What do you think?

Various analysts and experts are predicting exact opposites regarding the future of Sony's new Playstation 3. I will try to explain why I think the PS3 will be hot for christmas 2007.

The current price and the major differences offered by both systems, it's hard to predict what the prices will be next year though.

THE HARDWARE

Taking out of account "8 core Cell CPU, RSX 'GPU, 256 MB XDR DRAM @ 3.2 GHz, 256 MB GDDR3 @ 700 MHz" vs "3 core Xenon CPU, Xenos GPU, 512 MB unified GDDR3 RAM @ 700 megahertz" wars...

XBox 360 Core system

$299.99

+ DVD support
+ Nice looking system interface
- but no HD-DVD support by default
- no digital-outputs such as DVI or HDMI (no TrueHD or DTS HD Master sound)
- Wired 3 m breakaway cord Gamepad
- No Harddrive


PS3 Core system

$499

+ 20 GB hard drive (easily upgradeable with 2.5 inch SATA harddrives)
+ Blu-ray drive (plays DVDs and plays high definition Blu-ray movies and games up to 1080P. Standalone players are currently more expensive and in some cases offer worse picture quality.
+ HDMI port (digital output is essential if you want to enjoy to the fullest the quality of high definition graphics and movies on HDTVs).
+ Very silent
+ Free online gaming
+ 7 simultaneous controllers over Bluetooth


XBox 360 Premium

$399.99

+ 20GB hardrive
+ Xbox Live headset / Xbox Media Remote or in Oceania an Universal Media Remote, but no headset.


PS3 Premium

$599

+ 60 GB upgradeble Harddrive
+ Built-in Wi-Fi
+ Flash card reader

- $25 dedicated remote has to be bought seperately.
http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/top/here-it-is-the-ps3-remote-204792.php


HD-DVD XBox 360 drive

$199 (with XBox 360 combined, costs ~$500 / no HD -$600 / 20 GB HD.

+ Upscales DVD movies

- Extra power supply necessary
http://www.blogsmithmedia.com/www.engadget.com/media/2006/11/xbox_hd_dvd24.jpg
- As a dedicated HD DVD player consists of 4 components. XBox 360 unit + large transformator + external HD DVD unit + small adaptor
- Will not suit the look of most Video / Audio sets. Messy with so many cables.

Blu-Ray vs HD DVD

+ A Blu-Ray disk fits more data for games and movies for high definition sound and video, that's the main difference. (50 GB vs 30 GB)
+ Experts predict Blu-ray will become the new standard due to its higher number of manufacturing and content partners.

Overall conclusion: Albeit the PS3 hardware is more expensive at a basic configuration, it's actually much cheaper considering its feature set. The HD DVD solution currently offered by Microsoft is more noisy and messy (many cables and components do deal with). Nomatter which format wins the extra storage space offered by Blu Ray disk will be beneficial for games and movies.

Last edited by Yo on 29-Dec-2006 at 10:45 AM.
Last edited by MikeB on 13-Dec-2006 at 11:52 AM.
Last edited by MikeB on 08-Dec-2006 at 07:21 PM.
Last edited by MikeB on 08-Dec-2006 at 06:58 PM.
Last edited by MikeB on 08-Dec-2006 at 06:57 PM.
Last edited by MikeB on 08-Dec-2006 at 06:13 PM.

@MikeB

Humbug.
Got myself a Wii. Maybe not the best hardware and visuals, at least it's fun
Boxing and tennis is fun now and not boring..
And only 250 euro, not to bad.


BTW, is the PS3 available enough the whole season ? Or just a few million units worldwide ?

Last edited by Seer on 08-Dec-2006 at 06:02 PM.

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Everything you say will be misquoted and used against you..
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THE GAMES

The XBox 360 has had a headstart of 1 year to bring us games which make good use of the system. RR7 (1080P) and Resistance are the PS3's best launch titles. Mature PS3 dev kits have only recently become available to developers, which resulted into a few 'quick and dirty' XBox 360 ports for the platform. These conversions are not the reason to acquire a PS3. However there are many things to look forward to:

My top games PS3 wishlist

1) Killzone

Said to already exceed the much criticized trailer.

Low quality video
http://youtube.com/watch?v=g5ROVhHtN_Y

High quality video
http://www.kikizo.com/viewer/vidview_games.asp?games/e32005/kikizo_ps3_killzone2_df_hd.wmv

Also said to be the biggest multimedia project in Dutch history.

"The team are working very hard, they know exactly what they have to do and there's no doubt they will achieve it, but there's nothing to be served by something that doesn't satisfy my goals for the project. I can tell you, though, that some elements already exceed the trailer.""


2) Motorstorm

Massive Hands on Preview:

"Although different demos of the game have been doing the rounds via download onto owners' systems"...

