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nubechecorre 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 25-Oct-2010 19:14:08
#61 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Nov-2003
Posts: 895
From: San remo -Italy-

@number6

Does fairlanefastback work for Elbox?

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number6 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 25-Oct-2010 19:15:44
#62 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11537
From: In the village

@Comi

ok. I worded my post badly...again.

You seemed to want Amigaworld involvement in an interview.
Fine. AW has done that before.
In order to do that, I thought I would refer you to someone who has a knowledge of what you are interested in doing.
That's the only reason I gave you the link, so you could write to him if you are serious.

#6

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Dandy 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 7:57:45
#63 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Mar-2003
Posts: 3049
From: Cologne * Germany

@ChrisH

Quote:

ChrisH wrote:
@T-J

...
would there really be any point in such an accelerator?



Hmmmmm - given that I still have OS 3.9/WarpOS 16.1 as my main system on my towered A4000 PPC and that OS 4.0 classic is just an experimental installation (does not support my NIC, has limited support for my Mediator, does not support the USB 2.0 of my DENEB), I would clearly say YES.

Quote:

ChrisH wrote:

...
You might as well buy a Sam440 (Mini-ITX model, second hand) and try to fit it inside an A1200 (or C=USA) case! Not to mention that a Sam440 will be many times faster, far more reliable, quieter, use less power, etc, etc. A Sam440 would probably also be cheaper!



Fully agreed so far - but still I would be lacking USB 2.0 highspeed, which I do not want to miss again.

Quote:

ChrisH wrote:

...
But I don't see the point of that!



You not being able to see the point does not necessarily mean there is no point for those interested.

Quote:

ChrisH wrote:

OS3.x would not be able to take advantage of the PPC's speed (the main point of the PPC accelerator!), so it would be relegated to playing classic (hardware banging) 68k games.



I still use OS 3.9/WarpOS as my main system. Should OS 4.1 for classics support the things I'm missing in 4.0 classic, 4.1 will become my main system.
But until then or until I get the A1X1k with OS 4.1 it stays as it is...

Quote:

ChrisH wrote:

You might as well do that using UAE (on OS4) or a MiniMig! Or even keep a vanilla A1200 around for such purposes...



No.
Neither of them is capable to run e.g. WipeOut...

Furthermore I'm more interested in serious applications than in gaming (although I also have some games).

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Dandy 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 8:22:19
#64 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Mar-2003
Posts: 3049
From: Cologne * Germany

@delshay

Quote:

delshay wrote:

...
i hope it contains 3D drivers for Bvision/Cvision.



...and for the PCI graphic cards (such as Voodoo and the like) as well, please!

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Akiko 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 8:26:30
#65 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 26-Mar-2004
Posts: 781
From: UK


I think some people are missing the fact that the Mediator can't do real (DMA) and this is only achievable with Elbox using elaborate hacking techniques which Hyperion rightly don't support.

The best news for me is there will soon be native Radion drivers, and for Ethernet and sound we already have Realtek and Terratec cards supported, what others specifically require (DMA) anyway besides TV tuner cards?



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d0pefish 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 8:49:00
#66 ]
Member
Joined: 16-Apr-2006
Posts: 14
From: Unknown

I take it there's still no G-Rex support either, which, again makes OS4.x useless to me.

I also take it that we're still not beyond the politics preventing this from happening... what a shame.

I'd have bought a license otherwise.

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petrol 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 9:03:25
#67 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 25-Jun-2004
Posts: 410
From: France

I'm a bit confused by this news honestly. I know and understand that people with Classic and PPC board wait this, but how many are they now?

One thing could be really cool on classic side, bringing a "New" and compatible (classic and OS4) PPC board expansion. A board expansion for Minimig or future Natami a la Elbox Mediator+Shark, with full power, DMA, etc...

Petrol.

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KimmoK 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 9:05:53
#68 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2003
Posts: 5211
From: Ylikiiminki, Finland

as the support continues, I'll be surpriced if we do not see a new PPC & PCI(e) busboard solution for classic machines...

