:11:06
#37 ]
Member
Joined: 16-Apr-2004
Posts: 47
From: UK

@ChrisH

Pretty much all of the above. I'm not stopping anyone doing a Gloom mod for a AAA engine. If this ever comes into fruition it's partly a technical excersise for myself. And a nostalgia trip for Amigans and Ex-Amigans like myself.

I'd love the idea of a small community around the project dropping in for retro deathmatches (lol at 8v8 gloom team deathmatch), creating levels and making hd-packs.

But so many things to do, one day.

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Yssing 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 20-Aug-2010 9:51:05
#38 ]
Super Member
Joined: 24-Apr-2003
Posts: 1048
From: Unknown

@Dafs

I really hope that this project materializes.. :)

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Arko 
Re: Gloom Map Specs
Posted on 20-Aug-2010 10:42:00
#39 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Jan-2007
Posts: 1989
From: Unknown

@Dafs

It's an impressing screenshot, even with the low-res textures. Make a playable beta version ASAP, a single player version would be nice.

TCP/IP (hope you are using UDP) might give you a lot of troubles, I could lock up the whole development process especially if it is planned to play vial WAN and not only on LAN.

Do you use SDL as GFX API for the game, so it doesn't use any OpenGL features at the moment ?

Some parts of the screenshots looks better than others, would it be possible to make some filtering on the textures (especially the walls) before using them ?

Is there a possibillity to transfer them in any 'normal' picture format (png, bmp, pam) ?
It wwould be nice if people without programming skills could enhanced the textures.

Last edited by Arko on 20-Aug-2010 at 10:50 AM.
Last edited by Arko on 20-Aug-2010 at 10:47 AM.

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I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

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Dafs 
Re: Gloom Remake
Posted on 14-Sep-2010 0:24:16
#40 ]
Member
Joined: 16-Apr-2004
Posts: 47
From: UK

I've picked up this project again. Had a major coding session over the last two days. Things are starting to shape up.

I also knocked together this video [youtube.com].

Sorry for the poor quality and jerky framerate, this is my first video.

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