@TRIPOS

Quote:

TRIPOS wrote: Quote: Hans wrote: ** Not too surprising given that the quad-core 2.5 GHz 970 based machine was designed to push the limits of what was possible with the technology of the time, whereas the P5020 has more modest goals. You almost make it sound like 2017 H/W ”having modest goals” in relation to 2005 level H/W is a good thing, when at the same time costing like an overpriced high-end, modern Mac?

The bit you quoted was meant to be a simple statement of fact.

Now that you've brought it up...

Quote:

The x5000 gets hammered by several Mac PPC computers that are so old compared to x5000 that literally the entire Commodore Amiga history (Amigas entire model evolution) could fit into the time gap in between them. it’s not stronger, it’s weaker.

"Hammered" is not how I'd describe the benchmark results.

Also, the X5000/40 achieves what it does with lower power consumption. The P5040's TDP is ~35W (at 2.4 GHz), whereas the total TDP for the two 2.5 GHz 970 CPUs in a PowerMac G5 Quad is in the 200W range (AFAICT, the data is hard to find). Like I said, they were pushing the limits of what was possible at the time, and high power consumption is one of the results.

Quote:

... Do whatever makes you happy. But the topic of the thread is whether x5000 is worth its price considering its limitations, and speed is one such limitation. ...

... which has been discussed for months now.

Hans

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@Hans

Quote:

he X5000/40 achieves what it does with lower power consumption.

sorry hans i will be much more happy if the power consumtion of X5000 was like a nuclear plant but with a performance like a 2018 computer ..and not the "low power consumtion" and with a rasperrypi perfromances... with the prize of 2018 super workstation

_________________
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MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
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@tlosm

Amiga OS has no use for super workstation performance for now.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@KimmoK

Quote:

Amiga OS has no use for super workstation performance for now.

is not a right excuse for pay a raspberrypi 100 time more than it real value

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

@tlosm

RasberryPI can poorly run AmigaOS4.

(My SAM with AOS4 speedwise wipes the floor with any Linux Installed HW on this planet and it delivers acceptable AOS4 experience. Better just not try to use timberwolf on it, eg firefox needs 4Ghz + 8GB RAM before it's "nice".)

x5000 or A1222 might be my next Amiga system. Far cheaper than my previous 68k Amiga, but more expensive than my SAM + a lot faster than my previous AOS systems.

+
I hope I manage to re-set-up some of my systems during holidays.
x64 FX4300 to a "HighSteam" Game server, Intel z3745 "LowSteam" Game server, Athlon64x2-3800+ for Linux, etc...
PPC SAM re-installed for AOS4, MosMini registered & in USE, MosBook updated...

(Steam content to be played via SteamLink)

+
I'll see if I get AmigaForever via SteamLink to living room.

Last edited by KimmoK on 22-Dec-2017 at 01:32 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 22-Dec-2017 at 01:30 PM.
Last edited by KimmoK on 22-Dec-2017 at 01:23 PM.

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@KimmoK

Quote:

RasberryPI can poorly run AmigaOS4.

yes because there is not amigaos for it ... i was present will run better than tabor and x5000/20 too

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

@tlosm

Cpu wise offcourse, because there is no slot for RadeonHD cards for which Hans develops great drivers for our Amiga’s.

My point: I read your last comments, there is not much joy in it, do you still like Amiga’s ? If you like PI’s, there are forums all around the internet for that machine ;)

So many pages about the question 'Is X5000 worth its price'... I must admit, I didn't read all of them as it too fast de-railed into comparison with rather irrelevant hardware.

To me, the question if buying Amiga hardware is worth its money can only be answered by answering the question 'how bad do I want it and do I have a budget for it'. Only by answering the questions with 'really bad' and 'no, but I'll get me one anyway' got me to buy an Amiga 600 a couple of months ago. Rationally it could be called probably the worst Amiga design ever but it simply hits big points on the 'cool-rating'.

I think with the X5000 it should be the same. You want it? Have the money? Get one. Don't compare it with the big platforms like Windows, Mac of Linux. We all know for those platforms faster and cheaper hardware is available. But does it run AmigaOS natively?

You might argue that the X5000 runs Linux and Linux runs on cheaper hardware. But then, current Apple hardware is nothing special but their customers are willing to pay the extra for having an Apple.

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Back home...

@Amiga_3k

Quote:

But then, current Apple hardware is nothing special but their customers are willing to pay the extra for having an Apple.

you and me may not see it this way, but they are paying extra for a whole out of the box system that is practically advantageous for them and their work. they usually dont care nor know about hardware details, they simply want it to work the way they are accustomed to. designers.. artists.. journalists.. i know perfectly well, most of them simply wouldnt get along with a regular pc.. i know, because im one of them. when something breaks they go to the service, as they do with their cars, they dont mess with it. buying some obscure system for the sake of it, like an amigaone, is completely different matter. i dont know why people are pulling these apple comparisons all the time. i can not think about any similarity that would justify such a comparison.

Last edited by wawa on 23-Dec-2017 at 07:42 PM.
Last edited by wawa on 23-Dec-2017 at 07:42 PM.

@wawa

I think we are pretty much on the same page here. What I wanted to point out is that the answer to the question if something is worth the money asked for it, can not always be answered by rational facts.

If, at the time of buying, you're convinced that the money you spend is well spend then it was definatly worth paying. I've owned Italian cars and drove them with big joy. But, if I wanted the best value for money I should have driven sensible Suzuki Altos or Nissan Micras. I still chose the Italian cars and accepted that something would go wrong or would not turn out to be practical.

It was not my intention to bash Apple. Or any other system.