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//
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Deniil715 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 10:07:58
#69 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-May-2003
Posts: 4233
From: Sweden

My view on this:

I think its good that Hyperion releases an update of OS4 for Classic. I mean many people got an expensive old PPC card for their classic, or actually bought a second hand classic with PPC just to run OS4 instead of getting a newer/better/faster alternative. Then ditching these people by only releasing one version of OS4 felt a bit cheap perhaps. So, congrats.

About hardware upgrades for Classic: NOO!!
The Classic is just that, classic. There really is no reason to do this. If you like to smoothly run the latest OS4 you get new hardware designed for it. If you like to play old games you keep the classic the way it is.

I see more point in making a MiniMig PCI card for the NG Amigas to be able to get rid of the flaky/slow emulator and use a real HW emulation for classic games and apps directly inside my AmigaOne, Sam, or perhaps even PC.

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Deniil715 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 10:31:31
#70 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-May-2003
Posts: 4233
From: Sweden

@Dandy

Quote:
Neither of them is capable to run e.g. WipeOut...


OS4 runs WipeOut I'm pretty sure, atleast on AmigaOne.

Limited Mediator support and Quote:
I take it there's still no G-Rex support either, which, again makes OS4.x useless to me.


Upgrade people, upgrade!

I know you spent a ton of money on it, so did I (BPPC 550, BVision 200, FastATA'99 100, Prelude 130, etc.) but it's time to do it again IMO. I did it on the A1-XE (no regrets what so ever related to my old maxed out A1200) and I will do it again with the X1000.

I mean, as soon as you put a PPC, graphics card with VGA monitor and a sound card in your classic it got just as limited in backward compatibility as an NG Amiga. So there is not much to loose (except USB2.0 then perhaps...) only lots to gain. AmigaOS4 is your friend!

Last edited by Deniil715 on 26-Oct-2010 at 10:48 AM.

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Comi 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 10:58:34
#71 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2003
Posts: 659
From: Zlatibor, Serbia

@Deniil715

Or other way: PPC upgrade for expansion boards, and you have stand alone comp.
For example Mediator with: graphic card-Radeon,
sound card, pci PPC card and pci usb card for mouse and keyboard and some other pheripherials.. is stand alone too.
People invest money in classics. I think that accelerator card is good step in right way..
They get allmost new comp.

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Channel_Z 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 11:30:51
#72 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 4-Mar-2009
Posts: 305
From: Unknown

@petrol

Quote:
One thing could be really cool on classic side, bringing a "New" and compatible (classic and OS4) PPC board expansion. A board expansion for Minimig or future Natami a la Elbox Mediator+Shark, with full power, DMA, etc...


Another one who wants to get a hypotethical PPC expansion for Natami and then run an OS which in practice _switches off the entire Natami_. What is the point here? Why do you want to get a carefully made fast new classic Amiga, and then ditch it all and use a foreign CPU?

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Fransexy 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 11:41:02
#73 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Jun-2004
Posts: 2334
From: Elche (Alicante), spain

@Channel_Z

You don't want it? don't buy it. But why do you have to impose what the others should want? if there are people that want it an pay the hight price it presumably would cost, what the hell do you care?


I am other that want a new powerpc accelerator that fits on the trapdor slot

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petrol 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 11:43:18
#74 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 25-Jun-2004
Posts: 410
From: France

@Channel_Z

bad idea, You're right

Petrol.

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nubechecorre 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 12:02:03
#75 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Nov-2003
Posts: 895
From: San remo -Italy-

Quote:

I think some people are missing the fact that the Mediator can't do real (DMA) and this is only achievable with Elbox using elaborate hacking techniques which Hyperion rightly don't support.



