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blizz1220
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 17-Jul-2015 8:13:00
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Joined: 12-Jun-2013 Posts: 437
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| @number6
It actually means a lot when your legal claim is "we have nothing to do wit company xyz" , it means you are creating your own trademark or company.
Let's say you want official Amiga Inc. T-Shirt , only one able to give you that license is Amiga Inc.On the other hand let's say you want T-Shirt that has "Amiga" written on it but with some similarity (99.9 % even) with Amiga logo but NOT official Amiga Inc. licensed T-Shirt.
So long story short Commodore Corp. have rights to trademark (where and for what is unknown because they didn't say) while CBM has right to their own trademark.First company's trademark is the one that dates to days of original Commodore , CBM trademark is new company (fanmade lol , they could use more research to be called die-hard fans).
So it's two distinct trademarks.Purpose of "trademark" as legal institute is so that nobody can make fake Coca-Cola drink and sell it using real Coca-Cola advertising budget.If there is no way to mix up products between these two Commodore companies there is no ground (or even reason) for legal actions.
If Commodore USA went "ignore trademark" road , which is something that many solicitors would suggest their case would be cheaper to make.Let's not kid ourselves , Amiga or Commodore is not same as Apple that is big company even today and probably registered properly for all kinds of goods and services worldwide.
P.S. Phone suck , instead logo 5 extra buttons would do wonder to play those emulated games. Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 08:15 AM.
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number6
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 17-Jul-2015 11:12:32
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Joined: 25-Mar-2005 Posts: 11662
From: In the village | | |
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| @blizz1220
Quote:
So long story short Commodore Corp. have rights to trademark (where and for what is unknown because they didn't say) |
this is "not saying"?
Quote:
Mark Description:
The mark consists of The letter "C" followed by two horizontal bars with slanted tips followed by the word "Commodore". |
#6
_________________ This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author. *Secrecy has served us so well* |
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blizz1220
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 17-Jul-2015 14:06:04
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Joined: 12-Jun-2013 Posts: 437
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| @number6
I only read the website.No products were made for a very long time though and they said all rights worldwide (for me same as not saying).
From what I read they can make official Commodore smartphones and sell them in which case they could sue CBM.Problem is they didn't.
In Asiarim vs Commodore Int. case court awarded damages for licensing issues but not loss of profit for unfair competition (my guess is that the reason is again no products to sell so no loss of profit).
I would be interested to see what kind of hardware Commodore Corporation has to show for themselves because registration by itself , without making hardware or software , may be invalid in some countries.Also , is this trademark really registered internationally and based on what international copyright treaty.
Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 02:09 PM.
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blizz1220
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 17-Jul-2015 14:06:24
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Joined: 12-Jun-2013 Posts: 437
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| Double post but logo seems a little strange to me.
Was it filled that way just for reference or is it because someone used graphic search ?
Commodore Business Machines has some trademarks registered in UK:
https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmowner/Owner/Results?Name=Commodore
Some of them date to 1984 and as far as I know company isn't around anymore.Clear answer to who can do what with C= logo and trademark would need a lot more investigation and correspondence.New CBM seem confident they are legally good to go.I'm more fascinated how the very word Commodore followed by "makes new ..." gets instant chain reaction on tech sites. Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 02:30 PM. Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 02:10 PM. Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 02:07 PM.
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number6
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 17-Jul-2015 14:30:53
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Joined: 25-Mar-2005 Posts: 11662
From: In the village | | |
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| @blizz1220
Quote:
In Asiarim vs Commodore Int. case court awarded damages for licensing issues but not loss of profit for unfair competition (my guess is that the reason is again no products to sell so no loss of profit). |
It was... (let's try to be accurate here): Quote:
C=HOLDINGS B.V., Plaintiff, VERSUS ASIARIM CORPORATION, Defendant. |
And until the case was concluded you have to remember that anything about income related to the two licensees of Asiarim - CommodoreUSA and Manomio. So, of course C=Holdings B.V. had no profit to declare and no way to prove they had products. The licensees were Asiarim's licensees and C=Holdings B.V. hadn't even won the right yet to do their own licensing.
#6_________________ This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author. *Secrecy has served us so well* |
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blizz1220
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 17-Jul-2015 14:36:31
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Joined: 12-Jun-2013 Posts: 437
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| @number6
Yes but I think court would award all damages (loss of profit for license issues and product sales , loss of reputation etc.).
Edited post above.What made me think that this new CBM company will have a free lunch is that they managed to register company in hardware with disputed name and logo in UK.No doubt legal checks were made before registration was complete.
This is Commodore B V trademark as registered in UK :
https://www.ipo.gov.uk/tmcase/Results/1/UK00001216344
I just read paper and dropped the subject. Last edited by blizz1220 on 17-Jul-2015 at 02:41 PM.
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number6
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 18-Jul-2015 17:14:30
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Joined: 25-Mar-2005 Posts: 11662
From: In the village | | |
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| @thread
Just posting what appears to have been a direct question from one of the early reviewers to Commodore Business Machines LTD and their personally unsigned response.
Info after *update*
Some unusual statements on the site to be sure...
#6
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blizz1220
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 18-Jul-2015 18:42:12
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Joined: 12-Jun-2013 Posts: 437
From: Unknown | | |
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| @number6
Seems they started from zero , hired attorney , did checks and are now free to do what is within their rights.Probably best way to approach either Amiga or Commodore trademark because both are so fragmented that even though you pay for license some other company (or 2 or 3) may come claiming you are violating their property.
If they survive for more than a 6 moon cycles maybe they could lend trademark to actual Commodore and Amiga projects to gain popularity or support them in some way. |
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number6
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 18-Jul-2015 20:38:35
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Joined: 25-Mar-2005 Posts: 11662
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| @thread
Semantics here seem to express a contrary thought.
