Click Here
home features news forums classifieds faqs links search
6071 members 
Amiga Q&A /  Free for All /  Emulation /  Gaming / (Latest Posts)
Login

Nickname

Password

Lost Password?

Don't have an account yet?
Register now!

Support Amigaworld.net
Your support is needed and is appreciated as Amigaworld.net is primarily dependent upon the support of its users.
Donate

Menu
Main sections
Home
Features
News
Forums
Classifieds
Links
Downloads
Extras
OS4 Zone
IRC Network
AmigaWorld Radio
Newsfeed
Top Members
Amiga Dealers
Information
About Us
FAQs
Advertise
Polls
Terms of Service
Search

IRC Channel
Server: irc.amigaworld.net
Ports: 1024,5555, 6665-6669
SSL port: 6697
Channel: #Amigaworld
Channel Policy and Guidelines

Who's Online
0 crawler(s) on-line.
 81 guest(s) on-line.
 0 member(s) on-line.



You are an anonymous user.
Register Now!
 NutsAboutAmiga:  39 mins ago
 Zylesea:  1 hr 30 mins ago
 eliyahu:  1 hr 35 mins ago
 zipper:  1 hr 37 mins ago
 BigD:  1 hr 41 mins ago
 matthey:  1 hr 59 mins ago
 Hypex:  2 hrs 4 mins ago
 DiscreetFX:  2 hrs 4 mins ago
 RobertB:  2 hrs 6 mins ago
 Hammer:  2 hrs 37 mins ago

/  Forum Index
   /  Amiga OS4.x \ Workbench 4.x
      /  OS 4.1 Update 3 Released
Register To Post

Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 Next Page )
PosterThread
OldFart 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 13:45:35
#201 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2004
Posts: 3062
From: Stad; en d'r is moar ain stad en da's Stad. Makkelk zat!

@Deniil715

Quote:
- Create SYS:CustomSys/

Very wise decision! I like your approach as it is quite simmilar to mine. I would advise you instead of creating a directory in SYS: turn CustomSys into a partition of its own! And don't forgret to install MARvel in order to rearrange the sequence of access of those multi-assigns.

OldFart

_________________
More then three levels of indigestion and you're scroomed!

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OldFart 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 13:54:17
#202 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2004
Posts: 3062
From: Stad; en d'r is moar ain stad en da's Stad. Makkelk zat!

@Chain-Q

Quote:
You invented the MorphOS way of keeping your system clean.

Hm, credit to the MorphOS team for paying attention and listening well, when I detailed this way more or less some 10 or 15 years ago...

OldFart

_________________
More then three levels of indigestion and you're scroomed!

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OldFart 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 13:59:20
#203 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2004
Posts: 3062
From: Stad; en d'r is moar ain stad en da's Stad. Makkelk zat!

@number6

Quote:
Do you have multiple boot partitions?

Well *I* do have and because of that and the fact that i keep them clean of any 3rd parties stuff, I was up and running in about 80 minutes after downloading the update. And fully customised as to my preferences.

OldFart

_________________
More then three levels of indigestion and you're scroomed!

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
cheesegrate 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 14:14:29
#204 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 30-Apr-2007
Posts: 259
From: Australia

@OldFart
Quote:
Hm, credit to the MorphOS team for paying attention and listening well, when I detailed this way more or less some 10 or 15 years ago...


;) if you are as smart as you claim you would have been a morphos user from way back :)

_________________
"ICE CREAM, ICE CREAM!" - Speedball 2.

"Look behind you, a three-headed monkey!" - Monkey Island

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Chain-Q 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 14:45:19
#205 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Jan-2005
Posts: 824
From: Budapest, Hungary

@OldFart
Actually, I did similar thing on my classics too, with OS 3.1, even before I had internet, and I could read your smart advice related to this topic (or copy the idea from elsewhere). But then, may I ask, if it's *THE* recommended way of doing things, and its known since such a long time, why it's not default in the offical AmigaOS?

