@ChrisH

Well it seems to work quite o.k. as even if this very thread we have people taking this AA2-nonsense for real

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@Kronos
Their actions do seem to suggest that AA2 is "for real" (and we will soon find out if it isn't). I'd say that it is more a question of whether it is any good or not, and whether it is more than a modified AA1.

Steve Jobs never really lies, but he does greatly exaggerate the truth (to the extent that pigs are now landing at Heathrow), and gets away with it. McEwan seems to try to exaggerate the truth in a similar manner, but IMHO isn't sufficiently capable to get away with it.

Last edited by ChrisH on 03-Feb-2008 at 10:56 PM.

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@ChrisH

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@ChrisH

Quote:

ChrisH wrote: @Kronos Their actions do seem to suggest that AA2 is "for real" (and we will soon find out if it isn't). I'd say that it is more a question of whether it is any good or not, and whether it is more than a modified AA1. Steve Jobs never really lies, but he does greatly exaggerate the truth (to the extent that pigs are now landing at Heathrow), and gets away with it. McEwan seems to try to exaggerate the truth in a similar manner, but IMHO isn't sufficiently capable to get away with it.

Apple brings products to market though. They bring things to fruition to the public. Is AA2 and OS5 "for real" for the purposes of actually releasing an end-user product? And even if that really is the intention, to have a product for public consumption, given the company's management ability (or lack thereof) whats the chances it will be available for sale in any meaningful amount of time? Endless repeating themes of them talking every once and a while to apparently raise more venture capital investment dosen't do diddly for us.

BTW, what makes you say "we will soon find out if" AA2 is for real or not? Is there some new self imposed deadline they have given? How do we know we will know this soon?

Last edited by fairlanefastback on 04-Feb-2008 at 06:27 PM.

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@SpaceDruid

Quote:

SpaceDruid wrote: @kadenaa Quote: kadenaa wrote: @retro Either my memory is bad (which is quite possible) but I'm sure Bill said AA2 was OS5 only a couple of weeks ago. No, a third party reporter made a comment about an off the record comment Bill said to him at an event on his blog. (Making yet another example of why you should treat such comments with more than a grain of salt).

There was no indication what Bill said was "off the record". And with Amiga's history for all we know he said exactly what was reported and is changing his tune now. He can keep blaming almost every reporter he meets after the fact, like he did after the Kent affair with the Seattle Times, etc, but over time its a matter of accumulated reputation.

If Amiga handled PR correctly from the start this would not be such a problem, amazing that with a PR firm they still don't get it how to do this stuff.

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@fairlanefastback

The guy who wrote the blog said "Bill told me privately". How much more off the record than that do you require?


Edit: Typo

Last edited by SpaceDruid on 04-Feb-2008 at 06:45 PM.

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@retro

I must say i find this article very interesting. It remains to be seen if the OS5 thing turns out to be something really revolutionary and something that we all want...

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@SpaceDruid

Quote:

SpaceDruid wrote: @fairlanefastback The guy who wrote the blog said "Bill told me privately". How much more off the record than that do you require?

Uh, please stop making stuff up.

http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2008/01/07/ces_amiga_os_5_surfaces/

Quote:

Amiga – the company – was ostensibly showing AmigaAnywhere 2, the new version of its virtual machine technology. But taking Amiga President Bill McEwen aside for a moment, we discovered that AmigaAnywhere 2 is AmigaOS 5. "We had to call it that because of the Microsoft deal,” McEwen whispered.

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Last edited by fairlanefastback on 04-Feb-2008 at 07:07 PM.

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@Helge

Quote:

Helge wrote: @retro I must say i find this article very interesting. It remains to be seen if the OS5 thing turns out to be something really revolutionary and something that we all want...

How many years should we give this do you think? LOL!



Lets hope they get something out soon. Time waits for no man (or company).

Last edited by fairlanefastback on 04-Feb-2008 at 07:12 PM.

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That was the most boring read I have had in ages. I feel like we are at 2001 once
again. Oh boy, anybody thinking this will get the boing ball rolling have to be out
of their mind. As usual this has nothing to do with what Amiga was in the past, and
the lies started early with "this" being better than OSX, so expect more lies, folks.

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@fairlanefastback

Quote:

If Amiga handled PR correctly from the start this would not be such a problem, amazing that with a PR firm they still don't get it how to do this stuff.

Since it's the same firm he used from 1996, I doubt they are confused as to how to represent their client after at least a 12 year relationship.

#6

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@number6

Quote:

number6 wrote: @fairlanefastback Quote: If Amiga handled PR correctly from the start this would not be such a problem, amazing that with a PR firm they still don't get it how to do this stuff. Since it's the same firm he used from 1996, I doubt they are confused as to how to represent their client after at least a 12 year relationship. #6

I'm looking at output of PR, its confused, disjointed, and ridiculous, for years. Whose fault that is more in the past 12 years, I'm not sure. And neither can you be. Except that by now someone should probably be getting the picture that their combined efforts in this department are awful, time and time again. Its interesting though that only more recent stuff is actually signed by the PR rep. We can only be sure on collaborations on the things the PR firm itself signs. Regardless, their PR is worse than PR for most firms with no PR firm at all. Thats all that matters. Its a bloody shame.

