it is time to start yet another topic on switch to x86 or arm
previous attempts failde because some people here
for ex szulc or herr szonwejs or agami don't accept that amiga solution on x86 or arm
cannot be shit compared to win/lnx/osx
it is simple nobody sane will use amiga solution on win 98 level
when may use decent os on exact the some hardware

so what amiga solution on x86 or arm should be

it is easy it should be something like os x amiga gui and graphics on unix
amiga gui it is easy only one working standard mui

who should made it

of course people that want to switch

szulc, szonwejs, di mauro, agami, krono, karlos, hammer, abbot

so stop tralling start working

@ppcamiga1

Yeah let's get this party started!!

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Indigo 3D Lounge, my second home.
The Illusion of Choice | Am*ga

@ppcamiga1

Look in the mirror.

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Amiga 1200 (rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32/RPi CM4/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (rev 6A, ECS, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 4B/Emu68)
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB

@ppcamiga1

Please stop

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Sometimes we give people a lot of credit just because they're writing nice sentences even if it isn't adding up to much.

@ppcamiga1

Unlike Windows 98, AmigaOS 3.x camp has updated SSL (via the latest AmiSSL) support, a reasonable modern RDP 68K port (I have the registered version), and support for modern Pi WiFi (e.g. IEEE 802.11ac wireless).

The internet is worse on Windows 98.

Last edited by Hammer on 03-Jul-2024 at 03:25 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 03-Jul-2024 at 03:24 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 03-Jul-2024 at 03:19 PM.

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Amiga 1200 (rev 1D1, KS 3.2, PiStorm32/RPi CM4/Emu68)
Amiga 500 (rev 6A, ECS, KS 3.2, PiStorm/RPi 4B/Emu68)
Ryzen 9 7900X, DDR5-6000 64 GB RAM, GeForce RTX 4080 16 GB

@Hammer

Please do not feed the troll...

@ppcamiga1

FFS get some new material, will you? You're an utter embarrassment to trollkind.

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Doing stupid things for fun...

@michalsc

I am not saying you have to, but imagine if you actually done MUI reimplementation for AROS out of spite? I wonder what would happen next! xD

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Indigo 3D Lounge, my second home.
The Illusion of Choice | Am*ga

@pixie

Even if I would do whatever he says I "must", he would still hate me and my work. It is one of many of his obsessions

I think its already starting to happen, the move to ARM.

We got three great products that now take advantage of Arm now.

A500 Mini
A600GS
and
PiStorm

each offer a low cost solution to provide a basically top spec 68K Amiga experience. The A500 mini was only focus on Games. So Im glad A600GS has shown what can be done when you focus on Software.

I'm really interested in what and how the ARM Graphics Library is used in Amibench / A600GS to boost performance even more and take advantage of the newer graphics standard on ARM chip set. (it a shame in a way a partnership with Vampire team could'nt be made and emulate there more advance chips they made in there FPGA. Apps and Games made for its 68080 or SAGA chipset could run on A600GS / Pistorms / Pi systems. Just to create a bigger market and it might give devs more reason to write games or software that could take advantage of the bigger market it would make. )

I know many dont like the Emulation solution but two big problems is the cost of porting either Amigaos3.2 to Arm or AmigaOS4.1. then your basically starting Next Gen Amiga from scratch again and unfortunately we are slightly smaller market and fewer developers than when AmigaOS4 PPC started. Then there the legal mess still to be sorted. So I do feel how Amiga Kit are doing it is the best way now.

Plus if the new software and system can all work on Pistorm as well then your going to bring some classic users along to the market.

Then there the users solution being made like Amikit XE / Pimiga that again show how a low cost product like a Raspberry Pi can give you a top end Amiga. Plus I think things like Rabbit Hole allows you to run them obscure or main stream apps that you would need a huge team to port over, at the very least access to it with in the system.

I love the fact that on my Pi400 I can be in a Amiga environment and still have access to spotify, my Gmail account, youtube vids can play in the corner and even can work on my Wordpress website.

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AmigaNG, YouTube, LeaveReality Studio

@amigang

The second part of the question is more important, why and who would use Amiga now? and how are we going to get more people on the platform?.

I think play on our strengths, this kinda a proves that Amiga can still do cool stuff...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8vaccttxsg&ab_channel=Toohey%27sTech%26Gaming

2D 80s Pixel Art, its a style to it self now and the Amiga still has some of the best programs to make this kind of stuff.

Programming to get kids in to it, Amos, Hollywood, are great program to learn and can be impressive.

This is where I would focus efforts.

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AmigaNG, YouTube, LeaveReality Studio

@amigang
I'm sorry. I'm not so optimistic about a new virtual "Amiga Anywhere" 68k Amiga platform using emulation on ARM. Emulation is not competitive enough. Calvin Harris and Kanye West won't be trying out new emulated Amiga hardware. New affordable Amigas with real hardware and compatibility but using more modern features are required to attract users and developers. The amateur Amiga IP squatters should give up and hand the keys to the Amiga back to the owner as they clearly aren't serious about developing the Amiga.

