@OlafS25

I don't buy the argument about piracy, there was just as muth piracy on PC as it was on Amiga.

People did not buy the Amiga1200, because it was not that great,

if you did not have the cash when it came out and head to wait a year, then things head changes a lot.

If Amiga1200 head come out one year before in 1991, things might have looked a lot different here, no doubt. But I dont think it was possible to skip the Amiga600, the ECS chipset was part of development progress to get to AGA, I belive ECS enabled 2MB of chip ram, OCS was stuck on 512KB on Agnus and 1MB I belive whit FAT Agnus.

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@NutsAboutAmiga

About doom1:
http://doom.wikia.com/wiki/Aspect_ratio

Later it has been patched.
They say that y1995 640x480x8 games started to appear.

>AmigaOS does not automatically install a driver for you, AmogaOS does not connect to internet to find a driver.

Neither did win95.
Even today drivers come on CDs and theres 2GB drivers in windows installation.

But anyway.... not going to did all the autoconfig advantages ... but it works.
When the driver is on the card you just plug it in and it works. That's the way it must be.
One can later update the driver if needed.

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@NutsAboutAmiga

As I wrote, DOOM has been upgraded in modern times to use 640x480 (or more), but DOOM as it was released in 1993 and Heretic as it was released for christmas 1994 used 320x200.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Official_versions_of_Doom

You can read more about some of the problems this caused in later times here:
http://doom.wikia.com/wiki/Aspect_ratio

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@NutsAboutAmiga

the piracy was on PC certainly as big as on Amiga but the market was much bigger so there were still enough sales. AGA 1991 instead of 1992, for A1200 additional Fastram and skip A600 then who knows. I was a diehard "Intel outside" at that time, I bought A1200 with HD and then A4000/30 with graphiccard but it was not a rational but emotional decision. There was much more software on PC and on the rising so people who looked at it from outside if they should buy a amiga or a PC the decision was clear. And cheap was Amiga not anymore too.

@Kronos

Quote:

Sure, but with anything Amiga those have to be substracted from the 2GB addressspace !!

How so? I have 2GB RAM in my A1 and what takes the most space is AmigaOS. All my 2GB is accounted for.

Quote:

The issue here is that some OS-functions return LONG instead of ULONG for addresses,

Maybe. Mostly DOS I'd say. But does this matter? If 2GB is the max an average 32-bit computer can access then loosing a bit of 4GB RAM doesn't matter that much.

In anycase, to truly use 4GB and beyond, AmigaOS has to go 64-bit.

@OlafS25

I was die hard back then too, but when I look back, I think my prereption was bit colored by being a fan boy, shore Amiga500 was a good of its time, and time was changing, Amiga never really penetrated the office environment.

The high end CAD graphics was mostly done on high end workstations.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Workstation

Amiga computers where used in 3D graphics, in 1995
Lightwave and Cinama4D migrated to PC.

On PC there was 3D studio MAX.
http://area.autodesk.com/maxturns20/history

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 12-Feb-2014 at 01:31 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 12-Feb-2014 at 01:31 PM.

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@BigD

Quote:

A bit harsh since the build quality and reliability of the ACube and A-EON products seem to be way ahead of the Eyetech Teron boards.

I dunno. The red boards looks nice but I've never had a major problem with my A1 the last ten or so years. Only usual wear and tear.

Most of the A1 problems were due to MAIs on board chips. And even the Sam has issues. For example USB.

But the X1000 may not be as good as it looks. Expensive for sure but I had a hardware designer examime my X1000 board when it arrived. Not trying to criticise here but she combed her fine tuned eyes over the board and said the soldering was shoddy. As if not to make me feel any worse for spending all that money she topped it off and said there were comnpanies who would scrap the entire batch for slight flaws she was pointing out! I haven't bought a computer made in England since my C16 days and she really thought it looked like a dud!

Quote:

I recon they're Amigas

But how many NG Amiga do you have?

That's another story. Telling someone you have an Amiga was bad enough, but how do you explain an NG Amiga? What on earth is that!?

@Yssing

Quote:

So? Those are so 20 years ago.

So my point is those are things that make an Amiga, an Amiga. There are others like AutoConfig the AmigaOne machines don't have. Which was a great feature. In it's place is a copy of the Windows '95 Plug'n'Play disk loader methiod. That's going backwards.

