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      /  Hyperion restored to Belgium's company register
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PosterThread
jorit2 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 4-Aug-2018 19:34:01
#101 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 22-Apr-2011
Posts: 243
From: Unknown

@amigakit

Quote:

It was quite a shock to us ...


The Art of the Understatement ?

Evert

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pavlor 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 5-Aug-2018 8:21:58
#102 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9370
From: Unknown

@amigakit

You expected no other 4.x release in 10 years?

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Hypex 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 5-Aug-2018 13:54:31
#103 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 10612
From: Greensborough, Australia

@jorit2

Quote:
The Art of the Understatement ?


Sounds like a book title with a rhetoric.

Last edited by Hypex on 05-Aug-2018 at 01:55 PM.

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number6 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 5-Aug-2018 15:16:48
#104 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11428
From: In the village

@pavlor

Quote:
You expected no other 4.x release in 10 years?


That depends on what he's trying to communicate with this line:

Quote:
In return for this we were given an exclusive 10 year contract until 2021 to manufacture, distribute and resell 4.1 Classic. It was quite a shock to us and our customers when 4.1 Classic FE suddenly appeared out of the blue at the end of 2014.


Perhaps it was just meant to convey surprise and joy at a new release and had nothing to do with perceived distribution rights.

#6

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ne_one 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 5-Aug-2018 18:44:03
#105 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Jun-2005
Posts: 905
From: Unknown

@number6

Quote:

Perhaps it was just meant to convey surprise and joy at a new release and had nothing to do with perceived distribution rights.


I think that's the implication as well.

However, the fact that the effort was subsidized is a surprise to me.

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ne_one 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 5-Aug-2018 18:48:05
#106 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Jun-2005
Posts: 905
From: Unknown

@number6

Quote:

2017 filed July 31, 2018 and appearing today on the Central Balance Sheet of the National Bank of Belgium.


Yikes... I'm struggling to understand why Ben doesn't just divest of all of this and be done with it.

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number6 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 7-Aug-2018 17:38:05
#107 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11428
From: In the village

@thread

striking off removed

#6


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pavlor 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 7-Aug-2018 18:11:10
#108 ]
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Joined: 10-Jul-2005
Posts: 9370
From: Unknown

@number6

At last.

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number6 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 7-Aug-2018 19:08:22
#109 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11428
From: In the village

@pavlor

Topic changed. For lack of a better term I chose "restored" along with link to pertinent post.

Additions and corrections always welcome.

#6

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Hypex 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 8-Aug-2018 15:34:01
#110 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 10612
From: Greensborough, Australia

@number6

I knew some had changed. Good twist.

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number6 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 8-Aug-2018 22:19:56
#111 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11428
From: In the village

@thread

Additional news story on-topic now available courtesy AmigaNews:

english

german

$6

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bison 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 8-Aug-2018 23:22:12
#112 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 18-Dec-2007
Posts: 2088
From: N-Space

@number6

Quote:
Due to write-downs of about 36.000 Euros in every fiscal year, this property will be valued slightly above 1000 Euros at the end of 2018.

So the company is valued at less then one-half the purchase price of an AmigaOne X5000?

I must not be understanding this correctly.

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cgutjahr 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 8-Aug-2018 23:49:35
#113 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 956
From: Unknown

@bison

Quote:

So the company is valued at less then one-half the purchase price of an AmigaOne X5000?

Don't confuse accounting with the real world.

If a company buys something, the accountant will list the value of the purchase both under "assets" - since you just bought it and it has that exact value - and under "expanses" - since you had to hand out that amount of money to acquire it - in his reports for that year.

In the following years, his reports will still list the property under "assets" - but with a decreasing value every year: it's used now, grows older - hence its value decreases. This way, the accountant spreads the costs and (fiscal) benefits of acquiring the asset over many years. That's called a write-down, it does not necessarily relate to the actual resale value of the asset.

That said: we can make an educated guess what this asset is and how much it is worth. It's not worth the 600.000 euros Hyperion owes to other entities, IMHO - so the company is actually worth a lot less of half a X5000...

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Nonefornow 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 9-Aug-2018 0:42:37
#114 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-Jul-2013
Posts: 307
From: Greater Los Angeles Area

@cgutjahr

Quote:
If a company buys something, the accountant will list the value of the purchase both under "assets" - since you just bought it and it has that exact value - and under "expanses" - since you had to hand out that amount of money to acquire it - in his reports for that year.


Not quite. If the item bought is expected to have value for multiple years - like an intangible asset - its purchase would have no impact on the Total Assets. As it will be recorded as an increase in Intangible Assets and a decrease in Cash.

Quote:
In the following years, his reports will still list the property under "assets" - but with a decreasing value every year: it's used now, grows older - hence its value decreases. This way, the accountant spreads the costs and (fiscal) benefits of acquiring the asset over many years. That's called a write-down, it does not necessarily relate to the actual resale value of the asset.


Write-down maybe not the proper translation in this case. Amortization or depreciation is possibly a more accurate term. That would reduce the book value of the asset and result in depreciation expenses.
Write-down is more likely applicable to permanent impairments in value of the asset(s).


Quote:
That said: we can make an educated guess what this asset is and how much it is worth. It's not worth the 600.000 euros Hyperion owes to other entities, IMHO - so the company is actually worth a lot less of half a X5000...


Valuation of a company is a touchy subject and more so of a privately owned company that may not follow IFRS.
IMO - There is probably IP value in Hyperion that may not be presented or disclosed in the financials. Quantify that value is also possibly very subjective.

More than 600.000E? I have no idea.

Last edited by Nonefornow on 09-Aug-2018 at 12:45 AM.

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ne_one 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 9-Aug-2018 1:59:32
#115 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 13-Jun-2005
Posts: 905
From: Unknown

@Nonefornow

Quote:

IMO - There is probably IP value in Hyperion that may not be presented or disclosed in the financials. Quantify that value is also possibly very subjective.


It's also quite possible that Hyperion is sustaining this money pit because they think that indebtedness is but a minor blip on the path towards boundless reward.

In the end, I think Ben holds on to this simply because he can.

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Lou 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 9-Aug-2018 2:36:58
#116 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 2-Nov-2004
Posts: 4139
From: Rhode Island

I wonder what their sheet will look like when the lawyers' invoices show up for the current litigation...

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Nonefornow 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 9-Aug-2018 5:02:54
#117 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-Jul-2013
Posts: 307
From: Greater Los Angeles Area

@thread

I went to the Central balance sheet office website to see if there was a version in French of those financials. It would have been easier for me to understand.

But they are filed only in Flemish. Maybe I'll play with google translate.

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number6 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 9-Aug-2018 14:53:26
#118 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11428
From: In the village

@Lou

Quote:
I wonder what their sheet will look like when the lawyers' invoices show up for the current litigation..


I realize there is a lot to read in the trademark thread.
But I believe we should be aware of how the current consolidated cases differ from prior litigation between some of these parties...
Legal fees and damages are mentioned.

In addition, I can not discount that the cases were taken on a contingency basis in the U.S. where the cases reside.

#6

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Lou 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 9-Aug-2018 17:59:05
#119 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 2-Nov-2004
Posts: 4139
From: Rhode Island

@number6

Lawyers in the US bill at $200-$400 per hour...

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number6 
Re: Hyperion forcibly deleted from Belgium's company register
Posted on 9-Aug-2018 18:05:17
#120 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 11428
From: In the village

@Lou

not if case is taken on contingency they don't.

ok. I think we're confusing amount of payment with when and under what conditions payment is made.

#6

Last edited by number6 on 09-Aug-2018 at 06:13 PM.

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