PPCNUX (sorry only avaible in Germant atm) has released an article about the OEM prices of the IBM 970 PPC CPUs.... at 1000 pieces.

Here the PPC MP970 with 2.5 GHz costs 335,11 USD - cheap!

The best thing is the comparison of the prices between the MP970, the Opteron 2xxx and the Xeon 51xx...

	MP970	Opteron 2xxx	Xeon 51xx
1.8 GHz (up to 70W TDP)	246,07 USD	316 USD	256 USD
2.0 GHz (up to 70W TDP)	285,60 USD	450 USD	316 USD
2.5/2.4/2.33 GHz	349,08 USD	698 USD	455 USD

So an cheap (below 1000 Euro) Amiga with an G5 CPU should not impossible...

PS: PPCNUX writes that an Freescale MPC7448 1,6 GHz is listed with 348,20 USD!!! Why those are so expensive against the MP970???

Edit: how can i remove the space between the text and the table in this post?

Last edited by cHaOs667 on 21-Aug-2006 at 02:03 PM.

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@cHaOs667

The problem is not the price tag, but finding the right support chips.

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@NutsAboutAmiga

I know but IBM has also released the documentation for the CPC945 Northbridge... so we should have everything we need (i hope so)

Edit: German PPCNUX Article for CPC945

Last edited by cHaOs667 on 21-Aug-2006 at 02:42 PM.

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@cHaOs667

wanna borrow a soldering iron

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@JurassicC

Quote:

wanna borrow a soldering iron

*lol* yeah! I've dreamed my whole life about an 3x4m Mainboard that costs thousands of Euros *lol*

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@cHaOs667

Hehey! That CPC945 FINALLY looks like something to base a future product on.

With one NB that supports a dual-core CPU, PCIe, DDR2 and HT, there's little need for all the cruft needed today to make a "modern" G5 system. I scetched an idea "back in the day" which you can see here:

http://oeh.network-electronics.com/970_mk2.png

As well as a suggested floorplan:
http://oeh.network-electronics.com/970_floorplan.jpg
http://oeh.network-electronics.com/970_floorplan.xcf

If you have gimp, you can enable the different layers in the xcf to see where I suggest routing the different signals. Note that I don't call this a design, I call it a scetch. Kinda analogous to what you would find on a wet napkin in your coat pocket after a heavy binge. But it was theoretically possible to make into a product.

The CPC945 would make all of that SO much easier. Off home to study the datasheet :)

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@cHaOs667

Quote:

PS: PPCNUX writes that an Freescale MPC7448 1,6 GHz is listed with 348,20 USD!!! Why those are so expensive against the MP970???

For you or me or anyone else in this forum it may look like comparing a Pentium 3 to a Pentium 4 at at the same price, that's not necessarily what they're thinking. These are both companies top-end PPC chips meant for different things. Look up the power ratings. The 970 simply cannot fit into some applications that G4s can due to heat issues, which for the "real" PPC markets can make G4 more desirable, and the top-end G4 price can be what these markets will bear for it.

Quote:

So an cheap (below 1000 Euro) Amiga with an G5 CPU should not impossible...

It'd probably be something like ACK's ATX board though, CPU, northbridge, and expansion slots for everything else. Your 1000euro today is about US$1300 for comarison to your US$ table. The low-end 970 chip is about 1/5 of that total. The top-end 970 chip is about 1/4 of that total. How much is the CPC945 northbridge chip? Probably not as much as the CPU, but probably over US$100. Together they are a good percentage of your US$1300, you haven't bought any other components yet, and you haven't paid anyone to design, prototype, test and debug a system, or give him any profit or give the dealers any profit, have not paid Hyperion's porting fee, and haven't paid Amiga Inc's unknown license fee, or included the "retail price" of OS4. Hopefully it could be done for your price, maybe a bit less, since even AmigaOne was cheaper than your total, but I'm not sure of prices for a lot of components on either. I know I tend to look toward lots of features and high performance which makes me assume high prices for things, so I may be unintentionally exaggerating things here. I've not actually looked into details of PCB manufacture and assembly, so maybe it's not as bad as I think for that after you've bought all the parts.