Have a good christmas.

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Back home...

@tlosm

Quote:

tlosm wrote: @Hans Quote: he X5000/40 achieves what it does with lower power consumption. sorry hans i will be much more happy if the power consumtion of X5000 was like a nuclear plant but with a performance like a 2018 computer ..and not the "low power consumtion" and with a rasperrypi perfromances... with the prize of 2018 super workstation

No need to be sorry if that's your preference. I can't think of anything worse than that, personally.

Quote:

tlosm wrote: @KimmoK Quote: RasberryPI can poorly run AmigaOS4. yes because there is not amigaos for it ... i was present will run better than tabor and x5000/20 too

Dude, time to give it a rest.

If you're happy with your power hungry PowerMac G5 Quad, then great. If you really think a Raspberry Pi is better even though its graphics card shares memory with the CPU, then fine.

Either way, you've been trashing A-EON and the X5000 by whatever argument you can dream up for round 4 months now. It looks like a vendetta. Surely, you're better than this?

Hans

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@Amiga_3k

im not implying that you wanted to bash apple. i dont like them myself, therefore i mostly work with pc, but 90% of my "creative" circle are working with apple for very practical reasons, not just out of sentiment or hype. i dont want to derail the thread and go into very details, but i still consider it is completely different thing than some expensive hobby just for a joy of it.

merry christmas to yourself ;) even though im not a christian;>) so much..

Last edited by wawa on 23-Dec-2017 at 09:01 PM.

@Hans

Quote:

It looks like a vendetta.

he has been as strongly evangelizing the solution as he is opposing it now. its simply his personality feature, as it seems.

@wawa

@hans

Quote:

It looks like a vendetta

nope just wake up ... because the big punch gived to me in the stomach by the a-eon "friends" and after two years of waiting something that will never come ...improvements... because hardware truly cant improve nothing because is old compared nowadays standards

example? an amd athlon 2 x II 215 (ad 2009) is exactly 4 time faster for core compared x5000/40 .... and if you thing you can find this machine ( tha athlon) in the trashcan .... you understand everything

Last edited by tlosm on 23-Dec-2017 at 10:53 PM.
Last edited by tlosm on 23-Dec-2017 at 10:40 PM.
Last edited by tlosm on 23-Dec-2017 at 10:34 PM.

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

@tlosm

sorry Luigi but what are you thinking when buyed X5000/20(or also 40)?
Was normal like on X1000 that CPUs like PA6T or that e5500 was all but a modern and fast cpu...
From what you wake? You really tought that a similar G5 cpu or that e5500 without AltiVec can also maybe give us ssome modern performances?
Sorry but I never tought that...and that wasnt for sure a point of discussion...
PPC cpu was WEAK if you dont spend *LOT* of money no discussion about that...sorry.

_________________
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@Tuxedo

first at all was the worst way to do by the "friends" from a-eon ... idont explain eveything but belive me if there is something weird about.

second the powerpc is not good in performances if you made a machine with crappy cpu and crappy hw selection.... there are much more freescale cpu they took cheeper and on it they put more slot with bridges just for made people thing was a super mobo ... but in the fact the best was made this machine with only 3 slots.... dont forget this machine prize like a new macpro with the performances of the pi ... but with boost of a boing ball

altivec is relative if integer are strong... but the integer are not so strong compared an old 2005 g5.... and lower than a 2007 Pentium D

about the discussion .... i can speak because i had and i watch this machine inside and in every point ... my judgment is : crappy

Last edited by tlosm on 23-Dec-2017 at 10:56 PM.
Last edited by tlosm on 23-Dec-2017 at 10:49 PM.
Last edited by tlosm on 23-Dec-2017 at 10:47 PM.

_________________
I love Amiga and new hope by AmigaNG
A 500 + ; CDTV; CD32;
PowerMac G5 Quad 8GB,SSD,SSHD,7800gtx,Radeon R5 230 2GB;
MacBook Pro Retina I7 2.3ghz;
#nomorea-eoninmyhome

@Tuxedo

Always listen to the spaghetti man.

_________________
I'm an antique. Don't light my fuse

@tlosm

I suppose if you primary interest is running Linux you may have a point; however if your primary interest is running OS4.1, than there is no other relatively modern hardware available & OS4 runs nicely on the X5000s or the X1000 for that matter. I do have Debian installed on my X1000 & MUCH prefer OS4. For those of us that bought an X1000 or X5000 to run Amiga OS4 on this whole argument about poor performance under Linux is rather pointless & irrevalent. As to the value, the X1000 is more expensive than the X5000 & I don't regret for an instance having purchased one.

_________________
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AmigaOne X1000 & Amiga 4000

Amiga Response Crew Users Group
Indianapolis, IN USA

@tlosm

sorry but I still dunno how you can speak about bad performance regarding a cpu not so powerfull just on paper...e5500 core wasnt so good and I think that was out of any discussion...no way to get good(for 2018) performances from a mobo with that cpu imho...
The A-Eon complaining that you have was another (personal) story and I dont speak anything about that...
But I cant imagine how a mobo with an e5500 can be much better than how it was now...and I'm speaking of at least 3x faster dont 20/30%...so dont understand your complaining about the x5000 performances...also if was choosen a e6500 core cpu things cant improve so much also if better for sure...

I repeat no words about the A-Eon situation with you...was your personal situation.

_________________
Simone"Tuxedo"Monsignori, Perugia, ITALY.

@tlosm

Quote:

tlosm wrote: @wawa @hans Quote: It looks like a vendetta nope just wake up ...

Okay, you "woke up." We're now four months on, tlosm. Four months!

Hans

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