@salass00

Quote:

I assume you won't be using my AROS port of filesysbox.library then as it's based on "os4 crap" as you so eloquently put it.

OTOH, OS4 version is based on MorphOS version... but that's an another story I guess :)

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@phoenixkonsole

Quote:

2 bounties are not 100 bounties.

2 or 1000 doesn't matter, this is a very hard project.
Having all that code already availible from free but choosing to rewrite the whole stuff just for the ego of a single person (you) will be just stupid

Quote:

Again using the os4 crap means more waste of time.

What crap are you saying ? did you check the code or are you talking just for talking ?

Quote:

Another one: qt 4 is not 5.

Qt5 is the direct successor or Qt4, that means they share a lot of code in between, such commond code can be reused and/or adapted

Quote:

And if you force me to discuss further I pay bszili 2000€ a month after tax to ditch is os4 support at all.

In case you wonder taking the code is an for help YOU in first place, it will help AROS/MOS users to have a real port in a decent timeframe --> less than 2/3/5 YEARS

Is clearly evident from your words that you have absolutely no idea of how much work is needed to port Qt on an amiganoid platform and how long it might take to rewriting it from scratch, if these are the premises I believe that no one in the AROS/MOS community can have confidence in the success of this project

Quote:

I see mos using aros as ground for a platform switch in some years. So os4 is redundant and should be put to the trash can.

Please stop that crap and start using your adult brain ...

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@salass00
I judge by what they talk(ed) about me and not by the os.
Of course if they benefit by things for the os it automatically becomes painted red in my eyes.

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@samo79

In this case it is not important what phoenixkonsole thinks or prefers or dislikes, it is Bszili who takes the bounty AND has the experience in porting to the different platforms. And Bszili has certainly looked in the sources before taking the bounty and knows what he does. If someone uses AmigaOS too much and not knows the differences between platforms (and does not care BTW because most developers only develop for one platform) it is not portable anymore. We would need modern cross-platform class libraries to hide the differences but we have not.

Please read Bszilis comment the page before. It is describing why from a technical point of view.

Last edited by OlafS25 on 29-Jan-2015 at 10:03 AM.
Last edited by OlafS25 on 29-Jan-2015 at 10:01 AM.

@BSzili

Quote:

I have also zero interest in identity politics, I'm talking about technical issues here. There is nothing wrong with having an opinion, but having an informed opinion is even better. I really hope that when alfkil resumes the work on Qt 5 we can have a common codebase, but this requires compromises. Even if this doesn't happen, we can still benefit from each other's work.

Mate. I don't say much on Amiga sites anymore but I watch and learn. Your comments and vision make me want to nominate you for President of the US-A (United States of Amiga)!

I won't say anymore but a thank you (and other coders like you of which there are many)for your work and or cooperation across all flavors of Amiga.

ace

@BSzili

Quote:

Let me set a few things straight. [...] still benefit from each other's work.

Thank you very much for your enlightening words...

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Differences:

Graphics library - is compositing working along the same lines as os4 on other platforms?

Shared objects: this is quite essential. Is it supported on the other platforms?

Qt5 is pretty reliant on mesa. Basically you open a window and let gl routines do the rest
If mesa is available, it should be straightforward to port all gfx.

WaitSelect() is combined signaling and socket'ing available on other platforms?

AppDockies: would have to be transformed to the api of your favorite dock if possible.

Possibly other things, but these are the most salient. Oh yeah: interfaces. Veery difficult to wrap your head around...

Differences:

Graphics library - is compositing working along the same lines as os4 on other platforms?

Shared objects: this is quite essential. Is it supported on the other platforms?

Qt5 is pretty reliant on mesa. Basically you open a window and let gl routines do the rest
If mesa is available, it should be straightforward to port all gfx.

WaitSelect() is combined signaling and socket'ing available on other platforms?

AppDockies: would have to be transformed to the api of your favorite dock if possible.

Possibly other things, but these are the most salient. Oh yeah: interfaces. Veery difficult to wrap your head around...

@samo79

Bszili + any source code = < 2 years (to be honest you should count in month, we are not talking about atihd drivers for os4)

Comparing the amiga 4.x code with 5.8 could take to years by hand.

Just shut up.

You are the one who repeated over and over again ignoring what the developer has stated already.

Last edited by phoenixkonsole on 29-Jan-2015 at 12:15 PM.
Last edited by phoenixkonsole on 29-Jan-2015 at 12:14 PM.
Last edited by phoenixkonsole on 29-Jan-2015 at 12:13 PM.

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@alfkil

WaitSelect() is AmiTCP extension. It is available in every AmiTCP compatible stack.

MorphOS supports dynamic linking (so called shared objects in Os4) since day one but it is not recommended because shared libraries are available.

Dunno what you need with composition or dockies. In my opinion it is better start with new clean port. Old source cide can be used for ideas or rewritten to common Amiga API.