"the near-final product we've played benefits from a lot of perfecting"

"There's no question: all the neat touches they had in the questionable E3 2005 target trailer are pretty much present and respectable in some form or another in the real, final game. It's unbelievable and an absolute told-you-so victory for PS3, with some of the lushest, best-lit visuals we have seen to date. "

http://games.kikizo.com/news/200611/101_p1.asp


3) Lair

Video
http://www.kikizo.com/viewer/vidview_games.asp?games/ps3_gc2006_720p/kikizo_720p30_lair_gc06.wmv
1080P screenshot
http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/761/761161/img_4008271.html

"The single hero dragon you ride is more complex than all objects in our prior games combined, down to little details like the flutter of the wings being dynamically driven."

"Lair in its current form couldn't be done on 360. We are using large amounts of Cell's SPUs for all of our geometry, landscape, simulations, animations, even troop AI. "

IGN interview
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/733/733921p1.html

4) Gran Turismo 5

Screenshots
http://www.granturismo-hd.com/screenshots/viewshot/p82a.jpg
http://www.granturismo-hd.com/screenshots/viewshot/p85a.jpg

A concept demo based on the engine will be available later this month.

Videos
http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/713/713809/vids_1.html

5) Grand Theft Auto IV

Not a PS3 exclusive. Hopefully they get the most out of the game and don't hold back to ease multi-platform porting.

6) Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots

Screenshots
http://www.totalvideogames.com/tvglounge/Metal_Gear_Solid_4_Guns_of_the_Patriots_4281_65572_0.htm



More interesting preview videos:
Afrika
http://www.kikizo.com/viewer/vidview_games.asp?games/ps3_gc2006_720p/kikizo_720p30_afrika_gc06.wmv
Eye of Judgement (board game using a PS3 webcam)
http://www.kikizo.com/viewer/vidview_games.asp?games/ps3_gc2006_720p/kikizo_720p30_eyeofjudgement_gc06.wmv
Eight Days
http://youtube.com/watch?v=eWJJPd34Rf4
Final Fantasy XIII
http://youtube.com/watch?v=g8iIRhDxUbc&mode=related&search=
Formula One 06
http://www.kikizo.com/viewer/vidview_games.asp?games/ps3_gc2006_720p/kikizo_720p30_f106_gc06.wmv
Getaway
http://www.kikizo.com/viewer/vidview_games.asp?games/ps3_gc2006_720p/kikizo_720p30_getaway_gc06.wmv
Heavenly Sword
http://www.kikizo.com/viewer/vidview_games.asp?games/ps3_gc2006_720p/kikizo_720p30_heavenlysword_gc06.wmv
Ninja Gaiden: Sigma
http://www.gametrailers.com/gamepage.php?id=3239
Monster Kingdom
http://www.kikizo.com/viewer/vidview_games.asp?games/ps3_gc2006_720p/kikizo_720p30_monsterkingdom_gc06.wmv
Warhawk
http://www.kikizo.com/viewer/vidview_games.asp?games/ps3_gc2006_720p/kikizo_720p30_warhawk_gc06.wmv
White Knight Story
http://www.jp.playstation.com/movie/tgs06/hdv_whiteknight.asx

For the XBox 360

Most anticipated game Halo 3.
http://gamevideos.com/video/id/7827/

The three XBox 360 games I now extensively tested and actually liked (several others I did not):

1) Kameo Elements of Power 86%
2) Tomb Raider Legend. 85%
3) The much acclaimed 'Gears of War' IMO does not quite live up to the hype, it's not really a FPS like Half-life 2 or Doom 3 on a PC, more a 3rd person perspective shooter and maybe also therefore lacks the ability to really get my adrealine pumping. However seeking cover and shooting from corners is well implemented and works better than I expected with the controller. IMO the heroes totally lack charisma and some of the enemies seem to act even more retarded than our heroes do. 'Boomer' enemies say: "Boom...Boooom" while firing their rockets, just like maybe your 4 year old would. I also get a feeling of having a lack of freedom to explore around the environments, the visuals are inviting but your movements get restricted preventing you to actually explore the areas in the game, so the game feels somewhat "caged". 81%


Backward compatibility

30% of the total US Xbox game library currently works, fewer titles are backward compatible in European and Japanese (about 8%) markets. Though for some games they added enhancements.

Currently more than 98% of the thousands of legacy Playstation and Playstation 2 titles work on the PS3. PSP games support is in the works and Neo Geo titles will be available for download as well.


Conclusion: It's far too early to tell which console will have the edge on gaming. Most PS3 launch titles currently look like quick and dirty ports, similar to early Amiga games which were ported from the Atari ST, which often ran slower on the Amiga due to technical differences. However IMO the available data does seem to suggest that the PS3 will have by far more impressive games available. However like always creating real blockbusters takes more time and effort.

