@Severin

It is not a patch or hack. It is a commodity and everything is done in OS legal way.

_________________
Amiga Developer
Amiga 500, Efika, Mac Mini and PowerBook

@Severin
Sorry, misunderstanding then, no big deal.

@thread

Check the
New Intuition Video , which also includes screen dragging as well!



Nice, looks like those who wanted it can have it now (amigazeus' commodity) or 'soon' (next update or os4 final). Very cool.

Wondering where Atheist is right about now....

Last edited by wegster on 21-Aug-2005 at 09:42 PM.

_________________
Are we not done with the same silly arguments and flames yet??!

@wegster
FWIW, we (a few of us on IRC) have seen some problems in attempting to use Dragon. Was able to get it to GR once, but unable to capture that log, as generally am seeing tons (hundreds/more) of:
[_impl_Permit] *** Warning: Permit without Forbid
over serial once I grab the workbench task bar and attempt to drag.

If doing without enabling debug mode, can lock the system hard if the default refresh rate (Dragon prefs, double click on icon once it's running already) is set to automatic or anything over a low number (like 5/second).

To try to reproduce:
1. Load Dragon
2. Launch someone in it's own screen, I use DiskMaster 2 at same res as workbench screen.
3. Hold down ALT and grab workbench titlebar and drag around for a few seconds.
4. Hard system lockup.

Could be a commodity or other issue, just curious if others are seeing the same behavior?

System:
Fixed A1XE-G4-933
memtester checked 512MB RAM (single stick)
Radeon 7000 64MB AGP.

_________________
Are we not done with the same silly arguments and flames yet??!

@wegster

Quote:

4. Hard system lockup

Same here. Well, don't use it too much, since I have real screen drag now :)
Dragon scrolls the screen back ASAP you release the mouse button. So,not real dragging anyway (OS4 works like the old way, means, position remains, you can drag as many screens as you want and can move the mouse from one screen to the other, and the screen moves back up if you move the mouse to the bottom edge. On same color depths only, though).
However, draging left and right is nice (I don't know why one would use it..but then we can discuss the sence of screen dragging in general).

Last edited by Jorge on 22-Aug-2005 at 05:37 AM.

_________________
AmigaOne XE G3/933/VIA/FM801/R200 (fixed),
G3SE/600/Voodoo3/Sil680/RTL8139/SBLive! (noiseless!)
µA1-MK2/G3/933/R200/CMI8738
XE/G4 (broken 7450/800)

@Jorge
Well, so far now 3 of us have confirmed the same issue. It could certainly be an issue with OS4 itself, but at least appears to be an issue in Dragon. I haven't tried yet with WBStartup empty and disabling startup files, and only tried Dragon after someone reported a problem in IRC...so, just mostly passing the info along, as it's possible my system is 'special' in some way, causing the problem..

The AmigaGuide for Dragon is hysterical though (Seriously...everyone really should read it, funny as hell!) It also points out it's limitations and issues for anyone that cares..

PS- damned beta testers, you get all the toys (quote about you have 'real' screen dragging now)

_________________
Are we not done with the same silly arguments and flames yet??!

@wegster

Someone with access to OS4 core should create a stack dump to see is Permit() called from OS4 component or Dragon. Dragon keeps track of Forbid()s and it is unlikely it would call Permit() without Forbid() but stack trace could reveal something.

_________________
Amiga Developer
Amiga 500, Efika, Mac Mini and PowerBook

@all

is Dragon the same commodity as seen in the video AOS4 (latest developper version)? Or does AOS4 have it's own screen dragging (DragScreens)

_________________
A computerworld without MS products and Windows!
Connect your Amigas ...
...The Red ONE-A1XE G4 - A3000T- A3000 - A4000 - A2500- A1000 - A600 - CDTV - CD32...
and your PDAs and laptops ...
Psion 5mx Pro - Psion NetBook - Apple iPhone - MacBook Pro

@itix
Yeah, would be nice..
Does anyone with MOS or classic/3.X have any lockups known or? (or to anyone that's tried..not just directed at itix..)

@mbilla
Different beasts. DragOn is available for classics, MOS and OS4, but is a 68k binary. It allows N/any-directional screen dragging, but no data exchange (ie, drag and drop, copy/paste) between screens. You can't drag a screen part-way, leave it in that position, and dar an object from the front screen to the back screen for example. It seems to basically give you a 'window' (sorry for the term) or a view into the other screen(s), but you can't interact with those screens directly.

What seems to be shown in the beta includes 'full' support, ie drag partially and leave in position, drag and drop between screens, etc...which is pretty damned cool.