But I was pointing Amiga features out as cdimauro was making a deal about how the NG Amigas are not Amigas.

Quote:

Yes and the term Amiga didn't describe a specific model either.

Not but they were compatible enough. You could pretty much boot a disk and it work work. Sure there were some differences but one version of AmigaOS could run on them all. If you try and boot an AmigaOne XE Workbench disc on an AmigaOne "X1000" or an AmigaOne "X500" it will crash.

The only thing in common with an AmigaOne machine now is that at the end of the day it is running AmigaOS.

@NutsAboutAmiga

except desktop video there was no segment where it was used by professionals and this segment was too small, the Amiga clearly was home computer with excellent graphic and audio capabilities suited for 2D games. So they should have improved that and added chunky later on. AGA was too late and a improvement but not good enough to beat the competition. AGA one year earlier and less wrong decisions by management and more money for R&D and a real strategy for the platform then both Amiga and Commodore could have survived.

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

The installation CD, issue was all down to AmigaKit not supplying a CD whit correct drivers on it.

I'm lost. Who blamed hardware for what now?

Quote:

I did not like that chose to continue whit AmigaONE brand, because Eyetech made so many huge mistakes whit there hardware, using the same brand name.

The only problem I have is applying the name else where. Eyetechs problem was using MAI. But, half the time I don''t know what people are on about. Who's blaming hardware now?

I've had my AmigaOne for almost ten years. It's a fine machine. I mean it runs fine. Must have worked around any issue years ago and forgot what the problem is.

@Hypex

Well the chips are of different Power ISA, so there differences between CPU's, there is HAL, or hardware abstraction layer some where in there that copes whit differences.

I belive this what make the X1000 execute some PowerPC instructions it does not really support, no matter what the X1000, is what I use its the best NG amiga I have owned, there might be some issues but they are all software related, the problems whit MaiLogic and there chips where huge compared to some soldering point not looking perfect.

A soldering point that full covered, is ok for me, if shape of soldering point not round I do not care, as long as card has been tested and working I'm happy.

Should mother board be made in gold and rubies, for the price of X1000, well I don't know, but it works just as fine whit out gold and rubies I tell you.

My issue is whit GCC, and not optimized binaries, the X1000 has yet showing it true face yet..
I'm also really excited about SMP, hope we get that soon.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 13-Feb-2014 at 12:20 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 12-Feb-2014 at 01:52 PM.

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@NutsAboutAmiga

without any doubt X1000 is a nice machine and the fastest option if you want to run AmigaOS. If it is worth the money must everyone decide for himself.

@OlafS25

Not yet... a G4 beats it... And I think GCC is to blame for it.



Only in memory transferee the X1000, is beetling every thing else.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 12-Feb-2014 at 02:03 PM.

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@NutsAboutAmiga

a good start

but I wrote "option for AmigaOS"

@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

I think that depended more on the Monitor / TV

At the time I used a TV. But I am comparing ECS to AGA here. You could tell the colors had more depth. For example Bubble and Squeak had a real crisp appearance in comparison to A500 games.

Quote:

A pallette for anything above 8bit does not make lot of sense, well maybe if there was a 9bit mode, but,

Sorry I meant a palette of 24-bits for each colour, IOW a 256 size palette.

So a pointer to a palette like that needing 1KB of linear RAM.

Quote:

the size of 24bit pellate is 2^24 * 3 = 48 M

Are you talking about 24-bit per RGB? Wouldn't that be 9 bytes per palette entry maikng 2304 bytes for 256 size palette? I lost you, now you've lost me!

But, C= did go overboard by assuming 32-bit per RGB gun would become standard, when AGA only had 8-bits.

Quote:

Colour to Planar when you draw a pixels and C2P to convert normal graphics into some thing displayable

It was really only a problem when drawing individual pixels. And games that full screen rendered without using hardware acceleration. For moving block based images it was fine.

At 8-bits, a 320x200 bitplane screen takes the same anount of memory, as a 320x200 chunkymap screen. And with interlaved bitmaps, the same size of memory is copied or blitted as it would be for chunky.

It makes no sense to do planar over 8-bit. Oxer this you get into true colour and not using a true bitmap anymore. Even if you lose the CLUT feature of being able to fade or change muiltiple pixel colours real fast.

