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/  Forum Index
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      /  Atari betting us again
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PosterThread
Kronos 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 6:31:58
#21 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 2184
From: Unknown

@g01df1sh

Don’t see the Vampire connection.

NotC=USA did the same thing years ago and ir was a crap idea back than.

_________________
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OneTimer1 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 10:52:30
#22 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 498
From: Unknown

@Kronos

Quote:

Kronos wrote:

NotC=USA did the same thing years ago and ir was a crap idea back than.


Ack!

Todo :
1. Get some name and game licences
2. Get a cheap hardware.
3. Get an emulator
4. Design a a retro case
5. Collect preorders
6. Get the production started
7. Sell as much as you can.

The Atari VCS projects is currently at step 5, there are a lot of similarities with C=USA. I don't know if it is a good or a bad idea. C=USA sold some hardware, maybe they reached the break even point.

But it was nothing I would have been interested in. For me the C64DTV was a cool project, a 'THEC64 Mini' isn't.

Last edited by OneTimer1 on 20-Jun-2019 at 10:54 AM.

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Hypex 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 14:06:41
#23 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 9625
From: Greensborough, Australia

@g01df1sh

Atari is still around?

Unfortunately Amiga was never really a company like Atari. It was under the guise of Commodore when they bought it off the HiToro team. Would have been good if it broke free but it just broke.

Could Amiga users raise three million?

In any case I don't see the big deal. This is a reflection of the market. It's not really a new Atari console. It's just another custom PC in a custom box. Like a Mac. Or PS4.

And it is to run an emulator for classic Atari games. Three million to fund a custom emulated box? Meh.

This looks no different to the Commodore USA Amiga idea. Custom box. Custom Linux. Custom desktop. Except CUSA were aiming at a full computer system. The VCS is just a console.

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Srtest 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 14:07:02
#24 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Nov-2016
Posts: 234
From: Israel, Haderah

@ne_one

When did you ever contribute to that?

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Hypex 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 14:12:38
#25 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 9625
From: Greensborough, Australia

@hth313

Quote:
It depends a little bit what you are looking for, but the Vampire is nothing like this and will never be.


The Vampire re-implements the AGA chipset with some custom features added on top. It aims for more. So no, it's nothing like this, but this VCS is an emulator for retro stuff.

Quote:
The realistic choices are AROS and MorphOS.


Realistic how? AROS does and future MOS will run on x64?

AROS and MOS combined cannot touch on the power of Linux or Windows. Nor OSX.

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Srtest 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 14:43:08
#26 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 15-Nov-2016
Posts: 234
From: Israel, Haderah

@Hypex

"The Vampire re-implements the AGA chipset with some custom features added on top"

I don't think those who never bought anything but an A500 should get AGA. It was never about if it would be AGA or an emulation of the chipset. Nobody cares at this point. I as an A1 guy supported the vamp because it tries to package the qualities of the old school Amiga as a retro suite rather than a nostalgia project. This can also fit some very current implementations outside of the Amiga world (world? more like a small sphere) and maybe eventually be reintroduced as something you can just put inside a modern package (whatever that may be).

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wawa 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 16:53:43
#27 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Jan-2008
Posts: 6187
From: Unknown

@Hypex

Quote:
Realistic how? AROS does and future MOS will run on x64? AROS and MOS combined cannot touch on the power of Linux or Windows. Nor OSX.


cant tell for morphos abut aros does. inclusive proof of concept smp. and aros and morphos share some code, especially if it is (contractually) open, same as (it hopefully is, or should be) with os4.

Quote:
AROS and MOS combined cannot touch on the power of Linux or Windows. Nor OSX.


neither can os4 (even combined with both previous), so whats the point?

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hth313 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 17:15:50
#28 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-May-2018
Posts: 152
From: Delta, Canada

Quote:

Hypex wrote:

This looks no different to the Commodore USA Amiga idea. Custom box. Custom Linux. Custom desktop. Except CUSA were aiming at a full computer system. The VCS is just a console.


The VCS is not just a console. If you read the information behind you will see that they regard you as the owner of your hardware. They will not impose limitations on what you can do with it. They also support booting other operating systems on it and use it as a real computer.

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hth313 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 17:26:46
#29 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-May-2018
Posts: 152
From: Delta, Canada

Quote:

Hypex wrote:
@hth313


Quote:
The realistic choices are AROS and MorphOS.


Realistic how? AROS does and future MOS will run on x64?

AROS and MOS combined cannot touch on the power of Linux or Windows. Nor OSX.


Realistic in as being a way to build a decent low cost Amiga like system. You need x86 (or ARM) for this. Amiga OS does not run on either of those and are unlikely to ever be able to do that. This for two reasons, Amiga OS relies on a lot of low level assembly language and are in the hands of a company that is not able to do much progress and who does not want to even go this route.

Take a look at BSD and Linux. BSD is a genuine UNIX, Linux is a reimplementation. BSD ended up in the court about ownership issues with the UNIX trademark owner. Linux did not have this problem and grabbed a lead. The court case was eventually settled, but BSD has never been able to really catch up. Thus, having the genuine code with a certain heritage is not the most important thing, people just want something that works and that does not have issues.

