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djrikki 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 16-Apr-2011 20:38:05
#921 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 22-Jun-2010
Posts: 2077
From: Grimsby, UK

@TrevorDick

When Roman has finally finished his Amiga Future vodka I presume... apparently he isn't a big drinker so....

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samo79 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 16-Apr-2011 20:50:15
#922 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 13-Feb-2003
Posts: 3445
From: Italy, Perugia

@djrikki

And when he finished i might give him another one

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realize 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 16-Apr-2011 22:06:38
#923 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Apr-2003
Posts: 1797
From: nyc

@kas1e

Congrats on the bugfix! Very exciting. Looks like you are almost done and can have your life back! lol

as far as this:


Quote:
As i understand , we have for now : - 1 month of waiting for classic release (i think no more, but can be more as usual) - 1 month for chiliout and politic stuff inside of hyperion and realise that time to release update3. - 1 month for beta-testing and preparing of update3 (or even 2 months).


If the "community" were more up in arms over this bs we would probably had a release a long time ago. I'd say 6months at least for next release, and all the fanboys will make posts with smilies and "when its done" and now stealing morphos "two more weeks" (which is lame) *sigh* how tiresome.

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kas1e 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 16-Apr-2011 22:12:47
#924 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Jan-2004
Posts: 3536
From: Russia

@Trevor
I hope we will finish all soon :) Very close of course, but still not finished enough.

@djrikky, samo79 & all
Its not "when roman finish it", its "when deniil / kas1e / tboekel / fab & others" finish it.

For now i think we need to go this route: fix few last bugs (hope Deniil will help a lot with that), then need to rebuild all the libs without debug info (to reduce size), then check how fast it loads on running and can it be speeduped or not, then check how it with and without optimisation and so on. I.e. all that "prepare for release stuff". And when all of this will be done, then we can think about "how to release it"..

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kas1e 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 16-Apr-2011 22:15:10
#925 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Jan-2004
Posts: 3536
From: Russia

@realize
Quote:

Congrats on the bugfix! Very exciting. Looks like you are almost done and can have your life back! lol


Even with worrying about amiga-crap, i have femaly/job/friends/chilling and all the other problems, and owb not take all of my time of course :)

Quote:

If the "community" were more up in arms over this bs we would probably had a release a long time ago. I'd say 6months at least for next release, and all the fanboys will make posts with smilies and "when its done" and now stealing morphos "two more weeks" (which is lame) *sigh* how tiresome.


I think we will found a way to release it fast, without long waiting.

Last edited by kas1e on 16-Apr-2011 at 10:18 PM.

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samo79 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 16-Apr-2011 22:43:08
#926 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 13-Feb-2003
Posts: 3445
From: Italy, Perugia

@kas1e

Not so important but i forget to add an old crap, it's about SVG (altrought maybe it is already fixed, don't know)

When playing with Acid Test3 i get an ASL request with some garbage on it (a strange file called "DOL0D") this ASL request is similar to the latest OWB 3.31 that doesn't support SVG anymore. (obviously on OWB 3.31 there is no garbage on ASL, just the SVG image that need to be downloaded manually)

Does our MUI OWB port support SVG built-in yet ?

Last edited by samo79 on 16-Apr-2011 at 10:47 PM.

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Fab 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 16-Apr-2011 22:56:25
#927 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Mar-2004
Posts: 1178
From: Unknown

@samo79

SVG support is just a matter of enabling SVG in cmake options. It takes substancially longer to compile with SVG enabled.

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samo79 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 16-Apr-2011 23:02:44
#928 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 13-Feb-2003
Posts: 3445
From: Italy, Perugia

@Fab

Ok, so it was enabled ... not so easy to determinate with my old pretty pre-Alpha bin :-/

I get this ASL request and then a bad DSI crash (acid3 test remain at 69%, not more) can't test plain SVG files as drag&drop or open file option doesn't work too ...

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Fab 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 16-Apr-2011 23:27:33
#929 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Mar-2004
Posts: 1178
From: Unknown

@samo79

I don't say it was enabled, but it's trivial to enable it.
On the other hand, there's no reason you would crash on ACID3 when SVG is disabled. It's normal you get a download requester, but that's it, and the test continues and you should reach 93/100.

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samo79 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 16-Apr-2011 23:59:13
#930 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 13-Feb-2003
Posts: 3445
From: Italy, Perugia

@Fab

Quote:
I don't say it was enabled, but it's trivial to enable it.


