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      /  [POLL] Brand new FPGA-based PPC cards - when will they hit the market?
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Poll : When will brand new, FPGA-based PowerPC hardware hit the Amiga market?
Within the next year
In 2 - 3 years
In more than 3 years
 
PosterThread
clebin 
Re: [POLL] Brand new FPGA-based PPC cards - when will they hit the market?
Posted on 31-Aug-2021 19:33:00
#21 ]
Super Member
Joined: 2-Oct-2003
Posts: 1708
From: Unknown

For context, the Mac I owned 24 years ago is more powerful than this hypothetical future PowerPC core.

With this rate of progress, by 2030 we could see a next-gen Amiga almost as powerful as an A1200!

Last edited by clebin on 31-Aug-2021 at 07:33 PM.

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matthey 
Re: [POLL] Brand new FPGA-based PPC cards - when will they hit the market?
Posted on 1-Sep-2021 0:50:30
#22 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2007
Posts: 1145
From: Kansas

clebin Quote:

For context, the Mac I owned 24 years ago is more powerful than this hypothetical future PowerPC core.


The PowerPC 604(e) was one of the highest performance processors in the mid to late 1990s (perhaps the best performance/MHz for a short time). It was high end and expensive. It isn't easy for an affordable FPGA processor today to compete with the single core performance although a higher end FPGA could likely do it. The Vampire uses a low end FPGA and likely achieves performance between a 603 and 604. Modern faster memory and larger caches can make up for some of the core weakness. The Vampire could use a higher end FPGA to increase the clock frequency (50-100MHz?) with moderate additional cost and could upgrade to an FPGA with SerDes for a modest cost to add PCIe, SATA and maybe improved HDMI and ethernet support. Higher performance gfx through PCIe could raise overall system performance. It is probably possible for FPGA based hardware in the $500-$1000 U.S. range to have overall system performance comparable to a SAM 440 or CyberstormPPC 604e.

clebin Quote:

With this rate of progress, by 2030 we could see a next-gen Amiga almost as powerful as an A1200!


There are already multiple 68k FPGA cores with 68040 performance or better in affordable FPGA hardware. This is good enough for Amiga, AtariST, Sega Genesis, NeoGeo and X68000 simulation. The PPC consoles are generally too difficult and expensive to simulate like the late PS2, PS3, PPC XBox and Wii because of the advanced 3D hardware so there is less incentive to make PPC cores. PPC Amigas don't have enough numbers to be a blip on the radar and are quickly falling out of favor. Most of the people who liked PPC liked it because they were told it was "high tech" but it is now "old tech" without modern chips. The 68k is retro and people like it because it is friendly and has a small footprint which never falls out of favor. Even FPGA hardware with $10 FPGAs have better 68k performance than an Amiga 1200. The 68k is moving forward slowly while PPC is moving into obscurity.

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kolla 
Re: [POLL] Brand new FPGA-based PPC cards - when will they hit the market?
Posted on 1-Sep-2021 5:59:31
#23 ]
Super Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 1809
From: Trondheim, Norway

@matthey

Quote:

There are already multiple 68k FPGA cores with 68040 performance or better in affordable FPGA hardware.


And with "multiple" you mean "two"? :)

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matthey 
Re: [POLL] Brand new FPGA-based PPC cards - when will they hit the market?
Posted on 1-Sep-2021 7:41:23
#24 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2007
Posts: 1145
From: Kansas

kolla Quote:

And with "multiple" you mean "two"? :)


The core performance is a combination of the core design and FPGA hardware. The most advanced FPGA hardwares are the MiSTer and newer Vampires. There are several 68k cores with performance between a 68030 and 68040 on less advanced hardware which should be around 68040 performance in the MiSTer.

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BigD 
Re: [POLL] Brand new FPGA-based PPC cards - when will they hit the market?
Posted on 1-Sep-2021 9:32:15
#25 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 5910
From: UK

@matthey

Quote:
The PPC consoles are generally too difficult and expensive to simulate like the late PS2, PS3, PPC XBox and Wii because of the advanced 3D hardware so there is less incentive to make PPC cores.


Just to clarify the PS2 was MIPS based like the PS1 not PPC.

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matthey 
Re: [POLL] Brand new FPGA-based PPC cards - when will they hit the market?
Posted on 1-Sep-2021 15:22:20
#26 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Mar-2007
Posts: 1145
From: Kansas

BigD Quote:

Just to clarify the PS2 was MIPS based like the PS1 not PPC.


Yes but later PS2s had a PPC IO processor instead of a MIPS IO processor. The MIPS core in the Emotion Engine remained though.

Quote:

Replaced with PowerPC-based "Deckard" IOP with 4 MB SDRAM starting with SCPH-7500x.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlayStation_2_technical_specifications

Last edited by matthey on 01-Sep-2021 at 03:30 PM.

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clebin 
Re: [POLL] Brand new FPGA-based PPC cards - when will they hit the market?
Posted on 1-Sep-2021 22:02:12
#27 ]
Super Member
Joined: 2-Oct-2003
Posts: 1708
From: Unknown

@matthey

Quote:
Even FPGA hardware with $10 FPGAs have better 68k performance than an Amiga 1200. The 68k is moving forward slowly while PPC is moving into obscurity.


I was joking about "progress" in the PPC world, but maybe I should've used a /s tag...

Your second point is right - classic Amiga moves forward because it has history and status, it has retro cool, it's nostalgic, it has a great back catalogue and a strong homebrew community continually creating exciting new things. I'm not sure what OS4 on FPGA offers... Drop shadows?

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