Regarding backward compatibility the PS3 wins hands down.

Last edited by MikeB on 08-Dec-2006 at 07:15 PM.

@MikeB

I'm thinking it'll be the PS3 too. The machine is very slick in it's appearance, the interface is easy on the eye & extremely functional, the fact that it's the cheapest Blu-Ray player out there goes in it's favour & the names (Both Sony & Playstation) are very strong brands. Aside from a the people that will genuinely find it out of reach, looking at the bigger picture, I don't think the cost will be a major player.

On an aside though, I think the Wii will give em both a pretty good running.

FuZion.

@Seer

Nintendo Wii can be lots of fun for the whole family, enjoy it. Sony execs agree as well.

MORE THAN A GAMES CONSOLE?

We know Sony wants us to believe the PS3 is far more than a games console, so what exactly will the PS3 be able to do except for playing DVD and Blu Ray movies out of the box?

1) Karaoke!

Singstar
http://www.kikizo.com/viewer/vidview_games.asp?games/ps3_gc2006_720p/kikizo_720p30_singstar_gc06.wmv

Just kidding!

2) TV Web surfing - Set top box? No problem out of the box, just connect to your TV and hook up your internet connection.

3) Most interestingly, the PS3 can be expanded with a USB or wireless keyboard and mouse. This is not only useful for certain types of games, such as FPS and strategy games, or for use with the integrated webbrowser, but also allows you to use the system as a computer. Currently Linux is already available, but any OS is allowed to be ported to the PS3.

PS3 linux already supports OpenOffice.org office software, Firefox webbrowser, Thunderbird email client, GIMP drawing software, etc.

YDL5.0 / PS3 video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4Wul8MLM6E&NRReview (OpenOffice.org, Firefox, GIMP, etc screenshots)

Extensive PS3 Linux newbee article
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/748/748255p1.html

'Other OS' support will only improve over time and will be a killer feature for some people, myself included.

Wishful thinking: If only the upgradeable harddrive could be used out of the box for TV recording....

4) Help find a cures for diseases like cancer and Alzheimer?
http://folding.stanford.edu/FAQ-PS3.html

OK, I have no idea how many people will keep their PS3 running to help out...

Conclusion: The PS3 can certainly become much more than "just" a games console.

Last edited by MikeB on 08-Dec-2006 at 06:22 PM.

@MikeB

I don't think it will be easy to say that any one console will win.

Sony will obviously wipe the floor with Microsoft in Japan, where the GBA can often be found outselling the 360! This is probably also the only place where the Wii won't come third.

I think Microsoft might actually edge out a lead over in the states. On-line gaming has taken off more over there, so the maturity of the X-Box Live service, combined with Microsoft's strong brand recognition and 1 year head start may give them the edge.

Europe will be the true battleground (although you wouldn't know it given the way we're always last to get everything). There seems to be a lot of strong loyalty to the Sony brand in European territories, but Microsoft are making good use of their head start. By the end of 2007 Microsoft may still have a small lead in Europe, but I think that in the long run the PS3 will outsell the 360.

I have a feeling that the Wii may well end up going the same way as the GameCube - after a few years third party support will all but dry up in Western territories. If the Wii fails spectacularly it could perhaps be Nintendo's last (non-portable) console.

Looking further into the future I think that Microsoft will be aiming to have a similar gap between the X-Box 360 and it's successor as there was between the X-Box and the 360. (Which would mean the next 'Box would be out around 2009).

Sony seem to be aiming to stick to their typical duration between consoles so based on that we wouldn't see a PS4 until 2013. To bridge the gap and prevent the new X-Box over-shadowing the PS3, I reckon there will be an expansion available around the same time as the new X-Box which adds an additional Cell processor and extra RAM. (I recall the early press for the Cell mentioned that Cell processors could work together, and Sony have mentioned the possibility of expanding the PS3 in interviews.)

If Nintendo do go on to produce another console they should try to use Microsoft's shorter console life, so that they do not fall too far behind technically. The cheaper price of the Wii should allow them to do this without customer's feeling ripped off, but given Nintendo's history, I'm not sure if they will choose this approach.

Wii ... sounds like a screaming pig .

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Considering the PS3 isn't currently available, it's pretty much a moot point isn't it? I'm not barring out the possibility of a shipment showing up *sometime* before Xmas, but it's a bit late to make much of an impact for the holidays.

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@jorkany

I was talking about Christmas 2007.

For 2006 my prediction is that the Playstation 2 will be on top (not counting the handhelds). Nintendo Wii and PS3 will sell as much as their companies can produce. I think 2006 will also be a good year for the XBox 360 in closing, but will not get close to PS2 figures.