Last edited by billt on 21-Aug-2006 at 05:52 PM.

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I don't know what IBM is thinking, but has nobody noticed this little gem on page 2 of the datasheet:

Note: The IBM CPC945 Bridge and Memory Controller may not be used in personal computer products.


Seems to throw a small spanner in the works, eh?

@gregthecanuck

Good find. What the heck? I could only imagine that would be if they had some contract with Apple that for some reason would give exclusive "personal computer" use to Apple, but with them gone Intel even that doesn't make sense. Might "personal computer" be intended to refer to x86 PCs, not a more generic "sits on my desk at home or on my lap and I use it for personal email/finances/games/etc" kind of computer? I'm very curious as to why this was put there.

This note caries the same meaning as Amiga Inc's OS4 note that future versions of AmigaOS are not available for 3rd party development. It makes everyone scratch their heads and go WTF?!

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@cHaOs667
(in USD)
Dual-Core AMD Opteron 2210 (1.8Ghz), $255
Dual-Core AMD Opteron 2212 (2.0Ghz), $377
Dual-Core AMD Opteron 2216 (2.4Ghz), $698

Note that AMD's TDP is for max power** not IBM's typical.

ATI Express 3200 NB has 8Watts max power.

Reference
AMD CPU prices

**AMD’s TDP ratings refers to high end K8s (e.g. Opteron 2220 @2.8Ghz) in a particular K8 series. K8s with a lower clock speed consumes less than the AMD labelled TDP i.e. less electron pulse = less power usage. AMD sets a uniform TDP so the very motherboard can support the highest K8 series.

Last edited by Hammer on 22-Aug-2006 at 09:07 AM.
Last edited by Hammer on 21-Aug-2006 at 10:48 PM.
Last edited by Hammer on 21-Aug-2006 at 10:47 PM.

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@billt

This must be a left over from the Apple contract. Why exclude a market?
I would guess any sales of G5 products would be welcome after Apple left PPC.

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@Hammer

Sorry, i've copied only the data of PPCNUX into my thread without checking the prices back.

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@cHaOs667

The prices are correct, but since the Opterons have an integrated Northbridge
they get the benefit of doubt and are being compared in standard versions now.

See the following article updates in English now:

PPC 970MP and CPC945 info
PPC 970MP (FX/GX) prices

@nickname

According to http://www.amd.com/us-en/Corporate/VirtualPressRoom/0,,51_104_609,00.html

AMD Opteron 2210(1.8Ghz), $209
AMD Opteron 2212(2.0Ghz), $255
AMD Opteron 2216(2.4Ghz), $450

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@cHaOs667

OSW is exactly that.

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@cHaOs667

I would just like to point out that this 335,11 USD price was for 5000 pieces, not for 1000.

I'd take the Opterons over the PPC970.

The Opterons will get enhanced while the PPC970 is a CPU with no future. The PPC980 is a made up lie.

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@ronaldst

Quote:

ronaldst wrote: I'd take the Opterons over the PPC970. The Opterons will get enhanced while the PPC970 is a CPU with no future. The PPC980 is a made up lie.

So you don't think PA Semi will have anything to offer? PA Semi is very active and will be attending some very important events this month. http://www.pasemi.com/news/events.html

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@ronaldst

Quote:

The Opterons will get enhanced while the PPC970 is a CPU with no future. The PPC980 is a made up lie.

Refer to POWER7 on AMD Opteron (or Athlon 64 FX 4X4**) socket and IBM's support for UEFI (firmware).

There’s very little need for PPC980, if the Operton platform gains POWER7 (with integrated Northbridge and memory controllers).

**Just a 2-way Opteron socket with unregistered memory.

Last edited by Hammer on 04-Nov-2006 at 09:32 PM.

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@Darth_X

No

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