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      /  AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
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HammerD 
AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 5-Sep-2021 20:44:11
#1 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Oct-2003
Posts: 913
From: Ontario, Canada

While browsing AmigaKit's website using IBrowse 2.5.5, which started when I clicked the link to their new db9 Amiga Mouse from this very website, I got multiple Javascript error messages that said:

"Your Browser Sucks! It's about time to upgrade, don't you think?"

Now, coming from this website (AmigaKit) I was surprised and upset to see this. My Browser (IBrowse) is up-to-date, in fact I purchased the IBrowse 2.5 when it came out and have the latest update installed.

Sure, AmigaKit's webstore/site doesn't work that well on IBrowse, but I can still browse products and look at them, and then later Purchase via my PC if I wanted to. We all know that.

So I would say to AmigaKit: Don't offend your customers who are using IBrowse! You are shooting yourself in the foot. Unforced error as they say.

Now I have nothing against AmigaKit. I've purchased many things from them over the last 10 years and never had an issue, and I will continue to buy stuff from them as needed. But AmigaKit, you should not display that message to Amiga users with IBrowse. May I suggest a message like:

"For full site functionality please use a different browser, your current browser does not support all functions", or something like that. We Amiga users know we are using IBrowse and it only fully works with some sites, obviously.

Last edited by HammerD on 06-Sep-2021 at 03:08 AM.
Last edited by HammerD on 05-Sep-2021 at 08:46 PM.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message
Posted on 5-Sep-2021 22:15:36
#2 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11871
From: Norway

@HammerD

Have you tried NetSurf? It might more up to date,

I expect IB to improve, one day it might be up to date, now its a bit too old.

lots of people upgraded Amiga systems, and it might be possible to use more advanced web browsers like WebKit/OWB. Many new web pages has SSL encryption, and CSS and lots of Javascript stuff, I think there security issue due, not everything is located on company web pages, assets are javascript libraries can sometimes come from other webpages.

Most modern web pages are not built from ground, but consists pre-created web pages costomized to different organizations.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 09-Sep-2021 at 11:02 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 05-Sep-2021 at 10:18 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 05-Sep-2021 at 10:17 PM.

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nbache 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message
Posted on 5-Sep-2021 22:33:16
#3 ]
Super Member
Joined: 8-Apr-2003
Posts: 1019
From: Copenhagen, Denmark

@HammerD

Quote:
"Your Browser Sucks! It's about time to upgrade, don't you think?"
...
So I would say to AmigaKit: Don't offend your customers who are using IBrowse!
Even worse: They are dissing all the hard work done by Oliver over the last years, saying that his work sucks. I (as a customer/user) find that even more offensive.

Best regards,

Niels

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amigakit 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message
Posted on 5-Sep-2021 22:47:26
#4 ]
Amiga Kit
Joined: 28-Jun-2004
Posts: 2416
From: www.amigakit.com

@HammerD

Sorry for that message. We were unaware of it. It seems to be a default message built into the third-party theme we use. The message will be hunted down and removed.

We are in the process of working on a new webstore which will be launched in coming months.

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HammerD 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message
Posted on 6-Sep-2021 3:07:31
#5 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 31-Oct-2003
Posts: 913
From: Ontario, Canada

@amigakit

Ahh ok! Thanks for the quick response! Nice to know it wasn't one of your employees that wrote it! :)

Cheers!

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BillE 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 6-Sep-2021 10:13:25
#6 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Nov-2003
Posts: 1184
From: Northern Scotland

@HammerD


"For full site functionality please use a different browser, your current browser does not support all functions"


Or even better why don't they just rewrite the website so it works on all browsers, like the good sites always did. There is far too much javascript these days. Using 3rd party templates based mainly for the PC market is NOT a good idea.

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Troels 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 6-Sep-2021 12:30:14
#7 ]
Super Member
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 1992
From: Unknown

Or even better offer us a browser for sale with an up to date feature list


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Hammer 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 8-Sep-2021 17:06:21
#8 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Mar-2003
Posts: 4270
From: Australia

@BillE

Modern websites target Google Chrome/Chromium clones (e.g. MS Edge January 2020), hence Android/ChromeOS and Windows with Chrome/Chromium.

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Ryzen 9 3900X, DDR4-3200 32 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 2080 Ti
Amiga 1200 (rev 1D1, KS 3.2, TF1260, 68060 @ 63 Mhz, 128 MB)
Amiga 500 (rev 6A, KS 3.2, 68K 50Mhz, 12 MB RAM)

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QuikSanz 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 8-Sep-2021 20:53:53
#9 ]
Super Member
Joined: 28-Mar-2003
Posts: 1166
From: Harbor Gateway, Gardena, Ca.