_________________
Are we not done with the same silly arguments and flames yet??!

@mbilla

There are 2 "Dragons", mine and AmigaZeux's. Mine is a hack, AmigaZeux's is a commodity.

What you saw on the video is AmigaOS-integrated implementation and it works like "real" dragging on the classics.

@itix

This is with v1.1 of Dragon.

68k register dump
DATA: 00000000 11EC35AC 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 01DE70C4
ADDR: 11AB2EB0 01C63DA2 00000000 00000000 11F422AC 017BBCF0 01674C1A 017BBCEC
----> 01C63DA2 - "LIBS:commodities.library" Hunk 0002 Offset 000006A2 (SegList:)
----> 01674C1A - "Kickstart/kernel.debug.bz2" Hunk 0001 Offset 00074C16
STCK: 11F03EA4 017BBD08 11F036B6 00000000 00000000 00000000 01DE70C4 017BBD18
STCK: 11F032C6 01DE70C4 00000000 00000000 01CA647E 01CA64CC 01DE6FDC 00000000
STCK: 017BBD62 017BBE20 01248248 00000000 00000001 017BBD74 00000000 10064138
STCK: 11EC35AC 017BBD60 013E08B4 10064138 4EB901C6 3D984EF8 00000001 012482E4
STCK: 02013C03 00010000 017BBD5C 0001013C 00000000 00000000 11AB2EDC 11AB2EB0
STCK: 00000000 01810000 00000000 00000004 017C84C8 017BBDB0 01372EF8 40000000
STCK: 017C84C8 017BBDC0 013B8E5C 40000000 017C84C8 017BBE30 01396410 00000004
STCK: 017C84C8 017BBE00 01372EF8 11EC05B4 00000000 017BBDFC 28008088 00000000
PC-8: 0163C522 4EF90163 C50A4EF9 0163C506 4EF90163 C5024EF9 0163C4F2 4EF90163
PC *: C4E001AE C854017B FD3C099C 0160ABD0 0401038A 02EE0033 001E0160 ABE00000
68k IP (r21) "Kickstart/kernel.debug.bz2" Hunk 0001 Offset 00074C14
68k IP ( r8) "Kickstart/kernel.debug.bz2" Hunk 0001 Offset 00073BEC
----> 11F03EA4 - "ram:Dragon/Dragon" Hunk 0000 Offset 00002E6C (SegList: 0x047C)
----> 11F036B6 - "ram:Dragon/Dragon" Hunk 0000 Offset 0000267E (SegList: 0x047C)
----> 11F032C6 - "ram:Dragon/Dragon" Hunk 0000 Offset 0000228E (SegList: 0x047C)
----> 01248248 - "Kickstart/kernel.debug.bz2" Hunk 0000 Offset 00048244
----> 013E08B4 - "Kickstart/layers.library.kmod" Hunk 0000 Offset 000023F0
----> 01C63D98 - "LIBS:commodities.library" Hunk 0002 Offset 00000698 (SegList:)
----> 012482E4 - "Kickstart/kernel.debug.bz2" Hunk 0000 Offset 000482E0
----> 013C0000 - "Kickstart/intuition.library.kmod" Hunk 0000 Offset 0006A1FC
----> 01372EF8 - "Kickstart/intuition.library.kmod" Hunk 0000 Offset 0001D0F4
----> 013B8E5C - "Kickstart/intuition.library.kmod" Hunk 0000 Offset 00063058
----> 01396410 - "Kickstart/intuition.library.kmod" Hunk 0000 Offset 0004060C
----> 01372EF8 - "Kickstart/intuition.library.kmod" Hunk 0000 Offset 0001D0F4

Left out the PPC stacktrace because it only points to Permit().

_________________
Stephan Rupprecht - AmigaOS4 developer

I get lockups too, with Dragon on OS4. But they are not hard lockups, only Dragon itself seems to hang after I have dragged a screen a few times, and it takes WB with it (no more icon refresh etc). AmigaAmp, LimpidClock, AmIRC (all on the WB screen) kept on running.

Seems like some kind of semaphore lock or something, not Forbid() (unless it works differently in OS4)..???

A1-XE/G4 Radeon7000
Default settings in Dragon.

_________________
- Don't get fooled by my avatar, I'm not like that (anymore, mostly... maybe only sometimes)
> Amiga Classic and OS4 developer for OnyxSoft.

@all

I wont not worry so much about dragon (not) working now that support this natively i OS4.

dragon is interesting commoditie even so.