Quote:

I do not think there was any thing called hardware 3D back then

The Amiga was already doing it with the blitter. That's how the Amiga did 3d. A prelude of things to come. The blitter could also support textures but they didn't expand on it. Unfortunately it was left as a static 16-bit or 16-pixel texture. It needed scaling support and ability to plot X1,Y1 to X2,Y2 desination bitmap size.

Quote:

Well dualplayfields are just 2 x 4 bitplanes,

It was too limited. At this point we needed a chnuky bitplane mode then 2x 256 colour platyfields would have been possible.

Quote:

And lets get back to the point I'm happy AmigaONE is not based on the less successful designs of Amiga from 1992 to 1994.

I think AGA was quite a sxucess for its time. Might not have been the best the original design could have been but it is the legacy of the real Amiga.

I would have liked to see more Amiga features in the AmigaOne. One of the first things people asked me is if a VideoToaster worked in an A1. Unfortunately it had no Zorro slots. Not even a Zorro 4!

But did the A4000 ISA slots miss out on AutoConfig?

Quote:

Again graphic speed on the PC makes up for any hardware feature Amiga did have back then.

But that wasn't possible back then and simply VGA wouldn't have cut it. We are also forgetting that Amniga had genlock bits and was used in TV studios to good use. Had VGA been used in place of AGA in the last Amiga that would have killed it!

Last edited by Hypex on 13-Feb-2014 at 01:09 PM.
Last edited by Hypex on 12-Feb-2014 at 02:30 PM.

@OlafS25

Right now I think a Pegasus II G4, might be a fattest option for AmigaOS4,

But that might change whit newer GCC, optimized Mplayer, and output driver using composition.
Optimized emulators like Basilisk and EUAE.

But its also about having a RadionHD, I don't want to be whit out it, when the 3D drivers become ready.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 12-Feb-2014 at 02:34 PM.

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@NutsAboutAmiga

you mean it is a investment in the future? Hopefully you are right there. I think one from Amigakit accidently said there will be something in 3 months (about April).

Last edited by OlafS25 on 12-Feb-2014 at 02:31 PM.

@Hypex

Quote:

I would have liked to see more Amiga features in the AmigaOne. One of the first things people asked me is if a VideoToaster worked in an A1. Unfortunately it had no Zorro slots. Not even a Zorro 4!

Even if worked what will do whit it?
The resolution of video toaster is not great to day.

I do like the real time effects and all that but, its shame there is no new VideoToster, thats the better option my mind, maybe this FPGA geeks spend bit of time on that instead, just imagen VideoTosterHD.

Quote:

But did the A4000 ISA slots miss out on AutoConfig?

Well you can't run a BIOS extension from PC EEPROM, whit out also having a PC CPU, well you might emulate it, but it does not make sense the BIOS extension was written for MSDOS.

Maybe if it was possible to re-flash the EEPROM, on cards whit EEPROM.
Or if was possible to use ISA card whit in PCTask or some thing like that.

Quote:

Had VGA been used in place of AGA in the last Amiga that would have killed it!

Scala emigrated to PC, after Amiga died in 1994, there where TV cards for PC.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 13-Feb-2014 at 12:24 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 12-Feb-2014 at 02:50 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 12-Feb-2014 at 02:47 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 12-Feb-2014 at 02:32 PM.

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@OlafS25

Yes I did buy it future investment, I know not every thing be ready at once, I did not expect the there to be comparability problems whit Pa-Semi.

I believe the future for AmigaOS, is SMP support even if have to break a few eggs so to speak, and do believe 64Bit is also some thing that will need to be addressed at one point or another.

PCIe and USB2, is also some thing that makes it worth it in my eyes.

All the QorIQ cpu's that are coming will need to have SMP support, and they all are 64bit.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 13-Feb-2014 at 12:26 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 12-Feb-2014 at 02:47 PM.

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@NutsAboutAmiga

Propably SMP will be more like WarpUP needing adapted software to benefit from and some system functions that use more than one kernel to make all more responsive. Automatic SMP support without breaking compatibility is impossible (at least what I have read). And 64bit is a even bigger change needing major changes, recompiling everything and will for sure break compatibility. Or you use UAE for 68k emulation but then you are where Aros is.

Last edited by OlafS25 on 12-Feb-2014 at 02:46 PM.
Last edited by OlafS25 on 12-Feb-2014 at 02:45 PM.