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AmiDARK 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 8:50:20
#41 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Mar-2007
Posts: 485
From: South France

@jacadcaps
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=39792&forum=15&start=20&viewmode=flat&order=0#749622
In the "to do" list :)

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kas1e 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 9:17:49
#42 ]
Amiga Developer Team
Joined: 11-Jan-2004
Posts: 3425
From: Russia

@Daytona675x
Lovely thread. Enjoyed your logical, non-soft and smart answers.

And remember: "So for now, you'll have to do with that so now, 2 solutions are available to you" :)


As for link on forum where he shit me (if i remember right it was "my programming skills", (haha, now it twice funny) which i didn't have as i never was programmer, just some shit-easy-porting-work, and it was even say not to me directly, but to someone else), can't find, but it was on french amiga-ng.org forum. And before i even write some article to some amiga magazine about his engine, and also a bit promote his shit in hope that all will be done ok , but that was taken for granted and forgotten i assume.

And that not all ! :) Lately (half of year ago i think), i read on the same forum how he shit K-L , who help him pretty much with promote before. If i remember right he cry a lot softy like he have bad financical situation, and ppls make some "hey let's help him", and K-L was one who promote it (if i remember situation right), and in end, after all that was done, amidark just shit him like "who help me ? you ? shut up and delete my account".

In other words, all donors probably understand everything already.

@all_donators
i know some of you just donate because you want to support person who "do something for amigaos", and just will do it does not matter of what, but you also should know how he deal with ppls who help him before.

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Birbo 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 13:12:55
#43 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 5-Apr-2007
Posts: 543
From: Zurich, Switzerland

@Daytona675x


To be, or not to be a pitbull: that is the question:
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,

Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them? To die: to sleep;

No more; and by a sleep to say we end
The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks
That flesh is heir to, 'tis a consummation
Devoutly to be wish'd. To die, to sleep;

To sleep: perchance to dream: ay, there's the rub;
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause: there's the respect
That makes calamity of so long life;

For who would bear the whips and scorns of time,
The oppressor's wrong, the proud man's contumely,
The pangs of despised love, the law's delay,
The insolence of office and the spurns
That patient merit of the unworthy takes,
When he himself might his quietus make
With a bare bodkin? who would fardels bear,
To grunt and sweat under a weary life,
But that the dread of something after death,
The undiscover'd country from whose bourn
No traveller returns, puzzles the will
And makes us rather bear those ills we have
Than fly to others that we know not of?

Thus conscience does make cowards of us all;
And thus the native hue of resolution
Is sicklied o'er with the pale cast of thought,
And enterprises of great pith and moment
With this regard their currents turn awry,
And lose the name of action. - Soft you now!

The fair Amiga! Nymph, in thy orisons
Be all my sins remember'd.


Get it?

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Daytona675x 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 13:56:24
#44 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 5-Jan-2011
Posts: 491
From: Germany

@Birbo
Quote:
Get it?
Hm, maybe you like to (somewhat) quote Shakespeare to appear smart? Well, +1 for the lyrics neverthess.
Apart from that, I guess you're in the wrong theatre. To be, or not to be a pitbull? That is not the question here. It's more like: to be or not to be incompetent, narrow-minded, a snake-oil-salesman - and don't forget to adjust the cast / roles you probably had in mind.

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astrofra 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 14:24:16
#45 ]
Member
Joined: 15-Feb-2015
Posts: 13
From: Orleans | France

How on earth, could a string_to_lower() function of a (so-called) game engine lead to a memory overwrite if the string length is larger than 256 bytes?

How is it even possible to debate on this kind of issue, in 2015?

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Daytona675x 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 15:11:32
#46 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 5-Jan-2011
Posts: 491
From: Germany

@astrofra
Good questions Read those AmiDark threads (if you have enough time) and you should come to an answer (and if you really do so I'd be curious to hear your opinion on whether you find my tone adequate or not / more harsh than AmiDarks, thanks)

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astrofra 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 15:27:27
#47 ]
Member
Joined: 15-Feb-2015
Posts: 13
From: Orleans | France

@Daytona675x

When you started the review, as one of the donators and genuinely interested in the fate of Amidark Engine, I followed the thread.