Quote:
The team also is working with unnamed software houses to bring some of the 1980's best games on the PET before shipping. |
from the Wired source most other articles referred to
Quote:
there won't be any games at it's launch however. |
newest source
#6
_________________ This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author. *Secrecy has served us so well* |
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blizz1220
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 19-Jul-2015 4:15:58
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Regular Member  |
Joined: 12-Jun-2013 Posts: 437
From: Unknown | | |
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| @number6
Here is something interesting I found about trademarks in UK (may apply to other countries but I can read English).
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/ attachment_data/file/308759/revokingnonuse.pdf
To sum it up , if trademark isn't used for 5 years it can be revoked by anyone and the proprietor must supply evidence of products and services , sale records or such data to avoid trademark being revoked. |
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number6
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 21-Jul-2015 15:55:58
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Elite Member  |
Joined: 25-Mar-2005 Posts: 11662
From: In the village | | |
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| @thread
Another article questioning the Wired content:
including comments from general manager
#6
_________________ This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author. *Secrecy has served us so well* |
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damocles
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 21-Jul-2015 19:11:42
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Joined: 22-Dec-2007 Posts: 1719
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| @number6
Quote:
Funny, I am having a strong sense of Deja vu for some reason after reading those posts.
_________________ Dammy |
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number6
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 21-Jul-2015 19:19:28
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Elite Member  |
Joined: 25-Mar-2005 Posts: 11662
From: In the village | | |
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| @damocles
Quote:
Funny, I am having a strong sense of Deja vu for some reason after reading those posts. |
Been having that myself based on the links I've posted in particular. Heh.
#6
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number6
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 21-Jul-2015 21:18:01
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Elite Member  |
Joined: 25-Mar-2005 Posts: 11662
From: In the village | | |
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| @thread
http://www.commodore-pet.com/shop/
apparently available?
And after checking, for what it's worth...
http://www.commodoresmart.com (until now a write for info page) now redirects to the above.
#6
Last edited by number6 on 21-Jul-2015 at 10:31 PM.
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LimoU.Sin
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 21-Jul-2015 21:44:02
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Joined: 3-Jul-2015 Posts: 133
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| How can a game console meant for big TV screens be replaced with small phone screens with crappy controllers?! I know kids are small in size but they grow.!
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blizz1220
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 22-Jul-2015 5:55:50
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Regular Member  |
Joined: 12-Jun-2013 Posts: 437
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| @LimoU.Sin
They are registered for smartphones only so they couldn't make anything else even if they wanted unless they apply for broader registration.
Kinda lost interest but depending on sales they might create interesting product in future , nothing stopping their (hired) factories to do something like Commodore ARM desktop or laptop.
So if anyone has desire to become even newer Commodore and make something else now the proper way has been established.
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number6
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 22-Jul-2015 20:03:37
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Elite Member  |
Joined: 25-Mar-2005 Posts: 11662
From: In the village | | |
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| @thread
The designer of the product as reported:
Quote:
But designer Massimo Battaglia decided to reimagine the Commodore 64 for the modern age, as an Android smartphone. The attention to design goes deeper than simply adding the commodore logo between two haptic navigation keys. |
Source
mentioned here as well
Name also appears many places including facebook.
Today disavows any connection to this product and to this company.
Quote:
"The Commodore PET is just a rebranded Chinese phone with two free emulators preinstalled," said Massimo Battaglia, an Italian industrial designer who was credited in some media reports with having designed the phone.
"Google the Orgtec Wa1, which was presented in December for only US$145 ," he told TechNewsWorld.
Although he acknowledged designing a concept for the Commodore PET a couple of months ago, "it was completely different," Battaglia said.
He now emphatically distances himself from the device: "I did not design the Commodore PET, I am not linked with Commodore Business Machines, and I don't want to be associated with that rebranding operation." |
Source
#6_________________ This posting, in its entirety, represents solely the perspective of the author. *Secrecy has served us so well* |
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blizz1220
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 22-Jul-2015 20:52:36
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Regular Member  |
Joined: 12-Jun-2013 Posts: 437
From: Unknown | | |
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| @number6
He made the one that looked like Amiga mouse ...
Maybe more accurate to say cross between Amiga case commodore shape and amiga mouse , frankenphone ...
They say that emulators will be "integrated" so they might still save face if they invest in software side just a little like SID/MOD player Android app and errr ... something  Last edited by blizz1220 on 22-Jul-2015 at 09:04 PM.
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damocles
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 22-Jul-2015 22:03:51
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Super Member  |
Joined: 22-Dec-2007 Posts: 1719
From: Unknown | | |
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| @number6
Quote:
Today disavows any connection to this product and to this company.
Quote:
"The Commodore PET is just a rebranded Chinese phone with two free emulators preinstalled," said Massimo Battaglia, an Italian industrial designer who was credited in some media reports with having designed the phone.
"Google the Orgtec Wa1, which was presented in December for only US$145 ," he told TechNewsWorld.
Although he acknowledged designing a concept for the Commodore PET a couple of months ago, "it was completely different," Battaglia said.
He now emphatically distances himself from the device: "I did not design the Commodore PET, I am not linked with Commodore Business Machines, and I don't want to be associated with that rebranding operation." |
Source
#6 |
Sounds like either he was in a pissing match with CBM or perhaps C= Holding has awakened. Guess time will tell if there is another reason why. _________________ Dammy |
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number6
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Re: Commodore PET Android 5 Smartphone by CBM Ltd. London Posted on 22-Jul-2015 22:20:15
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Elite Member  |
Joined: 25-Mar-2005 Posts: 11662
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| @damocles
For what it's worth:
Google images for the designer
#6
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