@samface

I admit, i'm misinformed. Do you think that is possible to give a second chance to BBRV?

Last edited by AmigaBlitter on 08-May-2006 at 02:35 PM.

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retired

I think Genesi should go to court and finaly get what they have contract for. It it would mean the end of everything, then be it. I can't stand the current situation any longer. However, there's also hope that the situation will improve after that...

@bbrv

Quote:

Please do not clutter this thread with anything but constructive suggestions Sammy. The community has no time for that.

Please do not clutter this thread with public stunts and empty phrases. The community has no use for that.

BTW licensing your HW with Amiga Inc would give us Genesi HW bundled with OS4, that would be constructive. I surely woud buy that.

Last edited by Giovanni on 08-May-2006 at 03:05 PM.
Last edited by Giovanni on 08-May-2006 at 03:03 PM.

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www.amiga4ever.de

@samface

Quote:

the backstabbing company that tried to take over the rights to the entire AmigaOS product line through a lawsuit using an old license agreement for the AmigaDE that was originally issued to one of their former business ventures in Germany called "Thendic"

"Backstabbing"? It was Amiga, Inc. that failed to abide by its contract, remember, not Genesi. This was verified by the court. Yes, Genesi was opportunistic in requesting that the court's decision be extended to AmigaOS, but the judge denied the request. Case closed. As for your "old ... agreement ... originally issued...to Thendic" comment, it was no problem to the court that Genesi continued in place of Thendic as the principal parties were the same. It seems this is an issue only for you. I think most of us will go along with the judge's interpretation as the common sense one.

Quote:

All I'm trying to say here is that there is nothing that they could possibly say or do to earn back the trust of any Amiga company again.

Fine, that's your opinion. I wouldn't try to talk you out of it.

Quote:

You won't see Amiga Inc., Hyperion nor any other Amiga related company signing any agreements with Genesi, especially not license agreements, ever.

Which would very much be their loss. As BBRV pointed out, Genesi's actual customers have no complaints about the quality of products and support. Genesi has been very generous with product replacement, upgrades, and so on, and continues to make progress as a business (in contrast to...). Partners in Power.org don't seem to have any reservations about Genesi's integrity.

Personally, I don't expect Amiga, Inc. to be signing any agreements with any company for AmigaOS in desktop computers, unfortunately. Ironically, an agreement with Genesi, of all companies, is one that would make very good sense in terms of product match. But as we have seen, Amiga Inc. is not licensing hardware for its OS at all -- so Genesi's interest is apparently a moot point.

For that reason, I don't know why BBRV keep making approaches to the "Amiga market." Beyond its general comatose state, Amiga, Inc. is antagonistic toward Genesi and there are enough antagonistic end-users such as yourself to make these approaches a thoroughly unpleasant event. Just keep in mind whose loss it is if the Amiga, Inc.-endorsed status quo continues.

-- gary_c

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zukakakina.com - themes.tikiwiki.org

From BBRV's blog that he linked to in this thread:
Quote:

We have had over 1500 individual IP addresses visit yesterday's blog in less than twelve hours.

At least this gives us some kind of idea of how many people are interested in hardware for OS4. This is over 12 hours so there could be more. There is a small but guaranteed demand here (assuming you don't price yourself out of the market).

Hans

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http://hdrlab.org.nz/ - Amiga OS 4 projects, programming articles and more. Home of the RadeonHD driver for Amiga OS 4.x project.
https://keasigmadelta.com/ - More of my work.

@gary_c

Quote:

But as we have seen, Amiga Inc. is not licensing hardware for its OS at all

So you are sure Troika or anyone else havent got a license ?.

Quote:

For that reason, I don't know why BBRV keep making approaches to the "Amiga market."

Because he needs OS 4 for his hardware, to gain an edge noone else have.

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@Hans

Quote:

At least this gives us some kind of idea of how many people are interested in hardware for OS4. This is over 12 hours so there could be more. There is a small but guaranteed demand here (assuming you don't price yourself out of the market).

Ehm no, one of them is me and i dont want any Peg HW, i would rather buy a used A1.

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@SlayeR__

I'm not suggesting that 1500 people would go out and buy peg HW. I mean interest in new hardware that runs OS4 in general. Nor would I say that you could be guaranteed 1500 sales of non peg HW if it ran OS4. However, 1500 unique IP addresses visiting a blog within 12 hours does say something.

Hans

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http://hdrlab.org.nz/ - Amiga OS 4 projects, programming articles and more. Home of the RadeonHD driver for Amiga OS 4.x project.
https://keasigmadelta.com/ - More of my work.

@Hans

Quote:

1500 unique IP addresses visiting a blog within 12 hours does say something.

Yes it says that at least 1500 people looked at the blog, says nothing about interest in HW.