Your tone wasn't particularly harsh in my opinion, especially in regards of the severity of the issues you raised.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 15:33:38
#48 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11384
From: Norway

@Daytona675x

Let me guess because it copies the string, and make low case version of it.
That is normal behavior for Basic, but it does not work in C, because there is no garbage collector.

The question is what type of programmer, wants to make a Basic language, in the first place? Someone who has lots of experience with C or someone who has lots of experience with Basic?

If he had written it in C++, and used classes, then he should managed to do it safely, if head implemented contracture and destroy methods for this string class.

On the other hand, from this point of view even strdup() is unsafe, however it can be used safely, if the coder knows what he is doing.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 20-Feb-2015 at 03:34 PM.

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astrofra 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 15:42:33
#49 ]
Member
Joined: 15-Feb-2015
Posts: 13
From: Orleans | France

@NutsAboutAmiga

"That is normal behavior for Basic, but it does not work in C"

No it wasn't.

The actual code (I read it before Amidark removed it from sourceforge), performed a byte to byte copy from the source string (length can be anything) to the destination string (lenght is fixed to 256), were the boundary check was based on the source's length.

So, calling that specific lower() function on a string of 2048 bytes (for example) was actually overwriting the memory by 2048-256 bytes.

This isn't the end of the world when it happens on a part-time project.
But claiming that it's not a bug but a feature inherited from DarkBasic is not the behavior I would have expected from the author, especially in the context of a bounty/review.

I hope the above to be clear enough :)

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Daytona675x 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 15:59:58
#50 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 5-Jan-2011
Posts: 491
From: Germany

@NutsAboutAmiga
Exactly what astrofra just wrote.

@astrofra
Quote:
Your tone wasn't particularly harsh in my opinion, especially in regards of the severity of the issues you raised.
Thanks for your opinion, especially considering that you're a donor.
Regarding the reviews only very few people don't agree with that it seems (Yssing and one or two others I think).

But I'd be more interested whether you found my tone outside the reviews too harsh compared too AmiDarks own tone towards me, since that is something I'm being acused by a handful of people here (like Birbo, Hans, etc.).

I ask you because you're new here and I suppose you're rather unbiased personally (at least compared to others here). And because it looks like coding is not unknown to you, so I'd give your opionion significant value (for instance I bet you'd not consider the word "bloat" when used to describe code as being offensive, like Birbo did because he apparently doesn't know the vocabulary ).

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 16:09:05
#51 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11384
From: Norway

@astrofra

Quote:
I hope the above to be clear enough :)

Never mind I misread your last post
I'm sure I read "memory leak".

Quote:
But claiming that it's not a bug but a feature inherited from DarkBasic is not the behavior I would have expected from the author

The limit was 256 bytes, so he should have truncated the string at 256 bytes, however I don't understand his obsession of coping shortcomings of DarkBasic, way not make it better.

And way not just use strndup() and strlwr(), no need to reinvent the wheel.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 20-Feb-2015 at 08:10 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 20-Feb-2015 at 04:09 PM.

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astrofra 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 16:15:26
#52 ]
Member
Joined: 15-Feb-2015
Posts: 13
From: Orleans | France

@NutsAboutAmiga
No problem :)

@Daytona675x
I don't think the word "bloat" is an offence when it qualifies a source code. It is rather a statement.
I can't share my opinion of "whose tone was harsh or not" outside of the technical details of the review, I need to re-read the thread first. Will do.

@Amidark
Sorry for discussing these matters here, I'm aware this was not the initial purpose of this thread.

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kamelito 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 16:18:25
#53 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 26-Jul-2004
Posts: 726
From: Unknown

IIRC Darkbasic has a poor reputation among Purebasic users.
Kamelito

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Birbo 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 16:59:35
#54 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 5-Apr-2007
Posts: 543
From: Zurich, Switzerland

@Daytona675x

Ok. You didn't get the first one.