Yes i know that enabling is easy but my question was if it was already enabled (now)
(sorry i didn't read carefully what you wrote, ehm it's a bit late)

Quote:
On the other hand, there's no reason you would crash on ACID3 when SVG is disabled.


Don't know the reason of the crash altrough most probably it is already solved in latest WIP

Quote:
It's normal you get a download requester, but that's it, and the test continues and you should reach 93/100.


Well 93% it's exactly what i get with OWB 3.31, (and an ASL request), but that means SVG was not enabled during compile, definitely i ask Roman because here i get a similar behaviour also on MUI-OWB (crash apart) so my question was if he enabled it or not ... that's it

Last edited by samo79 on 17-Apr-2011 at 12:02 AM.

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tonyw 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 17-Apr-2011 5:35:35
#931 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 3229
From: Sydney (of course)

@kas1e

What is this "Update 3" you are talking about? Are you expecting or hoping for Hyperion to make a new release of OS4.1?

AFAIK Hyperion have not even suggested that there might be another Update.

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Hyperion Support Forum: http://forum.hyperion-entertainment.biz/index.php

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kas1e 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 17-Apr-2011 6:37:14
#932 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Jan-2004
Posts: 3536
From: Russia

@samo79
You need not refer or saing about any of your crashes of beta-very-alpha-buggy-unfixed-beta-alpha version which you have. All the problems which you can have there, can be already fixed or not present at all anymore.

And Fab for sure can't know bugs of very-first-alpha-beta-ugly port-tryes which you can have on buggy-public-mui3.9 :)

@tonyw
Quote:

What is this "Update 3" you are talking about? Are you expecting or hoping for Hyperion to make a new release of OS4.1?


Strange phrase. Did you not read what users ask/wait/want lately there and on all the other forums ?:) Did you not expect update or any new release os OS yourself ? But well.. you are beta-tester, so for sure for you its not so matter updates, because you already have all latest os components.

Its not i talk about update3 only, its everyone wait and think that there should be update3 right now or in near future, just because if not, hyperion will loose users. Because waiting for update, for more that 1 year, where everyone wait : new shell (can you please answer now for us, did you finish it or not ?:) ), fixed usb and usb2.0, fixed warp3d and all the other fixes.

Having those fixes and addons in beta, and not release an update for users, who moanin and wait for that update : its just madness and bad-wrong marketing at all in the whole.

Quote:

AFAIK Hyperion have not even suggested that there might be another Update.


By this phrase you mean, that there can be no update3 at all, but os4.2 for new price ? I.e. users can wait another 1 year ?

Then in this case, you can be sure, many of us will show a finger to os4 and to company who do not think about their users.

I know you say before that releases in 1 year are not necessary today , which are again absolutly wrong. Because when need _just-small-fixes_ then releases should be every half of year.

For what the hell we all should wait years, to have small fixes for necessary parts , which _ALREADY_ fixed ? What the crappo-politic is it ? Politic of loosing users ? Or what ?

@all
Anyway, as i say, we will release OWB even without update3 (or does not matter how will called next update/release of OS)

Last edited by kas1e on 17-Apr-2011 at 06:42 AM.
Last edited by kas1e on 17-Apr-2011 at 06:39 AM.

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Kicko 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 17-Apr-2011 7:30:22
#933 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 19-Jun-2004
Posts: 5009
From: Sweden

@kas1e

+1

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eder 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 17-Apr-2011 7:41:52
#934 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Mar-2004
Posts: 280
From: Unknown

@kas1e

+1

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freeaks 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 17-Apr-2011 8:09:59
#935 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 2-Jan-2010
Posts: 225
From: Unknown

@kas1e

that's the problem with closed source software.
if the owner decide to make users wait, there's little they can do about it, but just wait.

hyperion seem to me like the only company in 10years who have picked up the amiga brand and really care about it.
it's a very good thing but,
they are kind of slow, and stingy on communications with user base.
i used to use morphos few years ago, then i abandonned it because of communication problems and secrecy around it. the communication with mos-devs /users was little and bad:

when will be the next update? what components will be updated ?
--> don't ask. "when it's done" / "two more weeks" / users don't need to know ... etc ..

so i choose to leave morphos. i choosed os4 instead where thing seemed more open and more communicative.
(plus, i liked the way os4 wanted to go: to evolve from the old os3.x api and go on modernizing the system: new memory system and so on..)
but finally now it seems to me that os4 team and morphos team have same attitude,
they don't communicate enough (or not well enough) and all is shrouded in secrecy.
and users are left in the dark. this is ridiculous.