_________________
MorphOS, classic Amiga, demoscene, and stuff
"When a bridge is not enough, build a Viaduct!"
"Strip the Amiga community of speculation and we can fit every forum on a 720k floppy" (by resle)

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
ChrisH 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 15:00:22
#206 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Jan-2005
Posts: 6679
From: Unknown

@OldFart Quote:
Hm, credit to the MorphOS team for paying attention and listening well, when I detailed this way more or less some 10 or 15 years ago...

As I recall, I devised something similar when I tried the first public release of MorphOS 0.x on my A1200 (PPC) many years ago. Don't think I publicised it until rather later though.

My solution (which I used until switching to OS4) have the *custom* stuff in Sys: itself, and the actual OS files in a sub-folder. However, this somewhat relied upon the TrueMultiAssign hack, which does not work on OS4 . This allowed me to share the same custom files & preferences between AmigaOS3.x, MorphOS v0.x & (via file synchronisation) Amithlon & WinUAE.

Last edited by ChrisH on 31-Aug-2011 at 03:03 PM.
Last edited by ChrisH on 31-Aug-2011 at 03:01 PM.

_________________
Author of the PortablE programming language.
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue...

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OldFart 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 15:04:07
#207 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2004
Posts: 3062
From: Stad; en d'r is moar ain stad en da's Stad. Makkelk zat!

@Chain-Q

Quote:
But then, may I ask, if it's *THE* recommended way of doing things, and its known since such a long time, why it's not default in the offical AmigaOS?

Maybe we're not discussing a religion, thereby allowing for more then one 'right' way of doing things? Mark it as the joy of an Amiga (any variant applies) to be able to do things *YOUR* way.

Like Frank Sinatra recited in this song called 'My Way':

Songwriters: CARTER, SHAWN C/ANKA, PAUL/FRANCOIS, CLAUDE/THIBAUT, GILES


And now, the end is here
And so I face the final curtain
My friend, I'll say it clear
I'll state my case, of which I'm certain
I've lived my life that's full
I traveled each and ev're highway
And more, much more than this: I did it my way


And like you, I started this in my early A1200 days, with OS3.1 and later OS3.5 and 3.9, but it was not fully to my liking as my knowledge about the Amiga was even more limited then it is today.
But it goes to show that a brilliant idea often has more then one origin and is never lost.

OldFart

_________________
More then three levels of indigestion and you're scroomed!

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OldFart 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 15:07:18
#208 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2004
Posts: 3062
From: Stad; en d'r is moar ain stad en da's Stad. Makkelk zat!

@cheesegrate

Quote:
;) if you are as smart as you claim you would have been a morphos user from way back :)

Or maybe I'm even smarter? But that would probably surprise me even more then that it would you, I think.

OldFart

_________________
More then three levels of indigestion and you're scroomed!

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OldFart 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 15:23:36
#209 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2004
Posts: 3062
From: Stad; en d'r is moar ain stad en da's Stad. Makkelk zat!

@ChrisH

I truly got things working correct after I gained sufficient knowledge to create MARvel. From then on I got my head around this split (OS vs 3rd parties) setup and never looked back.

OldFart

_________________
More then three levels of indigestion and you're scroomed!

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Deniil715 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 15:32:39
#210 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 14-May-2003
Posts: 4237
From: Sweden

I already heard from Develin that my way is the MOS way, hehe. Although I did invent it myself.

@OldFart

Quote:
Very wise decision! I like your approach as it is quite simmilar to mine. I would advise you instead of creating a directory in SYS: turn CustomSys into a partition of its own! And don't forgret to install MARvel in order to rearrange the sequence of access of those multi-assigns.


I prefer to have all system stuff and app and addons on one partition; SYS: to make sure I won't get a boot failure in case a partition falls off or something. But separating it in folders like this makes updates and reinstalls a breeze anyway.

Note: I have NEVER reformatted SYS: since OS4-pre. If some install needed a "clean" partition, I simply deleted everything sys and left my CustomSys (which I didn't have at that time though), Programs, Blandat directories where they are. The installer wouldn't know.