Let's see the next one. Should be easy:

As I apparently do not know the vocabulary (thank you for that comment) - I'll tell you what you are:

A totally bloat type...


Get this one?

Last edited by Birbo on 20-Feb-2015 at 05:00 PM.

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Daytona675x 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 17:27:03
#55 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 5-Jan-2011
Posts: 491
From: Germany

@Birbo
Ah, that's the Birbo I know.
Quote:
thank you for that comment
No need to thank me, you earned you that one in one of your other pointless comments (bloat?).

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AmigaOS 4.1 FE (sam460ex Radeon 9200 / RadeonHD), MorphOS 3.8 (PowerMac G4 733MHz Radeon 9000), AROS (x86), A1200 (060 80MHz Indivision MK2), A500, A600, CDTV
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BSzili 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 17:46:37
#56 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 388
From: Unknown

@Birbo
And you are a bottleneck type!

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Birbo 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 17:57:04
#57 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 5-Apr-2007
Posts: 543
From: Zurich, Switzerland

@BSzili

Ha yes! That's exactly what I am.

How did you found out?

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BSzili 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 18:30:09
#58 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 388
From: Unknown

@Birbo

To be honest it was just a guess. It's always fun to "insult" each other with unrelated programming terms, so I had to chime in.

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Bugala 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 20-Feb-2015 18:31:52
#59 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2007
Posts: 613
From: Finland

@Future bounty code reviews

astrofra said:
Quote:
The actual code (I read it before Amidark removed it from sourceforge), performed a byte to byte copy from the source string (length can be anything) to the destination string (lenght is fixed to 256), were the boundary check was based on the source's length. So, calling that specific lower() function on a string of 2048 bytes (for example) was actually overwriting the memory by 2048-256 bytes.


I would like to point out that this was first time I feel like I am almost understanding the quality of the code reviewed (naturally, only this short part). So far I have mainly been guessing that something might perhaps mean something when reading for example Daytonas reviews.

I can see that if this command keeps happening once per cycle, it will eventually cause memory to run out on any machine. If it happens only now and then, then i guess it is not that much of a problem (as memory gone is so small amount). But is it usually being used frequently or not, that i wouldnt understand again, although comment of "not a serious problem" would suggest its not often continuously being repeated.


My point in saying this is not to complain to anyone of anything, but to hopefully give helpful tip on how to make code reviews like this in future, as the point was to review the code to those who donated to bounty, who might not have much programming experience in way that they can decide weteher bounty was filled or not. For although Daytona pointed this and that out, and said something is serious, something is not, I still couldnt truly evaluate the code quality, but my code quality evaluation had mostly been based upon wether i believe daytonas words or Amidarks words.

This is the first time I feel that I can truly make evaluation based upon what do i think about that specific code problem, that do i think it is serious or not, plus if that is something the coder should have been aware of and been able to fix it etc. (although that is somewhat guess again, as i truly dont understand the coding language being used, and hence cant really know that well)

Hence, when next time review like this is needed. It would be great if couple of examples like astrofra did would be included in the review, for the donators to be able to decide themselves, instead of having to decide wether they trust bounty placer or reviewer/s more.

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AmiDARK 
Re: AmiDARK Engine "bouncing" back.
Posted on 21-Feb-2015 0:17:20
#60 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 28-Mar-2007
Posts: 485
From: South France

The old man forgot that one day, he was young.
And when he blame the youngs for not having as knowledge than him, and believing that everyone should be like him... It's in fact his own wisdom that he put in the balance by not understanding that, acting this way, he is not so wise than it should appear... Making illegitimate his own experience of life by not accepting the legitimacy of the experience of life of the youngers ones

Good night poor dogs hungry on a piece of meat suspended on a wire too high for you, and which have nothing to do with you as you're only dissension, hunger and greed of having only your own voice on the area hiding the sounds of the others souls, and the ones of the reason and wisdom... Your voices that resonates on the horizon like an bottomless void, without meaning...

Last edited by AmiDARK on 21-Feb-2015 at 12:18 AM.
Last edited by AmiDARK on 21-Feb-2015 at 12:17 AM.

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