Quote:

Amiga_3k wrote: @Kremlar People buying an X1000 are the same kind as the people who bought a brand new A2000 / A3000 / A4000 when they were released. I mean, the most of them could have settled with an A500, A600 (erm.. doesn't quite fit, I know), A1200 but just bought the far more expensive big-boxes because they could. Sure, for that money you could buy far more powerfull hardware, but would it provide you with the same satisfaction?

I think times have changed. Back then it was the norm to spend $2000-$3000 on a PC, but nowadays it is not.

Back then I bought a 3000, then a 4000, but at the time I felt I was getting something better for my $. I was getting superior sound, superior graphics, pre-emptive multitasking, not just something different but also something superior! Something cool to show off to my friends.

I've never used Amiga OS 4.x, but here's how it plays out in my mind. I'm spending a lot of extra $ for less performance than a standard PC, and the software I'm getting is very limited. It may be quick and efficient, which I like, but what can I do with it? It can't run the vast majority of modern day software or hardware. What is there that's cool that I can show off? Where's today's Walker demo or today's Shadow of the Beast?

By going x86 you at least throw the price problem out the window. People would be more inclined to give it a shot, especially if there were a freely downloadable trial. I would. If people like the OS, perhaps it would attract more development.

On x86 the hardware is more plentiful, so the possibilities are endless. You can buy full tower PCs, you can buy tablets, you can buy PCs the size of a deck of cards. I realize there would be driver issues, but Hyperion could pick and choose platforms to support without having to worry about hardware. I believe that's their intention now, problem is the playing field is so small and the available hardware is not ideal. Look at the new SAM board with only 1 SATA port, and look at its price.

@Kremlar

Welcome to the AmigaWorld site.

As you may not be aware there have been endless threads debating the merits of x86 (and more recently ARM) vs PPC. While these are healthy discussions, you are derailing this thread.

For some good background on the x86 and ARM to-and-fro may I suggest doing some forum searches. You will find a couple of pretty large threads!

If you would like to continue the x86/ARM discussion please open up a new topic in the appropriate forum.


Thanks

Last edited by gregthecanuck on 10-Mar-2011 at 08:44 PM.

@gregthecanuck

What are you going on about?

This is an X1000 thread and where else should the 'Let's kick the crap
out of X1000 fans news story' be?

Really,, if there was anything wrong with it, it would be moderated.

So there.......HAAArumph.

Sorry.

Last edited by Kremlar on 10-Mar-2011 at 09:24 PM.

@Kremlar

You know the chines are under payed.

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@Kremlar

We've got a low-end (Sam 440EP), Medium spec (Sam 460EX) and high-end (X1000) Amiga compatibles for the 1st time in decades. Look how blessed we are. For a market this small these are extremely exciting times. Forget praising the merits of the Atom processor and save up for what we do have! The real trick will be growing the application base and selling the system to ex-Amigans and the Think Different generation! Apple is no longer the renegade in the IT business, it's got the second highest stock price of any American company!!! Let the new start up raise its head. Long live the Amiga!!!



If you want to faff around with x86 use an Amiga emulator or use AROS!!! If you want to dust off old Mac computers then give MorphOS a spin again there's no reason to de-rail OS4.x development right now because you've got a x86 beige box at home that you'd use to poke around with an OS4 port for a few hours a week after Hyperion spent millions porting it!?!! For the faff of Hyperion porting OS4 to x86 why not instead encourage them to use the development time to further the platform on PPC, make some money, even encourage Varisys to design their own PPC chip/new mobo to offer to the fabs, or pay someone to do it and continue the processer line the way it's going?

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@Kremlar

As highlighted by BigD the advantage of a custom platform is the investment required means more of commitment to working with it by the user, whether that be developing software, contributing to bounties, beta testing, etc.

There are and has been plenty of alternative x86 OSes but few great success stories, in terms of achieving mass market appeal.

OS4 was ported to PPC some years ago now, I think the money/time needed to another architecture will prevent this for the foreseeable future.

A big advantage of the existing situation is the ability to get rock solid hardware support as only a narrow range is supported, if OS4 was x86 many would that complain about no x86 now would be complaining instead about lack of drivers/compatibility issues with the many different motherboards/chip sets etc out there. For example, I've yet to successfully run a usable AROS install on any x86, including two atom based systems I've tried, because of driver issues e.g. with graphics corruption.

I think you raise some fair points though and would agree that a unique selling point (for the wider market at least) is somewhat lacking at present with the X1000/OS4 offering. However, maybe we don't have all the facts yet?

@ShadowSun

Yes, but no boing ball engraving, red LEDs. The X1000 version is much nicer.