Last edited by fairlanefastback on 04-Feb-2008 at 08:06 PM.

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@Manu

Quote:

That was the most boring read I have had in ages. I feel like we are at 2001 once again. Oh boy, anybody thinking this will get the boing ball rolling have to be out of their mind. As usual this has nothing to do with what Amiga was in the past, and the lies started early with "this" being better than OSX, so expect more lies, folks.

I agree. They even admit the massive challenge in trying this:

Quote:

Q: Aren't there other products that already do the same thing? A: Such middleware solutions are certainly not a new idea, and other products with similar goals are already well established and commonly used. AA2 differs in the extent of the number and range of features offered and the ease to which these can be used.

Whats the point on taking on Java with so little chance of sucess with not much better to offer, assuming this is even the truth?

Last edited by fairlanefastback on 04-Feb-2008 at 08:05 PM.
Last edited by fairlanefastback on 04-Feb-2008 at 08:03 PM.

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@fairlanefastback

I just posted what I did for the usual reason.
There are still people who believe the PR firm is new and this somehow represents a dramatic change for AI.
Just posting for the record that this is old news.

#6

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@number6

Quote:

number6 wrote: @fairlanefastback I just posted what I did for the usual reason. There are still people who believe the PR firm is new and this somehow represents a dramatic change for AI. Just posting for the record that this is old news. #6

Well it is unclear if how they are using them is new vs. the past. The PR firm actually signing the releases lately is new. Being on the client list dosen't tell us how much their services were used in the past. There is an appearance they may have stepped up usage, OR that a new tact is being tried because of the signing of the releases and willingness to now have to field phone calls on Amiga's behalf. Maybe the only difference is the signature from before, maybe not. From what we can see from the outside looking in though it is a change in usage to some extent, its significance is a whole other question, one we can't answer.

Last edited by fairlanefastback on 04-Feb-2008 at 08:12 PM.

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@Helgis. Something we dont want !!!

@GregS

Quote:

A new SDK for AA2 appears ready for downloading, but as I have to sign an NDA to get it, even when I find out what it is based on, I will not be able to say anything.

Amiga desperately needs to release some public information on the SDK.

The FAQ may be of interest to members of the community but the site offers virtually no information on the solution and why it might be compelling for developers. In fact, two of the links on the page are just placeholders.

@fairlanefastback

Quote:

fairlanefastback wrote: Whats the point on taking on Java with so little chance of sucess with not much better to offer, assuming this is even the truth?

This argument has been floating around unchallenged for way too long now, time to set a few things straight. The Java comparison is simply way off, neither AmigaAnywhere or the AmigaDE was ever comparable to the JavaVM for any of it's intents or purposes. A more appropriate comparison would be with a Hypervisor like VirtualPC or VMware.

You see, while a JavaVM or a .NET environment abstracts the OS making applications OS independant, a Hypervisor even abstracts the hardware, making applications not just OS independant but also hardware independant. Most hypervisor technologies even does this using less resources than a traditional virtual machine and one of the biggest trends in IT development today is using tools like Softgrid by Microsoft or Thinstall by VMWare to deliver fully hardware and OS independant software. Some IT analysts even claim that this trend is currently the biggest threat to Windows and that in the future, operating systems will be of practically no importance to our software nor our choice of hardware.

As it seems, Microsoft themselves has acknowledged this threat and is moving towards full hypervisor based technologies for Windows Server as a response. As an interesting related read, a windows developer explains hypervisor technology and Microsoft's new strategy here:
http://blogs.msdn.com/virtual_pc_guy/archive/2006/07/10/661958.aspx

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@samface

This is all well and good, but we are talking about AA2. And from the FAQ at Amiga.com there is no clear indication that your theory is correct. I don't know enough about the basically defunct AA1 to know if you are correct or not. But since AA1 is out and AA2 is in the question will be what AA2 is comparable to.

Regardless the argument is the same:

Whats the point on taking on Java with so little chance to beat Sun and the other already established players in that space?

Whats the point of taking on VMware with so little chance to beat VMware and the other already established players in that space?

Amiga Development India can't even finish Whackforce. How are a few guys working from home for AI going to blow away Sun or VMware? Look at the lack of management we've seen from this company.

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Last edited by fairlanefastback on 05-Feb-2008 at 04:37 PM.
Last edited by fairlanefastback on 05-Feb-2008 at 04:37 PM.

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@fairlanefastback

Quote:

fairlanefastback wrote: @samface Whats the point on taking on Java with so little chance to beat Sun and the other already established players in that space?

At the risk of gross simplification, and for the moment ignoring the virtualization aspect, my initial impression after reading the FAQ is that AA2 is more or less "Java for Games," which is something that Java itself isn't very good at. Not that Amiga Inc. will be very good at it either, but we'll see.

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