--> will there be an update3 ? what will be in it ? when will it be out ?
no answers.

with open source you don't have such problem.
you have access to all, you can help too, updates aren't kept back etc ...
so, i don't wanna hear about morphos and os4 anymore.
from now on, if i want my amiga fix, i'll play with aros.
i don't need dedicated hardware (expensive and outdated).
and it's ahead of competion anyway.
they already have gallium3D, and poseidon usb stack (usb2 support)
and also shell buffer/scrollbar .. and it's multiplatform too.
i don't see mos or os4 advantages anymore.

finally with closed source software we saw for years a problem: the software was held hostage by the owners. no amigaos updates for years.
untill a new owner who really cared about amiga appeared.
the situation here is kind of similar: updates are still coming it's true but,
only when owner decide the time is right. what will be in it? only os4-team knows..
in other words: the software is still held hostage..in a less bad way but still.



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hotrod 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 17-Apr-2011 11:26:48
#936 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Mar-2003
Posts: 2986
From: Stockholm, Sweden

@kas1e

+1

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kas1e 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 17-Apr-2011 12:29:29
#937 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Jan-2004
Posts: 3536
From: Russia

@freeaks

That all right, but AROS as well have 2 sides. Good one its no legal boredom or any kind of politic, the other problem is that its always buggy. All the time. Every new update bring new bugs. Its just unpossible to live with it all the time. Sure, AROS users will say different, but for now mos and aos4 much more polished and for sure pretty stable.

I like os4 in general, i just wish that Hyperion will have a other look on all the stuff someday, and will make it better not from one side, but also from the politic side. I am sure all the users will happy if Hyperion will just say : every half of year we will release an update, and does not matter how much changes will be done. The same for their blog: update it 2 times in month stable (or ok, 1 time in moth), and i 100% sure, after 2-3 years, Hyperion will have more buyers of OS , more users , more software , more sales and more money. And users wlll say "that and that suck,and os4 rulz, because company did politic right".

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Fab 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 17-Apr-2011 12:38:22
#938 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Mar-2004
Posts: 1178
From: Unknown

@freeaks

Quote:

and it's ahead of competion anyway.
they already have gallium3D, and poseidon usb stack (usb2 support)
and also shell buffer/scrollbar .. and it's multiplatform too.


I won't comment about your hate against MorphOS developers since it's pretty irrational, but about AROS being ahead, that's rather arguable to say the least.

It's still lacking in many areas unfortunately compared to the others (zune, desktop, general stability, gfx abilities/acceleration, software and a lot more). Some of these aspects are fortunately being worked on, but others aren't and haven't been for too long, with noone willing to.

Maybe you should join AROS effort and improve it. That's what the OpenSource heaven is for, so what are you waiting for? :)

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Tuxedo 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 17-Apr-2011 13:07:43
#939 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Nov-2003
Posts: 2327
From: Perugia, ITALY

@kas1e

Quote:
I like os4 in general, i just wish that Hyperion will have a other look on all the stuff someday, and will make it better not from one side, but also from the politic side. I am sure all the users will happy if Hyperion will just say : every half of year we will release an update, and does not matter how much changes will be done. The same for their blog: update it 2 times in month stable (or ok, 1 time in moth), and i 100% sure, after 2-3 years, Hyperion will have more buyers of OS , more users , more software , more sales and more money. And users wlll say "that and that suck,and os4 rulz, because company did politic right".


no more to add!

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freeaks 
Re: AmigaOS4.1 OWB Development whilst we wait?
Posted on 17-Apr-2011 13:22:20
#940 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 2-Jan-2010
Posts: 225
From: Unknown

@Fab

join and help aros ? no thanks.
amigaos and clones are unusable as operating system.
useless. crashy, no software, no modern standards, it's the 3rd world of computing.
i kept an interest in it for the memories i had about a system ahead of its time ..20 years ago..
nowdays all i see is a small community around 3 outdated OSes and the community fight hard to prevent their evolution (of the OSes). for the sake of backward compatibility.
the OS3.x api is dead beef. memory administration ain't good enough.
i won't join nothing in this mess .. i'm looking though,
i'd say i'm happy i left it all in 2002.
i bought a sam 440 flex 3 months ago though.. after a quick try, i'm selling it ..
are you jokng or what ? ;)
it was ahead of its time back then.. now it's among some of the worst OSes in use today!




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