Then everything just worked normally anyway, especially now with my CustomSys I don't even have to copy libs and crap again.

_________________
- Don't get fooled by my avatar, I'm not like that (anymore, mostly... maybe only sometimes)
> Amiga Classic and OS4 developer for OnyxSoft.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Tomppeli 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 15:45:18
#211 ]
Super Member
Joined: 18-Jun-2004
Posts: 1652
From: Home land of Santa, sauna, sisu and salmiakki

I had that kind of split in my classic days like f.ex.: SysFonts and AppFonts dirs both assigned to fonts:. But in the end that way of handling things had it own cons and I got tired of maintaining it all that way. I think some apps didn't like multiple assigns or something else. (If I still remember.) I had also all system drawers doubled or even tripled like: Tools, Tools_more and Tools_more2. Then inside all of those drawers I had more drawers called something like: disabled, outdated, not_needed and so on. All of them full of patches, hacks and free/shareware.

Nowadays before updating an OS take a full backup to another hard drive. Then install the update or make full clean install. Then use Workbench and drag all files and drawers from the backup back to the sys:. Answer "Ignore all" to the requester so any system files, which were installed by the OS, won't be overwritten. But all your personal stuff will be copied back. Sometimes it's better to copy everything back one by one to get rid of old junk you don't bother anymore. If Prefs programs have been updated then open that prefs program and select Open from Project menu and load the settings from your Backup:Prefs/env-archive/sys/. That way you get your settings back without any possible compatibility issues. Maybe it feels like a big job but eventually it's only good.

If some installer script copies something into a wrong place these separate system sys: and personal sys: doesn't help if the script uses absolute paths and doesn't understand anything of your multiple assigns and doesn't give you any options.

_________________
Rock lobster bit me. My Workbench has always preferences. X1000 + AmigaOS4.1 FE
"Anyone can build a fast CPU. The trick is to build a fast system." -Seymour Cray

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
cha05e90 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 15:50:01
#212 ]
Super Member
Joined: 18-Apr-2009
Posts: 1275
From: Germany

@Deniil715

Quote:
I have NEVER reformatted SYS: since OS4-pre.


Same here with my 68k Amigas: I never formatted SYS: since OS2.1...

_________________
X1000|II/G4|440ep|2000/060|2000/040|1000

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
NutsAboutAmiga 
Bad installers install their files to static paths.
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 15:53:36
#213 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 12851
From: Norway

@Deniil715

Bad installers install their files to static paths.

Bad installer just copies stuff from progdir:libs/ to SYS:libs or DH0:libs, and not libs:
So if you move all your 3rd-party stuff to CustomSys/etc, it will not prevent the bad installers from overwriting things in DH0:libs/ or SYS:libs/
If this where to be done correctly the OS installer will need to do a backup of user-startup, and startup-sequence, replace it whit a clean one, do CRC/Size check on all previously installed files to check if are the correct versions, check for duplicate filenames, etc.
Check version numbers of loaded MUI, Reaction classes

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 31-Aug-2011 at 05:11 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 31-Aug-2011 at 03:55 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 31-Aug-2011 at 03:55 PM.

_________________
http://lifeofliveforit.blogspot.no/
Facebook::LiveForIt Software for AmigaOS

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OldFart 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 16:04:04
#214 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2004
Posts: 3062
From: Stad; en d'r is moar ain stad en da's Stad. Makkelk zat!

@cha05e90

Quote:
I never formatted SYS: since OS2.1...

Ah, that clarifies your nick

OldFart

_________________
More then three levels of indigestion and you're scroomed!

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
OldFart 
Re: Bad installers install their files to static paths.
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 16:10:44
#215 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-Sep-2004
Posts: 3062
From: Stad; en d'r is moar ain stad en da's Stad. Makkelk zat!

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:
So if you move all your 3rd-party stuff to CustomSys/etc, it will not prevent the bad installers from overwriting thins in DH0:libs/ or SYS:libs/

Amiga DOS provides you with a proper tool to overcome this: C:Lock SYS:. And again, Bob's y'r uncle.
Put that command in your User-Startup and you're a happy man for the rest of your life!