@Troels,

A more responsive build of 68k Netsurf would probably do the job well.

Chris

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paolone 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 9-Sep-2021 8:01:54
#10 ]
Super Member
Joined: 24-Sep-2007
Posts: 1096
From: Unknown

Quote:

BillE wrote:
@HammerD


"For full site functionality please use a different browser, your current browser does not support all functions"


Or even better why don't they just rewrite the website so it works on all browsers, like the good sites always did. There is far too much javascript these days. Using 3rd party templates based mainly for the PC market is NOT a good idea.


Funny. Amigans - who were accustomed to being ahead of the times - asking companies to stop progress because they can't catch with common, widespread standards even phones support.

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Hypex 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 9-Sep-2021 9:49:44
#11 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 6-May-2007
Posts: 10264
From: Greensborough, Australia

@HammerD

It reminds me of what OctaMED does when you run it twice and it calls you a "Twit!" Just not so much of a personal attack, when the sensible thing to do was to bring it to the front, not throw an insult. In this case the website attacks the browser, without even looking at where it came from or how old it was.

Last edited by Hypex on 09-Sep-2021 at 09:51 AM.

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amigang 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 9-Sep-2021 10:13:23
#12 ]
Super Member
Joined: 12-Jan-2005
Posts: 1651
From: Cheshire, England


Back in 2012 when I first got my X1000/Os4 I was very impresses with browser support, OWB and Timberwolf you could browse a good 90% of the internet with no issues.

I even thought maybe we dont need to port as much as we do with the rise of HTML5 apps, Google Docs(Office apps), Photopea(Photoshop), twistedwave(Audio Editor), htmleditor.in(Coding/Html editor), etc could all run in your browser. I tried to highlight this in my AmiPad app that you could have solutions and be creative with just a web browser.

Now I get it for a lot of people this is not a perfect solution and native apps are always best, but
I just thought it was a good quick solution for Amiga users who moaned about the lack of apps.

But as the years rolls on the lack of updates to the browser, that 90% soon dropped to what about 50%? Most of the above, no longer works in Amiga browsers, its a real shame and I get there are technical issues, lack of devs and such a quick moving industry to maintain a browser support on a small platform is going to be hard specially if we hoped to run what I would call the higher end of browser tech with Online Apps where companies like Google are not really thinking, hmmm will this run on Amiga browsers?

So what are the solution? Well to me four clear options
Option. 1 - We admit Amiga never going to be main stream, better to give up and focus on Amiga stuff and just use other computers/phones for the internet. (To me not a solution)

Option. 2 - Huge Funds raised not just once, but every year to pay for a dev to work on the issues every year to port over / work on a browser (We kind of tried this with Firefox port and Odyssey port to OS4 seem we need to raise lets say $10,000 each year likely for something like this, i think it unlikely the Amiga community can pull that off)

Option. 3 - Rabbit Hole, we host AmigaOS on top of Linux or another OS and access the host OS when we need the odd applications like a Modern Browser (I love Amikit XE! )

Option. 4 - Browservice - A web "proxy" server that enables browsing the modern web on historical browsers. It works by rendering the browser viewport into images, which are then shown by a JavaScript application running on the client browser - (Requires another computer but can be run by a Pi system)

To me only really option 3 or 4 really works unless we can find loads more devs or loads of money to invest.

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BillE 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 9-Sep-2021 10:42:19
#13 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Nov-2003
Posts: 1184
From: Northern Scotland

@paolone

> asking companies to stop progress because they can't catch with common, widespread standards even phones support.

I do not call breaking functionality progress ! It is the opposite, making things that once worked not work is NOT an improvement. Most updates today are actually downgrades. The sad fact is 99% of sites used to work, there is no real justification to change them in the first place.

Amazing how all these web template companies (are people too lazy or thick to write their own sites anymore) only test the very latest browsers, surely they know there are many others out there. I reaqlly do not see the fuss about supporting phones the way they seem to insist on. Tghe devices have screens far to small to be practically used for web browsing. I even have to use reading glasses on the 10" kindle so browsing on a phone is a non starter for many older people.

I remember in all the books I have read about good web design that it is important to test your code on ALL browsers and not just support a sub set. It seems bad practice has now become the norm. These were general HTML, CSS, JS guides and not Amiga specific.

Blocking entire platforms from browsing web pages is nothing more than browser duicrimination which in other areas would be recognised as a bad thing.

