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PosterThread
Bibi 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 3-Feb-2006 19:44:39
#61 ]
Member
Joined: 3-Jan-2006
Posts: 26
From: UK/Slovakia

@nzv58l

Quote:

nzv58l wrote:
@Comi

I still say their production runs were too small as evidence by all the people who were on back order. I guess they were trying to be too careful.



But normally (as I´d do it) they should have invested the money acquired by the A1 sales back to new order of boards. I´m quite sure they have the preorder numbers from dealers around the world.

My estimation: if there´s only 5000 people active in the amiga community (I´m convinced there are more), they (eyetech) haven´t satisfied even the half of them until now. What I red on the other threads, estimation of motherboards produced could be up to 2000pcs. Let´s say they let made 4000pcs. From this volume Eyetech surely have enough money for the next batch of boards. There´s demand, money shouldn´t be a big problem for producing.

Next thing: When eyetech had preorders from the dealers, they should add another reserve pcs for their stock (as we usually do in the business here) and of course according to margin they have on the boards. After all, they´d have reserve stock for another sales and maybe even better price per board quantity-related. AFAIK they run 2 orders to the producers (MAI?). From this point of view it was unqualified market analysis and because of that they haven´t earned so much money they could have had. On the other side there are - no, I´m not afraid to say it - hundreds or even thousands of active amiga users JUST WAITING.

Let´s forget now the defects A1 board have had, it´s mistake of developers and testers as well. I really don´t want to insult anybody, but isn´t it like this?

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Samwel 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 3-Feb-2006 22:37:44
#62 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 7-Apr-2004
Posts: 3396
From: Sweden

@ironfist

Quote:

You're mixing up the standards.. Your case is for MicroATX and Mini-ITX is
considerably smaller.. FlexATX is between MicroATX and Mini-ITX. If his
case is Mini-ITX a FlexATX board will never fit.


Yes you're correct. Micro-ATX is 235x170mm vs Mini-ITX 170x170mm if I'm
not mistaken?! Amy is 190x170 btw. But most Mini-ITX cases actually have
space for 190mm flex boards (two PCI's). And most users buys Micro-ATX
cases (4 PCI's) for their Mini-ITX boards due to the tight space of Mini-ITX
cases. But of course the flex board won't fit a true Mini-ITX case.

_________________
/Harry

[SOLD] A1-C - 750GX 800MHz - 512MB - Antec Aria case

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Samwel 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 3-Feb-2006 22:45:39
#63 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 7-Apr-2004
Posts: 3396
From: Sweden

@redfox

I believe your Minuet case is a Micro-ATX case (space for 4 PCI slots in the back).

Morex is a true Mini-ITX board (one PCI slot) and Amy probably won't fit in it.
It looks wide enough but you can't be sure without actually test fitting the card.

_________________
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[SOLD] A1-C - 750GX 800MHz - 512MB - Antec Aria case

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Colin_Camper 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 3-Feb-2006 23:02:41
#64 ]
Super Member
Joined: 6-Jul-2003
Posts: 1188
From: Unknown

@Comi

Quote:
I did not seen any sign of life fom Eyetech about 6 months ...


Yes, go with what you SEE. As far as I can see the emperor has NO clothes!

Apparantly Coder and Ikir like to tease us with one word replies and riddles concerning the status of Eyetech.

Either Alan has landed a deal to end all deals with the chinese and has threatened them both with a monkey wrench if they say anything - or they are just trolling....

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redfox 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 5-Feb-2006 17:43:22
#65 ]
Super Member
Joined: 7-Mar-2003
Posts: 1729
From: Canada

@Samwel @ironfist

Thanks for clearing this up.





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Coder 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 5-Feb-2006 19:07:39
#66 ]
Team Member
Joined: 15-May-2003
Posts: 4523
From: The Netherlands

@Colin_Camper

Quote:
Apparantly Coder and Ikir like to tease us with one word replies and riddles concerning the status of Eyetech.


Not really. Eyetech is alive. It's just that someone is kind of holding them back now. I have no idea if they will ever release new hardware again. I know they have this batch they like to sell but the cannot right now. People just ask if Eyetech is alive and yes they are. But I do think we will see the PowerVixxen and Amy '05 sooner.

Coder

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hatschi 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 5-Feb-2006 19:37:51
#67 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 1-Dec-2005
Posts: 2328
From: Good old Europe.

@Coder
Quote:
I know they have this batch they like to sell but the cannot right now.


Do you remember if Alan said that in an interview or forum thread? I heard this already a few times now (sometimes with slight alterations) and I was just wondering if somebody could point me to the initial statement.