Sorry but i do not totally agree with you.. If in one hand i understand and agree with you and hyperion about the hacking techinques, on the other hand i do not understand.. that's because as software house, hyperion has two versions (well honestly more than 2, if you consider all the hardware out there..) one that is the classic version and one that is the amiga ng version (sam, amiga one, pegasosII). So what do i mean?.. that's:

with amiga one/sam/pegII version you have a "clear" (without bug and hacking techniques) version of amiga os that doesn't use any voodoo or hacking program techniques to run on new and modern hardware, and here i totally agree with you

The other version, is the amiga os4 version that runs on an 25years old hardware.. so what do i mean this time?.. well, imho, if you decide to develop a software for a 25 years old hardware, you also decide to adapt (and make use of hacking techinques) your software to achieve the best performance you can get from a very old hardware like the Classic.. Where is the meaning in supporting the AGA chipset when you also have a Mediator BusBoard that is able and give you the chance to use a Voodoo or a Radeon (?) that is thousand times faster than the AGA chipset?..

I would like to use the amiga os 4.1, but i'd like to use the Soundblaster and the ethernet device and without them, sorry but amiga os 4.1 has no meaning for me.. better stay with the 4.0 as at this point will be the same as the 4.1 (on Classic Machines..)

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Channel_Z 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 12:12:12
#76 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 4-Mar-2009
Posts: 305
From: Unknown

@Fransexy

I care because I am personally involved with the Natami. That is why I want a potential user to motivate such a request.

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HammerD 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 26-Oct-2010 19:56:58
#77 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Oct-2003
Posts: 934
From: Ontario, Canada

@nubechecorre

You will be able to use:

Permedia2 or Voodoo 3/4/5 PCI Graphic Cards
Radeon PCI graphic cards (assuming electrical compatibility)
Some Mediators require 5V tolerant Radeon cards - you can buy them from Elbox, although some cards already work
RTL8029 PCI network card
DENEB Zorro USB card (3rd party) with lots of usb devices (such as sound and network)
(driver supplied by E3B/Chris Hodges)
ZorRAM for memory paging on Zorro 3 machines

Other Zorro cards (such as graphics cards) where drivers already exist. Picasso, GVP Spectrum, etc, etc.

I think Ben also mentioned the use of PCI IDE controllers (silicon image).

Soundblaster requires a new DMA capable driver.
TV Tuner cards and other cards also require DMA and new drivers.

There is nothing precluding the future development of such drivers, which can also be accomplished by 3rd parties.

So i think that is pretty good out of the gate. I hope you agree

Last edited by HammerD on 26-Oct-2010 at 07:58 PM.
Last edited by HammerD on 26-Oct-2010 at 07:58 PM.
Last edited by HammerD on 26-Oct-2010 at 07:57 PM.

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Dandy 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 27-Oct-2010 6:27:47
#78 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Mar-2003
Posts: 3049
From: Cologne * Germany

@Deniil715

Quote:

Deniil715 wrote:
My view on this:

...
About hardware upgrades for Classic: NOO!!
The Classic is just that, classic. There really is no reason to do this. If you like to smoothly run the latest OS4 you get new hardware designed for it.
...



And what if I'd like to have the A1X1k AND my trusty old A4kPPC with a faster PPC? It's my hobby after all...

If you don't want to have a new, faster PPC expansion board for classics - fine - just don't buy one.
But please do not dictate others what they want to have and what not!

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He got his brain accidently - the bone marrow in his back would have been sufficient for him!
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stefanor 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 27-Oct-2010 6:57:44
#79 ]
Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2006
Posts: 36
From: Italy

Hi,
could somebody point me to the original announcement of OS4.1 being available for the Classics? Thanks.

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clusteruk 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 on PPC-equipped Classics
Posted on 27-Oct-2010 6:59:18
#80 ]
Super Member
Joined: 20-Nov-2008
Posts: 1544
From: Marston Moretaine, England

The decision on PPC hardware is as always based on , number of people who will buy, end cost of product and time involved in development.

If these figures add up then you will get a PPC for Classics. Just like what has happened to A1200 and A600 accelerators.

So ask your retailers, offer them deposits, whatever then you may get one. I think a ppc for 299 euros would sell but I doubt the PPC chips are available to make that possible.

Finally, if they do come out, has anybody got the buster upgrade chips for my adorable A3000D

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