_________________
http://lifeofliveforit.blogspot.no/
Facebook::LiveForIt Software for AmigaOS

@NutsAboutAmiga

Well, it doesn't really matter, debugging something is always good. It could even uncover a bug in the OS side of matters.

_________________

@MichaelMerkel

This is pretty cool actually.

Dragging screens in all directions is quite a clever trick too. Of course, we've seen a native OS4 intuition doing this now too but this is certainly a welcome commodity for user that are currently missing the feature.

The age of screen dragging returns

FuZion.

Quote:

wegster wrote: Wondering where Atheist is right about now....

Hi wegster,


Oh just COMPLETE MADNESS has set in!!!!!



* A4000!!!!








The F U N in is > . < close to returning onto the WORLD SCENE!!!!

Will anyone notice?



This is truely blockbuster stuff!!!!!!!!


Now, a microAmigaOne in an Amiga Phantasy case would just be the bee's knees!!!!!

Talk about NOSTALGIA! We wouldn't be able to make them FAST ENOUGH!!!! (Pun intended, ouch! )


NOW, the difference between the old and the new is almost non-existent!!!!!!!! (Like, just where would that fine line be?? Even an electron microscope would have a hard time finding it.....well other than the calendar years between the two machices and OS's.)



Amiga! AOS! Just like rock bands from the '60s, IT NEVER GOES AWAY!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!



P.S. This is ONE of about TWELVE major things that just BLEW ME AWAY when I was first shown a demonstration of AOS in 1987(8?)!!!!!!!!

It made ms-dos just look like a pathetic joke. And look at how many programmers it took to make it (ms-dos), too.

(....and, AOS STILL HAS plenty of unfulfilled potential!)



P.P.C. Look at Comment 119 in the news post New Os4 video, new features, too.

(Bet a nuclear war breaks out JUST AS AOS4.0 final gets loaded into and fully configured just as I like it on my AmigaOne. For the sake of Humanity, I won't fully configure it! )



P.P.P.S. "Wondering where Atheist is right about now.... " -- wegster

Well, let tell you about this place called Norrath........

(EQ2, that is.)

@Thread

Just noticed an interesting thing; when dragging down my Aweb screen to reveal workbench,
I can see the links appearing in Aweb`s status bar, the links which the mouse WOULD pass over
if the screen was centered. If you know what I mean
It gives an insight into how it works for a non-coder like me.

edit: clarity

Last edited by Frags on 23-Aug-2005 at 11:28 PM.

_________________
Fraggle

- insert profound text here -

@T_Bone

Quote:

T_Bone wrote: @Severin Quote: Severin wrote: @victim No, if you don't like the word 'hack' try 'fake' as it's not true screen dragging, only a 'fake' made to look like screen dragging. A pixel's a pixel, who cares how it got there.

Yes...if speedy slight-of-hand increases productivity, or brings
back fond memories, and wayward amigans, let the trickery
prevail. Imagine how fast it would be on---

---wait! slap! slaappp! SLAPPP! Don't even go there,
naughty glokraw! Don't EEEven go there!

8')

@Jorge

snip

However, draging left and right is nice (I don't know why one would use it..but then we can discuss the sence of screen dragging in general).[/quote]

@ all
Anyone using a T.V. card (Mediator users!) can now surf, work, or
be otherwise productive while listening to sports, or news in rear screen, then
quickly drag front screen when something exciting or interesting
takes place, and watch the telly for a bit! Great for those wonderful 1 to nothing
futball, and baseball games...in the old daze, you could have had Aminet
in the back screen, and monitored all the new uploads...oh, for the old daze...

...but stay tuned. the future is on, next!!!

But really... Screen dragging in all directions? What makes those "screens" any diffrent from regular windows that just disquise themselfs as "screens"? I only want vertical screen dragging, everything else would just feel like dragging around a fake-screen that actually is nothing else than a window (even if it was'nt)...

_________________
I have an Micro AmigaOne MIST, Turbo Chameleon 64 and 1541 Ultimate II

@Maria

Well DragOn is no "real" drag screen function really..
It's more of a "see what's under you screen with realtime update"

* You can't stop dragging a screen half way and leave it there
* You can't interact with another screen
* It's not a feature of the OS. Rather a WB util which utilizes some
nifty graphical functions to do its stuff.

This is no trolling! It's just facts as I see them..

Btw with "real" I mean integrated into the OS and/or hardware.
The way DragOn works have been talked about since I started visiting
this site in 2003 atleast.

_________________
/Harry

[SOLD] µA1-C - 750GX 800MHz - 512MB - Antec Aria case

Avatar by HNL_DK!