Sometimes people are saying the boards are there but he can't get CPUs, sometimes people are saying that it's a financial problem - plus various other versions of the story...
All just speculation?

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goody 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 5-Feb-2006 20:04:46
#68 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 22-Mar-2003
Posts: 386
From: Seattle, Washington (North Wet USA)

@Bibi

Quote:

Bibi wrote:
@nzv58l

Quote:

nzv58l wrote:
@Comi

I still say their production runs were too small as evidence by all the people who were on back order. I guess they were trying to be too careful.

But normally (as I´d do it) they should have invested the money acquired by the A1 sales back to new order of boards. I´m quite sure they have the preorder numbers from dealers around the world.

You seem to think the R&D was free. With any luck Eyetech broke even. Not counting the investment in the next run that has not materialized.

Quote:

My estimation: if there´s only 5000 people active in the amiga community (I´m convinced there are more), they (eyetech) haven´t satisfied even the half of them until now. What I red on the other threads, estimation of motherboards produced could be up to 2000pcs. Let´s say they let made 4000pcs. From this volume Eyetech surely have enough money for the next batch of boards. There´s demand, money shouldn´t be a big problem for producing.

2-4 thousand is not exactly low cost mass production. Motherboards these days are produced in the hundreds of thousands if not millions.

Quote:

Let´s forget now the defects A1 board have had, it´s mistake of developers and testers as well. I really don´t want to insult anybody, but isn´t it like this?

No mistake, just bad luck. I think you mistake the cost of R&D. And the cost of low production runs. Not to mention the risk involved to the hardware developer. Risk such as the A1 hardware problems that no one could have predicted.

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T_Bone 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 5-Feb-2006 20:09:20
#69 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Sep-2003
Posts: 3043
From: here To: there

@Coder

Quote:
someone is kind of holding them back now


Hmmm... so that "someone" is still alive too? Geeze, they NEVER die.


(wild guess)

Last edited by T_Bone on 05-Feb-2006 at 08:09 PM.

_________________
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number6 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 5-Feb-2006 20:11:37
#70 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 10854
From: In the village

@hatschi

Quote:
Do you remember if Alan said that in an interview or forum thread?

Post #14
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=12882&forum=14

#6

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hatschi 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 5-Feb-2006 20:21:39
#71 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 1-Dec-2005
Posts: 2328
From: Good old Europe.

@number6

Grazie!

So how did Genesi manage this issue (CPU price and availability, esp. concerning the market price of the Peg2) or what are the differences - it can't be order volume for sure.

Last edited by hatschi on 05-Feb-2006 at 08:25 PM.

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Coder 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 6-Feb-2006 13:17:42
#72 ]
Team Member
Joined: 15-May-2003
Posts: 4523
From: The Netherlands

@Comi

Quote:
I did not seen any sign of life fom Eyetech about 6 months


You mean as in posting here. There are some dirty politics being played and Alan is the target. It's not like all the critisism made him not want to post anymore. I am talking "normal" critisism and not the ones you have to bleep out.

Coder

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 6-Feb-2006 15:18:25
#73 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11368
From: Norway

@Bibi

The name Amiga ONE is spoiled whit deign error in the SE / XE selling some ting whit the same name is just silly, time to move on to new name and new revision of the XE, fix the USB bug, fix the DMA bug, butt then again I think maybe the design is too expensive and should be dropped for cost efficient deign, whit more up to date standards like USB2 and PCI express.

Many new designs and ideas are in the working, I think if you give it some time new HW will come to AmigaOS4.

_________________
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Seehund 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 6-Feb-2006 15:50:07
#74 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 12-Jan-2006
Posts: 416
From: Dar al-Harb

@goody

Quote:

goody wrote:
@Bibi

Quote:

Bibi wrote:
@nzv58l

But normally (as I´d do it) they should have invested the money acquired by the A1 sales back to new order of boards. I´m quite sure they have the preorder numbers from dealers around the world.

You seem to think the R&D was free. With any luck Eyetech broke even.


You seem to think Eyetech paid for R&D. They may have paid Mai Logic a fee for using Mai's designs.

Quote:
Not counting the investment in the next run that has not materialized.


I followed a link in this thread to a statement from June 05, saying they were waiting for another order to arrive. Is this what you're talking about? Why would that money be lost? Are Topshine or whoever it is that's doing the manufacturing thieves?