I do even dream about the Amiga being able to touch the mainstream competition like Windows, macOS or Linux. That train left the station 20-25 years ago.

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bison 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 18:01:49
#30 ]
Super Member
Joined: 18-Dec-2007
Posts: 1441
From: N-Space

@hth313

Quote:
They also support booting other operating systems on it and use it as a real computer.

There's even an outside chance that AROS will run on the VCS natively, and a very good chance that it will run AROS hosted on Linux. That should please some people.

_________________
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Kronos 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 19:30:43
#31 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 2184
From: Unknown

@hth313

Quote:

They also support booting other operating systems on it and use it as a real computer.


Aka the same crap idea as NotC=USA.......

_________________
- We don't need good ideas, we haven't run out on bad ones yet
- blame Canada

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hth313 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 19:56:17
#32 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-May-2018
Posts: 152
From: Delta, Canada

Quote:

bison wrote:
There's even an outside chance that AROS will run on the VCS natively, and a very good chance that it will run AROS hosted on Linux. That should please some people.


I was thinking that too, but I did not dare saying it...

AROS running on this kind of hardware would be great, though having an Atari VCS box doing that feels so wrong.

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hth313 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 19:59:14
#33 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-May-2018
Posts: 152
From: Delta, Canada

@Kronos

Quote:

Kronos wrote:
@hth313

Quote:

They also support booting other operating systems on it and use it as a real computer.


Aka the same crap idea as NotC=USA.......


I am not sure it is a crap idea, but executing it and become successful is very hard given the stiff competition in that market from several big companies with deep pockets.

What is this NotC=USA thing btw, do you have any links to it?

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bison 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 20-Jun-2019 20:14:56
#34 ]
Super Member
Joined: 18-Dec-2007
Posts: 1441
From: N-Space

@hth313

Just put a boing ball over the Atari logo -- problem solved.

From my perspective the main advantage is that it would be a single hardware configuration to target. I run a lot of obscure Linux distros (Artix, Void, etc.), and what runs well on one system is a hot mess on another. AROS has the same problem, as one would expect given the size of the development team. I would much prefer the RPi as a reference system, but something like this would work too.

Last edited by bison on 20-Jun-2019 at 08:22 PM.

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hth313 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 21-Jun-2019 6:25:41
#35 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-May-2018
Posts: 152
From: Delta, Canada

@bison

Quote:

bison wrote:
@hth313

Just put a boing ball over the Atari logo -- problem solved.

From my perspective the main advantage is that it would be a single hardware configuration to target. I run a lot of obscure Linux distros (Artix, Void, etc.), and what runs well on one system is a hot mess on another. AROS has the same problem, as one would expect given the size of the development team. I would much prefer the RPi as a reference system, but something like this would work too.


I totally agree, a reference hardware system is very much needed. I do not want to try and pick up things and hope/pray they may work together, especially not on the second hand market.

This is one of the reasons I find this VCS somewhat interesting. However, the RPi is a much safer choice.

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tlosm 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 21-Jun-2019 7:43:06
#36 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 28-Jul-2012
Posts: 2654
From: Amiga land

guys i dont understand why there are ppl that compare the new vcs with a vampire ... second the amiga situation is totally different with atari.
Atari in ages change it skin from hardware (last machine jaguar) to game pubblisher.

The choice of make a new console is in this period a the worst choice ... because
Ps4 next year Ps5
Xbox One next year Xbox Scarlett.
Nintendo 2DS and 2DS XL
Nintendo Switch and next holidays probably nintendo switch mini (2ds will be no more made)
Google stradia in november 2019 (cloud gaming)
Many retro console remake and pandora hardware ....

_________________
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Kronos 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 21-Jun-2019 7:48:15
#37 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 2184
From: Unknown

@hth313
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commodore_USA

_________________
- We don't need good ideas, we haven't run out on bad ones yet
- blame Canada

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hth313 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 21-Jun-2019 17:17:58
#38 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 29-May-2018
Posts: 152
From: Delta, Canada

@Kronos

The end of the first paragraph on that page said a lot.. "The Amiga brand license was however disputed by Hyperion..." ouch, and the reference link goes to an article with lots of comments.

I have only been back for a year, but you guys must have chewed popcorn for at least a decade.

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number6 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 21-Jun-2019 18:24:41
#39 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 25-Mar-2005
Posts: 10738
From: In the village

@hth313

That wiki has more holes than swiss cheese.
Don't take it literally.

Fact:Hyperion disputed the use of AROS in conjunction with the branding
CUSA released Amiga branded h/w without it and Hyperion did not object in any way at that time.
In fact Ben publically posted here and thanked pavlor for stating the facts.

But yes, it was quite the drama for a few years...

#6

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OneTimer1 
Re: Atari betting us again
Posted on 21-Jun-2019 18:33:16
#40 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 3-Aug-2015
Posts: 498
From: Unknown

@Hypex

Quote:


The Vampire re-implements the AGA chipset ...
.



There are a lot of things that would reimplements the AGA chip-set and some like UAE or Minimig are cheaper and already available.

But if someone would design a 'Retro Amiga' for mass production, he would go the cheapest possible way and this would never use something expensive like a FPGA.

Last edited by OneTimer1 on 22-Jun-2019 at 09:08 PM.

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