OldFart

_________________
More then three levels of indigestion and you're scroomed!

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Hypex 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 16:38:58
#216 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 11245
From: Greensborough, Australia

@cheesegrate

Quote:
maybe u should be head beta tester :)




I see your point but I the problem here is that on OS4 MUI has it's own MUI draw while these 68K files were in LIBS. So they are both unsupported (since OS4 has a native one) being 68K and in the wrong place.

Anything that is 68K and not installed as part of the OS or contributed would be under the category of at youre own risk. This would one of those but fell under the radar because of the circumstances.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Xenic 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 17:05:30
#217 ]
Super Member
Joined: 2-Feb-2004
Posts: 1246
From: Pennsylvania, USA

@fingus
Quote:
Transfer from USB-Stick -> HDD (JXFS) 1:49 Min (6,7 MB/sec)

Yes. transfer from USB-Stick is very fast. However, writing to a FAT formatted USB-Stick is a different story. I ran some quick copy tests with 8 files totaling 116 MB. Here are my results with Update3 installed:

Copy from Ram: to USB mem stick formatted with FAT= 280 seconds
Copy from USB mem stick formatted with FAT to Ram:= 13 seconds
Copy from Ram: to USB mem stick formatted with SFS= 25 seconds
Copy from USB mem stick formatted with SFS to Ram:= 12 seconds

As you can see the FAT write speeds are unbelievably slow. My test with an SFS formatted mem stick indicates that the problem isn't with USB; the speed is far greater than I got with USB 1.1. Something appears to be wrong with CrossDosFilesystem because the write speed are comparable to USB 1.1 instead of USB 2.

_________________
X1000 with 2GB memory & OS4.1FE

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Tomppeli 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 17:42:19
#218 ]
Super Member
Joined: 18-Jun-2004
Posts: 1652
From: Home land of Santa, sauna, sisu and salmiakki

Oh btw. My understanding is that under AmigaOS 4.1 the correct place for 3rd party libs and classes is PROGDIR: and not any fixed place. That way you don't need any installer scripts. Just unpack the archive and run the app from there (like Apple Mac users). When you want to get rid of that app just delete its drawer and all related dependencies will be gone the same way. No need to hunt for them from your fixed sys place, no matter if that sys is the original one or your personal separate place. That's the only correct way of doing things. Keep 'em in PROGDIR:.

_________________
Rock lobster bit me. My Workbench has always preferences. X1000 + AmigaOS4.1 FE
"Anyone can build a fast CPU. The trick is to build a fast system." -Seymour Cray

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
sundown 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released___Not OK Now
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 17:46:12
#219 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 30-Aug-2003
Posts: 5120
From: Right here...

@Deniil715

Quote:
and now I can let the OS installers do what they want and I don't have to pollute SYS: itself with 3rd-party stuff which makes it a whole lot easier to find "the bad guys" and to do a "clean" update (just put away CustomSys and update, then put it back again).

Now your getting smart, I did that over a year ago, but I have my 3rd party assigns to my work partition, don't need to move anything.

_________________
Hate tends to make you look stupid...

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
wawa 
Re: OS 4.1 Update 3 Released
Posted on 31-Aug-2011 17:47:42
#220 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6259
From: Unknown

uhm, guys, i think ive brought it a little to far yesterday. had a pretty bad day that may have contributed to that, good thing none paid much attention. there, i hope things get ironed out, for the os4.x users. accept my execuse, please, if critical i dont want to put it all down.

 Status: Offline
Profile     Report this post  
Goto page ( Previous Page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | 12 | 13 | 14 | 15 | 16 Next Page )

[ home ][ about us ][ privacy ] [ forums ][ classifieds ] [ links ][ news archive ] [ link to us ][ user account ]
Copyright (C) 2000 - 2019 Amigaworld.net.
Amigaworld.net was originally founded by David Doyle