Quote:
Quote:
Bibi wrote:

My estimation: if there´s only 5000 people active in the amiga community (I´m convinced there are more), they (eyetech) haven´t satisfied even the half of them until now. What I red on the other threads, estimation of motherboards produced could be up to 2000pcs. Let´s say they let made 4000pcs. From this volume Eyetech surely have enough money for the next batch of boards. There´s demand, money shouldn´t be a big problem for producing.

2-4 thousand is not exactly low cost mass production. Motherboards these days are produced in the hundreds of thousands if not millions.


And just because there are, say, 5,000 people active in the community, this naturally doesn't mean that Vendor X can sell 5,000 items of Product X. When Vendor X = Eyetech and Product X = "AmigaOnes", we see that less than 1,500 could be sold.

If AOS4 can't be sold to anybody else than those already active in the community, all the "rebirth" talk is empty anyway, and the project seems rather pointless. Then it's more like overpriced palliative terminal care at the oncology ward, rather than delivering a baby at the obstetrics ward...

It seems like Eyetech's order batches for Terons were more like maybe 25-50 at a time, not thousands.

Quote:
Quote:

Let´s forget now the defects A1 board have had, it´s mistake of developers and testers as well. I really don´t want to insult anybody, but isn´t it like this?

No mistake, just bad luck. I think you mistake the cost of R&D. And the cost of low production runs. Not to mention the risk involved to the hardware developer. Risk such as the A1 hardware problems that no one could have predicted.


There was no direct R&D cost. The risk for the hardware developer didn't have to be Eyetech's risk, if only they hadn't been so stubborn on only reselling Terons, and if AInc hadn't had a say in what they're (not) allowed to sell, then they could have switched to reselling Macs or Pegasoses when it eventually became clear even to Eyetech that they had failed.
These would have been some of the advantages of finally getting away from "custom" hardware.
The hardware problems hasn't exactly been a surprise during the last few years, when the boards were sold as normal despite the known defects. They should have been cancelled at once, and only sold again if Mai would have fixed them.

_________________
Oh, bother.

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Comi 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 6-Feb-2006 16:06:15
#75 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 1-Jul-2003
Posts: 633
From: Zlatibor, Serbia

@Coder

Quote:
Not really. Eyetech is alive. It's just that someone is kind of holding them back now. I have no idea if they will ever release new hardware again. I know they have this batch they like to sell but the cannot right now. People just ask if Eyetech is alive and yes they are. But I do think we will see the PowerVixxen and Amy '05 sooner. Coder


Eyetech state of live is unconscios from what you wrote....they are alive but they are not in Amiga market : 1. no hardware to sell (but they have batch in their stock)
2. no update on their site
3. no communication with partners like amigaworld for any news or bye bye like Stellar Dreams
4. no appearance in forum to say what holding them off, like Hyperion did...

Amiga hardware scene is agony without the end.

_________________
F1 Srbija

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mavherzog 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 8-Jun-2006 22:35:58
#76 ]
Member
Joined: 29-Jan-2005
Posts: 59
From: Columbus, WI

So, is the situation any better now that it is mid-2006? (yes, I will dig through the forums now that I am, again, back here.) :)

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hatschi 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 8-Jun-2006 22:43:37
#77 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 1-Dec-2005
Posts: 2328
From: Good old Europe.

@mavherzog
Quote:
So, is the situation any better now that it is mid-2006?


No.

(except for more "exciting" announcements that is...)

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Tomas 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 8-Jun-2006 22:58:01
#78 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Jul-2003
Posts: 4286
From: Unknown

@mavherzog
This situation is sad.... I am waiting for hardware as well... When i finally had money to buy one, they had non in stock, so i ended up bying a new amd64 instead.

This situation is why many people is screaming about porting it to other avaliable hardware.
It seems like it is Amiga INC that is the one that is stopping this from happening.

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number6 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 8-Jun-2006 23:21:15
#79 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 10854
From: In the village

@hatschi

One of Alan's last remarks here on AW:
Quote:
we have mostly paid for the next batch and the manufacturer has everything lined up for production except the cpu's.
I will post here when we receive them.

The above in reference to the A1s, of course.

Couple that with an announcement of new CPUs for the A1s.

ooooo...fact or fiction?
In the words of Wiffy...Discuss.

#6


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T_Power 
Re: Are you kidding me?
Posted on 8-Jun-2006 23:44:45
#80 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 8-Sep-2003
Posts: 359
From: Durban, South Africa

@mavherzog
Quote:
So, is the situation any better now that it is mid-2006? (yes, I will dig through the forums now that I am, again, back here.) :)

This Saturday the 10th ACK will be demo'ing real live H/W you can see and use.

Cheers,
Tim

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