Last edited by itix on 29-Jan-2015 at 12:40 PM.
Last edited by itix on 29-Jan-2015 at 12:27 PM.
Last edited by itix on 29-Jan-2015 at 12:26 PM.
Last edited by itix on 29-Jan-2015 at 12:25 PM.
Last edited by itix on 29-Jan-2015 at 12:23 PM.
Last edited by itix on 29-Jan-2015 at 12:21 PM.

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@phoenixkonsole

please stay politely

@OlafS25
Why?" I should use my adult brain."

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@itix

In my experience, dynload.library doesn't always play nice with C++ code. I'd rather have some kind of automatism to generate the shared library skeleton with all the mangled function names, plus the glue for the programs.

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@phoenixkonsole

Samo and others can use what they want

You and me have decided differently so it is how it is

Bash each other on public forum does not change anything so just ignore him

@Samo

Bszili is both intelligent and can do his own decisions. He has explained why he decided and what are the technical reasons for it and why it is not possible to merge the Qt 4.7 AmigaOS sources with future new Qt 5 AROS/MorphOS sources. Arguing about it and saying Bszili is wrong would sound a little strange to me. Both projects will benefit from each other so either Alfakil might use the Qt 5 for AmigaOS or Bszili adds AmigaOS sometime in the future.

@BSzili

With C++ you are stuck to certain compilers/compiler versions. But maybe it is ok.

In MorphOS we have tools in SDK to create glue code automatically but something need to be developed to collect mangled names automatically. Maybe objdump and Perl script?

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@itix

You can list the symbols of an object or a static library using nm, but it has to be filtered afterwards to remove static, undefined, ctor/dtor functions among other things. This can probably be done using a simple shell script. There's also the problem of keeping the LVOs the same, so the static glue of old programs won't break when Qt gets updated, and a new function appears.

edit: A quick and dirty solution using nm:
Quote:

nm -f posix $1 | grep " T " | cut -d' ' -f1

I'm no shell script wizard, but it does the job.

Last edited by BSzili on 29-Jan-2015 at 06:46 PM.

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@alfakil

It's actually no big deal to port your version over to MorphOS. A year ago or so, me and cyfm spent a few evenings playing around with it just out of curiosity.

Basically, the demos in the Qt tree were running just fine with just a few smaller things left to implement when we lost interest. As this was just a test run, we kept all executables statically linked. Shared objects are anyhow not an ideal solution so one would have to think of something better to take Qt to the next level.

And just to clarify, we were of course never considering making Qt part of MorphOS. It was just a quick test for the fun of it (a bit like running an emulator or so). For practical purposes, I don't think Qt brings much benefit to our platforms.

If BSzili or someone else wants to work on this stuff, I could share the source tree (although I agree that it might not be so useful for a clean start on Qt5). I wouldn't want to release this more widely before it's in a more polished state.

Last edited by Nicho on 29-Jan-2015 at 02:50 PM.

Quote:

well, if supporting amiga, aros, morphos and os4 by one developer is technically so easy and beneficent, then i wonder why it has not happened before when qt has been ported to os4. whatever the answer, it was the developers decision at that time as it is now. previously this question might have not even been asked, at least this time the motives have been explained and, who would have thought, it has nothing to do with emotions or policy.

I was a very unexperienced developer back then, and just getting to know one system was enough, parred with the fact that I was mainly interested in what was in front of me and did't go into platform politics or colorful searches for other meaningful software bases. Well, I guess I am still sort of that way.

@Nicho

Interresting. I am glad to hear. That means, among other things, that my code is understandable and unmangled to a degree, where it is usable for others (be it persons or platforms).

My comment on Qt5 ports: Would be nice to share code. Using Qt4 code does not make sense, since there whole structure of the code has changed dramatically. But snippets and techniques from learned experiences might be able to transfer. I'd like to give a hand to any project concerning Qt5, although, as stated elsewhere, I am currently not in a position to take active part in codewriting since my external memory is placed in another country. Good luck!

@alfkil

Quote:

alfkil wrote: Quote: well, if supporting amiga, aros, morphos and os4 by one developer is technically so easy and beneficent, then i wonder why it has not happened before when qt has been ported to os4. whatever the answer, it was the developers decision at that time as it is now. previously this question might have not even been asked, at least this time the motives have been explained and, who would have thought, it has nothing to do with emotions or policy. I was a very unexperienced developer back then, and just getting to know one system was enough, parred with the fact that I was mainly interested in what was in front of me and did't go into platform politics or colorful searches for other meaningful software bases. Well, I guess I am still sort of that way.

nothing wrong with that (in any direction) imho.
didn't we have this discussion just last... a couple of years ago... the outcome of which was basically that it would take forever to support/test/bugfix all systems.
for this kind of project, port & share sources/collaborate seems to be the sweet spot where all platforms have (potential) support, and yet software still gets released in a reasonable timescale.

also, aren't devs allowed to, you know, have fun and stuff, without that obliging several months of dull bugfixing/adaptation for other systems the dev may not be interested in?

jeez guys, chillax.

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