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      /  How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
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Poll : How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
10p Excellent (Best at 2D/3D, colors, and resolution, frame rate etc.)
5p Good / better than most computer.
0p Barely hanging in there.
-5p Below average / slow but usable
-10p useless / horrible
 
PosterThread
agami 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 29-Jan-2023 22:59:01
#581 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1689
From: Melbourne, Australia

@Karlos

Quote:
Karlos wrote:
@agami

That really only took off once the PC didn't completely suck at it. Primary with VGA and beyond. There were some notable exceptions that were great even on older kit but the only dedicated PC gamers I recall from that era was post VGA/386.

Correct.
In 1993, still within our prime AGA time-frame, here in Australia the 486 DX2-66 was taking off in a big way. Many of my computing friends sold their A500 and A2000 setups to get into this.

One of my friends didn't even install Windows 3.x. He had some other GUI launchpad for gaming EXE and BAT files. None of the games I cared to play, mind you. Even when I first saw DOOM running on his rig in early 1994, I didn't care for the FPS.

To be honest, it was Warcraft that finally did it for me. The RTS genre were the keyboard + mouse games I cared to play, and the Amiga just wasn't getting any good ones: Yet Ironically I played the first Warcraft on an 040 Mac Quadra.
I got a Windows 95 PC in late 95. I loved C&C and spin-offs, a bunch of other RTS one-offs, and eventually StarCraft became my jam. StarCraft II rocks, and I wish Blizzard one day develop and release StarCraft III.
I only started to get in into FPS games when 3Dfx Voodoo cards came out and GLQuake was released.
LAN party, anyone?

Last edited by agami on 29-Jan-2023 at 11:05 PM.

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agami 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 29-Jan-2023 23:04:50
#582 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1689
From: Melbourne, Australia

@ppcamiga1

Quote:
Commodore bankrupt because AGA has not chunky pixel.

Trust me when I say that even if the A1200 was released with the AA+ chipset with chunky graphics, and the base machine included 2MB of fast RAM, Commodore would still have gone bankrupt. They may have filed several months later, but that company had so many problems that the bankruptcy was unavoidable.

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pixie 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 30-Jan-2023 1:26:13
#583 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 3182
From: Figueira da Foz - Portugal

@Karlos

Indeed it was a bit sad we didn't had fast ram as one of standard options. Perhaps you already know A1200+, it's a new Amiga board being made and they have a very cool concept, the CPU is on the expansion board only, which avoids ditching the one on the motherboard. Imagine having such a system back then...

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OlafS25 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 30-Jan-2023 10:41:54
#584 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6369
From: Unknown

@agami

I think that too... from that age only Apple survived (with help of Microsoft), all other companies disappeared from market. It would have been extremely difficult to survive against PC. Commodore accellerated the demise but even with better decisions it would have been difficult. One propblem was that Commodore never had a real strategy behind amiga and invested not enough in the platform. Amiga was (outside home computer market) only relevant in desktop video, a market too small.

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Karlos 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 30-Jan-2023 11:00:42
#585 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Aug-2003
Posts: 4430
From: As-sassin-aaate! As-sassin-aaate! Ooh! We forgot the ammunition!

@agami

As grim as it sounds, I agree. Nothing short of a complete miracle would've solved Commodore's problems by then.

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BigD 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 30-Jan-2023 11:32:11
#586 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 7333
From: UK

@Karlos

The concept of a home computer with PC bridgeboards for those that needed them COULD have continued. The iMac proved the public would buy something to connect to the Internet easily other than a PC if it was marketed right! C= could have beaten the iMac to the punch if they'd believed in the Amiga as a strong home computer contender!

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OlafS25 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 30-Jan-2023 12:59:41
#587 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6369
From: Unknown

@BigD

you in my view underestimate the aversions many amiga user had at that time. I only say "Intel outside". Would people bought amigas based on PC hardware? I do not know. The problem for me is I do not see the niche amiga professional covered. Apple covered the "creative people" and musicians. That was much more than amiga that was only used for desktop video. I think Commodore would have needed first to define what market it covers, what needs and where amiga is different to other platforms. And if you have a strategy you can design fitting products, not first create products and then try to find a market for it... The products might have been based on PC hardware of course but that would depend on the strategy and communication

Last edited by OlafS25 on 30-Jan-2023 at 01:02 PM.
Last edited by OlafS25 on 30-Jan-2023 at 01:01 PM.
Last edited by OlafS25 on 30-Jan-2023 at 01:00 PM.

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Karlos 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 30-Jan-2023 13:05:29
#588 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Aug-2003
Posts: 4430
From: As-sassin-aaate! As-sassin-aaate! Ooh! We forgot the ammunition!

@OlafS25

Anyone clinging to the whole intel outside thing should've been sectioned under the mental health act when the Athlon XP came out.

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BigD 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 30-Jan-2023 13:20:49
#589 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 7333
From: UK

@OlafS25

Cavin Harris and others used the Amiga to get a foot in the door of the music industry. C= could have promoted upgraded Amiga hardware in that sector as well as pushed into animation/3D rendering/VFX! It's almost like users and third party companies like Newtek and Quikpak new the strengths of the Amiga better than C=!