@Amiga_3k

at that time people who bought expensive big box amigas did it, because they were able to do a real job with it. people in film, design, maybe music, whatever you can think of, and they also bought expensive software to run on it because it allowed them to do stuff yet easier, better or cheaper than on another platform, say for instance mac. i bought my first copy of reald3 from such a guy. to buy a expensive piece out of sentiment or just to put it on display is another matter. would not compare the two.

@NoelFuller

It's a fair point, but having seen an Nemo board in the Fractal case, even that has plenty of breathing space. It's a monster case by today's standards.

I think a 'mini' version of the X1000 case with similar slick design and boing ball branding would be great for us Sam users.

i for that matter like many others was never able to afford a big box in the nineties, but there was upgradeable entry level. which was very smart.

@wawa

No one has to buy it? It's a free market.

@TrevorDick

'new dual-core XMOS subsystem.'

XS1-L2 124QFN, Dual-core device, Up to 1000 MIPS, 84 I/O pins, 128KB SRAM


'Xena has 64 of these configurable I/O lines.'

Did I miss something? Or did you?

@Daniel

of course. only the comparison doesnt fit.

@wawa

Well don’t buy it then, better yet don’t respond to a thread about a product your not going to buy or constantly drone on about why your not going to buy it in a thread about a product your not going to buy...

I think I can sum up most of the counter X1000 arguments,

MOAN 1.!! Its too expensive for me!!! -- Open a savings account and put some cash aside! I've been saving since it was announced and if the say-sayers are right and it doesn’t get released I’ll still have the money to buy a Sam 460... If you can't save any money, well Tough it's out of your price range and that’s that, moaning about it is not going to help.

MOAN 2.!! Its not x86!!!, x86 better because X, Y & Z!!! -- Ether that or you already have an x86 PC and you don’t want to spend any money to run OS4. Besides the PC platform has dozens of OS's out there will one more on pirate bay really make any difference? (apart from harming OS4 development and ripping off Hyperion's hard work) OS4 is not open source, if you want to see improvements in the OS you must invest in the OS and pay for them, besides what better way to protect that hard work than by running it on custom PPC hardware.

Last edited by Wizzard_o on 11-Mar-2011 at 08:46 AM.

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@Kremlar (and wawa )
What you wrote makes sense but there are some interesting things to consider: as Wizard_o wrote, in the end we all have an X86 system at home, it's not that if Amiga isn't on X86 (we have Aros there by the way) we will never sample the marvels of that kind of technology.
But one cool thing of the 80s was the creative vision people had, new computer designs would come out every 6 months (and if you count arcade hardware PCBs you can say "every month") those were exiting times and if it wasn't for Amiga they would be all but gone today.
So the first thing you can boast if you have an X1000, is having 2011 weirdest computer!
This machine is really out there when you think about it, it has a CPU nobody has ever seen up-close but the military! The latter is also kind of "playful" considering its programmable cache and the fact its interconnected to a Dual-Core event driven processor on one side (Xena) and should also be directly connected to the Xorro slot on the other.

This is cool in a different way the A1000 (or 500) were, but its pure geekdom in its own right.

Besides, you shouldn't concentrate too much on whether or not, heavily advertised software runs on it, you should ask yourself if modern tasks can be done on it.
By the look of things they will. Not only there are many programs to be used today (for a quick rundown check HERE), but a lot more are in the making (just think at the possibilities QT will open for ex.)

Not for everyone sure, but those that love unconventional solutions will find a lot to like here.

Last edited by DAX on 11-Mar-2011 at 09:48 AM.

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@DAX

Quote:

This machine is really out there when you think about it, it has a CPU nobody has ever seen up-close but the military! The latter is also kind of "playful" considering its programmable cache and the fact its interconnected to a Dual-Core event driven processor on one side (Xena) and should also be directly connected to the Xorro slot on the other.

Exactly, it is really interesting design. However, I would rather see i7 based Amiga - 4 times faster and for half price of X1000. I know it is not possible now, but I hope it will be in future.

@pavlor
And I would rather see a 4.0Ghz Power7 based Amiga. I know it's not possible now but I hope it will be in the future!

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@Daniel

Quote:

having seen an Nemo board in the Fractal case, even that has plenty of breathing space. It's a monster case by today's standards. I think a 'mini' version of the X1000 case with similar slick design and boing ball branding would be great for us Sam users.

Agreed.

Call me picky but the size of the board and of the case is THE deal killer for me. I already have a PC tower here, and I cannot imagine putting another monsterbox under or beside my desk. The mini-ITX SAM in its tiny fanless case is just right for my desktop.

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@DAX

Quote:

And I would rather see a 4.0Ghz Power7 based Amiga. I know it's not possible now but I hope it will be in the future!

i7 is nearly as fast as Power7 in most desktop applications - for only fracture of price of Power7. So, I would rather see OS4 on i7 than on Power7.