@ppcamiga1

Quote:

ppcamiga1 wrote: it is time to start yet another topic on switch to x86 or arm previous attempts failde because some people here for ex szulc or herr szonwejs or agami don't accept that amiga solution on x86 or arm cannot be shit compared to win/lnx/osx it is simple nobody sane will use amiga solution on win 98 level when may use decent os on exact the some hardware so what amiga solution on x86 or arm should be it is easy it should be something like os x amiga gui and graphics on unix amiga gui it is easy only one working standard mui who should made it of course people that want to switch szulc, szonwejs, di mauro, agami, krono, karlos, hammer, abbot so stop tralling start working

Sorry, but I prefer to spend my very limited time to bash the PowerPCraps and that's only because you like them so much, to make your more crazy than you normally are.

BTW, I have to recall you that does NOT exists any UnderPoweredPC which can be called "Amiga": those are just PCs with the x86 CPU replaced with a "PowerPsCrew up" one.

@matthey

Quote:

Emulation is not competitive enough. Calvin Harris and Kanye West won't be trying out new emulated Amiga hardware.

I think you’re thinking too much as a hardware guy. That A1200 that Calvin Harris had was a restored Amiga, but I bet if it was powered by a pi in emulation inside that A1200 case, he likly wouldn’t have notice.

It interesting watching people talk about the A600GS at the show and the recent YouTube reviews, very little is on what the hardware is, they are more interested in the software and how good the software experience is.

Plus I would also argue the most successful products for the Amiga platform over the past few years have been emulation based. Amiga forever, amikit XE, pistorm, A500 mini etc.

Is it ideal, no, but I see it as way to provide low cost fun Amiga experiences.

Last edited by amigang on 03-Jul-2024 at 09:42 PM.

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AmigaNG, YouTube, LeaveReality Studio

@amigang

normal people do not care about hardware anymore. Most people use devices without even knowing what hardware or OS it uses. They just use something suited for certain tasks. And of course price matters

The example is A500 Mini

it offers nice design, functionality people and is affordable. Noone buys it because it is based on ARM (RPi). We today have countless products that include computers today, everywhere in a house hold. They are controlled by apps in WLAN. Nobody cares about hardware and OS there.

In my view priority has changed from hardware (like still in the 80s) to software and functionatly. If you want to get new user you must offer a solution that makes something easier to do.

Last edited by OlafS25 on 04-Jul-2024 at 03:19 PM.

@OlafS25

I don't care much with hardware, but say Pistorm... It can get the best of both worlds having a close to the metal emulation, where The500 mini not only Linux running beneath it, but it also have to emulate the chipsets. For me the matter is how smooth can the experience be, if you do a blind test and cannot distinguish what's the use of bringing the hardware, but if there's lag and jitter, doesn't matter how fast it is the rest of 99% of time it never feel whole.

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Indigo 3D Lounge, my second home.
The Illusion of Choice | Am*ga

@michalsc

Quote:

michalsc wrote: @pixie Even if I would do whatever he says I "must", he would still hate me and my work. It is one of many of his obsessions

He doesn't really, he loves it and that's the source of his inner conflict. He secretly has a PiStorm and loves it and the sheer original purity of AmigaOS 3.x/68k running on it.

Then he he remembers, berates himself and crysturbates while on a PPC machine for a while, but having lost the magic he gives up. Without even washing his hands, he jumps on a keyboard and smashes out the same dull, uninteresting troll material as a way to regain some belief that PPC is still relevant somehow.

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Doing stupid things for fun...

Pentium III like performance with 8 bit 4 voice stereo sound is only going to sell for retro use. The hardware is important and needs upgrading to be attractive to a wider audience even as a low end platform. Calvin Harris and Kanye West may be interested in SAGA with Amiga chipset compatibility and updated software to support it but are unlikely to be interested in a RPi accelerator with original chipset. Emulation adds jitter which is bad for audio applications and inferior to even a 68060 for what they would want. More performance would allow more software mixing of voices though.

@amigang

Quote:

We got three great products that now take advantage of Arm now.

Three? No, much much more.

MiSTer has ARM
ZZ9000 has ARM
Z3660 har ARM
RGB2HDMI had ARM
A314 has ARM
MiST and its clones have ARM for i/o
Minimig and its clones have (optinal) ARM extension for i/o
Not to mention all the ARM devices that can emulate Amiga… an A600GS is after all just an Orange Pi 3 with Amiberry, there are lots of ARM hardware that runs Amiberry and other UAE variants… I ran some UAE on my ARM based Zaurus SL-5500 more than 20 years ago, and I have Amiga emulator on the ARM based iPhone…

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B5D6A1D019D5D45BCC56F4782AC220D8B3E2A6CC

@matthey

I guess Pistorm could use AHI native drivers and lower the latency. It would be interesting to see if a draco like emulation where only the CPU is emulated bare metal like emu68 adds jitter and how much

_________________
Indigo 3D Lounge, my second home.
The Illusion of Choice | Am*ga