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OlafS25 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 30-Jan-2023 13:25:39
#590 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 12-May-2010
Posts: 6369
From: Unknown

@BigD

One man I know used Atari ST and then changed to Apple because of the MIDI interface and software available there. You certainly did not get millions of new users by that but there was a market.

Generally you would have needed a concept where to go with amiga. And that did not exist.

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IridiumFX 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 30-Jan-2023 15:49:52
#591 ]
Member
Joined: 7-Apr-2017
Posts: 80
From: London, UK

There was a market. proDAD, Scala, Mediapoint, Macrosystem, NewTek and anyone involved in video titling / DTV used to rely on the Amiga Chipset.
I lived in a smallish town back then and I remember when everyone involved in local tv channels used to gather at the PC Shops and the chat was all about amiga, exchanging info and hints on software and stuff.

AGA was a nice chipset in 1992, 1993 and even beyond. Just not a gaming chipset anymore.
If Matrox still survives to date, and they are mostly on 2D and video editing solutions, so could have the Amiga. Again, surviving is not the same as thriving.

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Bosanac 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 30-Jan-2023 20:56:21
#592 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 10-May-2022
Posts: 255
From: Unknown

@pixie

That would have made what I wished for at the time easier to create.

A1200 with EC020 and 2MB chip
A1200+ with full 020, 2MB chip/2MB Fast
A1300 with EC030
A1300+ with full 030
A1400 with EC040
A1400+ with full 040

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pixie 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 30-Jan-2023 21:49:23
#593 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2003
Posts: 3182
From: Figueira da Foz - Portugal

@Bosanac

From a marketing point of view it would be awesome and very clear cut!

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ppcamiga1 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 31-Jan-2023 16:14:59
#594 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 23-Aug-2015
Posts: 809
From: Unknown

Commodore bankrupt because AGA has not chunky pixel.
a1200 with chunky pixel, first page protection, and slot for fast RAM, will be good enough.
Commore will survive to hombre release.
nobody know if it will be succes or not.

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WolfToTheMoon 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 31-Jan-2023 18:02:06
#595 ]
Super Member
Joined: 2-Sep-2010
Posts: 1351
From: CRO

@agami

Quote:
Trust me when I say that even if the A1200 was released with the AA+ chipset with chunky graphics, and the base machine included 2MB of fast RAM, Commodore would still have gone bankrupt. They may have filed several months later, but that company had so many problems that the bankruptcy was unavoidable.


I think there was a way for the platform to survive. Mostly by avoiding direct competition with x86 PCs. That means targeting AIOs, PDAs, nettops, netbooks and like.... In the mid to late 90s Amiga OS would have been a credible OS/ecosystem on those devices. Competition would be things like Windows CE, Psion, Palm and such.

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agami 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 1-Feb-2023 2:14:09
#596 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1689
From: Melbourne, Australia

@ppcamiga1

Quote:
Commodore bankrupt because AGA has not chunky pixel.

Tell me you're clueless without telling me you're clueless.

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agami 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 1-Feb-2023 2:17:46
#597 ]
Super Member
Joined: 30-Jun-2008
Posts: 1689
From: Melbourne, Australia

@WolfToTheMoon

Quote:
I think there was a way for the platform to survive.

Of course there was. When we apply hindsight, there were likely multiple ways.
None that Commodore (management) were willing (capable) to execute at the time.

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Oscar12 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 1-Feb-2023 14:06:18
#598 ]
New Member
Joined: 18-Jan-2023
Posts: 7
From: Unknown

@agami

Amiga was designed by Jay Miners' team of engineers not by the Commodore. Commodore put little on the what the original great engineering team did. Around 1990s there was an interview with Jay Miner on the status of Amiga tech. He said Commodore/Amiga was already so behind the competition, it would be impossible to catch up. And in the end, this turned to be true in 4 years time Commodore collapsed

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terminills 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 1-Feb-2023 16:12:15
#599 ]
AROS Core Developer
Joined: 8-Mar-2003
Posts: 1473
From: Unknown

@KimmoK

DblNTSC and DblPAL modes were a joke though.

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kolla 
Re: How good or bad was the AGA chipset in 1992/1993.
Posted on 1-Feb-2023 23:15:40
#600 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 21-Aug-2003
Posts: 2975
From: Trondheim, Norway

@ppcamiga1

Quote:

ppcamiga1 wrote:
Commodore bankrupt because AGA has not chunky pixel.
a1200 with chunky pixel, first page protection, and slot for fast RAM, will be good enough.
Commore will survive to hombre release.
nobody know if it will be succes or not.


Atari Falcon 030+882+56k DSP had chunky pixel - it too died!

As did MANY other computers with chunky pixels, and even contemporary official Doom ports - THAT was not the problem.

Technologically, the Internet killed the Amiga. With the Internet came demands for all kinds of protections that AnigaOS has nothing to offer, so developers left for Linux, BSDs and even Windows. Microsoft had similar problems with Windows and solved it using NT, Apple eventually solved it by buying NeXT and moving to OSX. And then Internet tech moved way to fast for Amiga to keep up, lacking in IP stacks as well as client software, most notoriously - web browsers.

And now we have Doom ports that are buttersmooth on actual AGA chipset, as long as the CPU is fast enough, which kinda proves that lacking chunky wasn’t really the problem.

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