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BSzili 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 9-Sep-2021 12:10:55
#14 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 16-Nov-2013
Posts: 429
From: Unknown

@BillE

The internet has changed a lot in the last decade. Now your browser is primarily used to run web applications and not to display documents. I'm not saying this is a good thing, but this is the direction we are heading into.
Two companies (Google and Apple) have a duopoly in the browser "market", so most designers don't care about alternate or older browser engines. They only have to test against Chromium and WebKit. That being said when your website targets an audience with outdated or less capable browsers, you should take extra precaution

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TRIPOS 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 9-Sep-2021 22:50:51
#15 ]
Super Member
Joined: 4-Apr-2014
Posts: 1139
From: Unknown

Quote:
amigang wrote:

So what are the solution? Well to me four clear options
Option. 1 - We admit Amiga never going to be main stream, better to give up and focus on Amiga stuff and just use other computers/phones for the internet. (To me not a solution)

Option. 2 - Huge Funds raised not just once, but every year to pay for a dev to work on the issues every year to port over / work on a browser (We kind of tried this with Firefox port and Odyssey port to OS4 seem we need to raise lets say $10,000 each year likely for something like this, i think it unlikely the Amiga community can pull that off)

Option. 3 - Rabbit Hole, we host AmigaOS on top of Linux or another OS and access the host OS when we need the odd applications like a Modern Browser (I love Amikit XE! )

Option. 4 - Browservice - A web "proxy" server that enables browsing the modern web on historical browsers. It works by rendering the browser viewport into images, which are then shown by a JavaScript application running on the client browser - (Requires another computer but can be run by a Pi system)

To me only really option 3 or 4 really works unless we can find loads more devs or loads of money to invest.


Option. 5 - We finally start using MorphOS and get instant access to the Wayfarer web browser that delivers what we dream about above. As a bonus we get the written-from-scratch E-mail application Iris that has everything you expect of an e-mail program, like IMAP, html support and being verified/certified by Google. All this on a wide range of hardware to choose from, ranging from very small Mac Minis to powerful G5s, or even several laptop models.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 9-Sep-2021 23:02:56
#16 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11871
From: Norway

@TRIPOS

MorphOS is not compatible with 7Mhz, not true amiga, no chipsets.

OCS rocks !!!

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 09-Sep-2021 at 11:03 PM.

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nbache 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 9-Sep-2021 23:32:29
#17 ]
Super Member
Joined: 8-Apr-2003
Posts: 1019
From: Copenhagen, Denmark

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:
MorphOS is not compatible with 7Mhz, not true amiga, no chipsets.

OCS rocks !!!


Totally irrelevant to the thread, which is obviously about using a browser on an Amiga (Classic or NG). Note the important bit: Using a browser. Which browser do you suggest using on an OCS, 7MHz Amiga? Well, if any at all, maybe some ancient port of Lynx. And that wouldn't have any knowledge of even the most basic JavaScript, which is what showed the message in the original post.

Yeah, I know, this is AmigaWorld.net, famous for derailed threads, but ...

Best regards,

Niels

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QuikSanz 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 10-Sep-2021 1:25:03
#18 ]
Super Member
Joined: 28-Mar-2003
Posts: 1166
From: Harbor Gateway, Gardena, Ca.

@nbache

NG machines use DB9 mouse? Didn't know that.

Chris

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Rob 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 10-Sep-2021 15:47:58
#19 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Mar-2003
Posts: 6069
From: S.Wales

@TRIPOS

MorphOS isn't compatible with the X1000 so it's no good to him.

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NutsAboutAmiga 
Re: AmigaKit Website "Your Browser Sucks!" javascript message Update: Web Theme responsible, not AmigaKit!
Posted on 10-Sep-2021 18:15:32
#20 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 9-Jun-2004
Posts: 11871
From: Norway

@Rob
lets not over analyze this, it was comment on people using under powers computers to for things they were not designed for, it comments on people trying to convince someone to switch. Its comment on being stubborn.

I am naturally curious, I have tried MorphOS on Mac Mini G4, not going into that in detail here, its off topic. But suggest people who buy hardware for MorphOS check hardware specs and compatibility before buying. the same is true when buying graphics card for AmigaOS4 to not be unfair.

And I do appreciate work on web browser on MorphOS wherry impressive.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 11-Sep-2021 at 12:30 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 10-Sep-2021 at 06:29 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 10-Sep-2021 at 06:24 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 10-Sep-2021 at 06:20 PM.

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