Last edited by MikeB on 08-Dec-2006 at 06:56 PM.

@MikeB
It all depends on price and what games are available by then. If the price difference is the same as today, then i think the xbox 360 will win.
I also think that the WII can have a pretty big chance in this competition. Though again that will depend on future game releases.

Last edited by Tomas on 08-Dec-2006 at 07:06 PM.

@MikeB
Quote:

I was talking about Christmas 2007.

Whups! So you were. I think that for next Xmas PS3 will be the strongest seller. The reason being, pretty much everybody who wants an Xbox 360 will have one by then, and not everyone is as keen on the Wii being as different as it is (although I plan to pick one up soon).

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@MikeB

Quote:

christmas 2007 Which will "win"?

`


[sarcasm]

AmigaDVD64

[/sarcasm]

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Quote:

- $25 dedicated remote has to be bought seperately.

PS3 Remote reviewed:

http://www.engadget.com/2006/12/08/sonys-bd-remote-control-for-ps3-reviewed/

@MikeB
Quote:

THE HARDWARE Taking out of account "8 core Cell CPU, RSX 'GPU, 256 MB XDR DRAM @ 3.2 GHz, 256 MB GDDR3 @ 700 MHz" vs "3 core Xenon CPU, Xenos GPU, 512 MB unified GDDR3 RAM @ 700 megahertz" wars...

I should point out that PS3 only has 1 general purpose core, the other 7 cores are only DSPs. The PS3's seven DSPs (what Sony calls SPEs) have no cache, no direct access to memory, no branch predictor, and a different instruction set from the PS3's main CPU.

The Xbox 360 has three general purpose CPU cores. The PS3 processor has only one. The Xbox 360's CPUs has vector processing power on each CPU core. Each Xbox 360 core has 128 vector registers per hardware thread, with a dot product instruction, and a shared 1-MB L2 cache. The PS3 processor's vector processing power is mostly on the seven DSPs.

The PS3's CPU is ideal for an environment where 12.5% of the work is general-purpose computing and 87.5% of the work is DSP calculations. That sort of mix makes sense for video playback or networked waveform analysis, but not for games.

The PS3 has 22.4 GB/s of GDDR3 bandwidth and 25.6 GB/s of RDRAM bandwidth for a total system bandwidth of 48 GB/s.

The Xbox 360 has 22.4 GB/s of GDDR3 bandwidth and a 256 GB/s of EDRAM bandwidth for a total of 278.4 GB/s total system bandwidth.

btw, the PS3's GPU is 550Mhz not 3.2Ghz, the CPU is 3.2Ghz

However, using Sony's claim, 7 dot products per cycle * 3.2 GHz = 22.4 billion dot products per second for the CPU. That leaves 51 - 22.4 = 28.6 billion dot products per second that are left over for the GPU. That leaves 28.6 billion dot products per second / 550 MHz = 52 GPU ALU ops per clock.

Hey but what do I know, I am biased because I own a 360

Last edited by DaveyD on 08-Dec-2006 at 08:57 PM.
Last edited by DaveyD on 08-Dec-2006 at 08:51 PM.
Last edited by DaveyD on 08-Dec-2006 at 08:46 PM.

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@DaveyD

Quote:

btw, the PS3's GPU is 550Mhz not 3.2Ghz, the CPU is 3.2Ghz

I believe that's what I wrote. The Cell and XDR RAM are clocked at 3.2 Ghz.

Anyway there are now various Playstation classics and smaller games available at Sony's PS3 store. Also a new game based on a game which debuted on the Amiga:

Lemmings 2 screenshots.

Last edited by MikeB on 12-Jan-2007 at 11:23 AM.

@MikeB

I think the problem with your analysis is it's a guess at configs and guess at prices. What's to say that Microsoft and/or Sony will make 0 changes before next Christmas with respect to console or price.

Also, what's to say the Wii isn't a player in the system? As such Microsoft is closer to their price... Dropping the low end 360 $50 matches it's pricing and might be another angle of attack used for the market.

@MikeB

Quote:

Lemmings 2 screenshots. Only $3

No that'd be $603!

@madtrekker

Quote:

If the Wii fails spectacularly it could perhaps be Nintendo's last (non-portable) console.

I don't think the Wii will fail, I think it will do better than the Nintendo GameCube did. However during christmas 2007 I think people will expect better graphics than the Wii can offer.

I wouldn't mind if Nintendo at some point would release a Wii-style remote for the PS3 and released improved versions of their Wii hit titles...

@MikeB

Quote:

I wouldn't mind if Nintendo at some point would release a Wii-style remote for the PS3 and released improved versions of their Wii hit titles...

...

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