Last edited by SlayeR__ on 08-May-2006 at 04:41 PM.

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@Hans

As far as I understand this blog ...

Quote:
If we were you, we would forget the brand and start thinking about the experience.


... everybody should use MOS in the future instead of using Amiga OS.


It's becoming a little bit boring to see how bbrv is trying again and again to get the market share of the Amiga OS comunity. As it seems to be clear also to them, that it is not the comunity to decide about the license, he's now trying to make everybody using MOS (??)

Let me know what you think.

naz

Whether it does or doesn't, I don't see this level of engagement with Hyperion. Were are the development blogs I can read, were are the annoucements other than AOS4 updates?

At least Genesi gets out there, stir up interest and market themselves a product.

Last edited by wonea on 08-May-2006 at 04:46 PM.

@Naz

Quote:

he's now trying to make everybody using MOS (??)

Nah i think he wants OS 4.

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@samface
Quote:

All I'm trying to say here is that there is nothing that they could possibly say or do to earn back the trust of any Amiga company again. You won't see Amiga Inc., Hyperion nor any other Amiga related company signing any agreements with Genesi, especially not license agreements, ever.

I disagree. I think Genesi could become a productive partner and we could have OS4 on their hardware platforms. Trust has been destroyed and there are certainly hurt feelings on both sides but there could still be a small business rebuilt. I don't think anyone knows how large such a business could be but it seems those in charge would still like to give it a try and see where it goes.

But alas all that seems to happen is yet more public web forum chatter versus serious discussions at the negotiating table. Just once I'd like to get a hint from bbrv that they themselves (i.e. not some lackey) have approached Hyperion and Amiga Inc. and are attempting to negotiate a mutually beneficial agreement. Instead, all we see are public web forum postings and blogs.

You could argue that perhaps an offer should come from the other side of the table. That could happen but as has been repeatably pointed out, Genesi won the infamous court case and are shipping hardware and are in pretty good shape. One would think the winner would have the strength and humility to offer the olive branch.

Instead of moving forward, it seems we are doomed to eternal debate in obscure web forums instead. The latest scheme seems to be hints of so-called freedom and the like. Sad yet kinda fun in a sado-masochistic sorta way.

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ExecSG Team Lead

@wonea

Different business plans different ways to run a business.

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@Naz

It sounds to me that he wants to sell hardware to whoever will buy it. The small OS4 community would expand the market a little. The more OSes that are supported, the better chances are that there will be a longer-term market for his hardware.

Hans

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http://hdrlab.org.nz/ - Amiga OS 4 projects, programming articles and more. Home of the RadeonHD driver for Amiga OS 4.x project.
https://keasigmadelta.com/ - More of my work.

@samface

Quote:

"BBRV" are represantatives of Genesi, the backstabbing company that tried to take over the rights to the entire AmigaOS product line through a lawsuit using an old license agreement for the AmigaDE

Yeah! And what we now know is that we would all be better off if they had succeeded!

We know we would have been better off if they had bought Amiga post Escom.

We know we would have been better off if they had bought Amiga post Gateway (Who would have known that Bill and Fleecy - founding members of the Phoenix consortium would have cynically used the Amiga community to leverage an irelevant VC deal for AA/DE).

@wonea

Quote:

I don't see this level of engagement with Hyperion.

Beg your pardon? I have about 2500 posts done here since 2003. I don't write blogs because I don't need any sort of self-portayal, but most of the time I prefer to work instead of writing articles.

Quote:

Were are the development blogs I can read, were are the annoucements other than AOS4 updates?

What else would you like to hear? Hyperion is a software company, with a current focus on AmigaOS 4. Hardware related news is not ours to report. We're regularily releasing updates for OS 4, which is more than you can say about MorphOS.

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Seriously, if you want to contact me do not bother sending me a PM here. Write me a mail

@Colin_Camper

Quote:

Yeah! And what we now know is that we would all be better off if they had succeeded!

We do?, it might have been better but i see no guarantee of that.

Quote:

We know we would have been better off if they had bought Amiga post Escom.

They tried, but i guess Gateway overbid them.

Quote:

We know we would have been better off if they had bought Amiga post Gateway (Who would have known that Bill and Fleecy - founding members of the Phoenix consortium would have cynically used the Amiga community to leverage an irelevant VC deal for AA/DE).

And who made the relevant licenses to Eyetech and Hyperion.

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@SlayeR__

Quote:

Nah i think he wants OS 4.


... but he's calling the comunity. What I mean is that it is not the comunity to decide about the license (and the possibility to get OS4).

@Rogue

Sorry, excuse my brash words. I was trying to say I see from looking outside, of myself who uses AROS from time to time, and lurks on forums alot.