@ChrisH

Quote:

ChrisH wrote: @linnar Why are you so against Hyperion?.

Because Hyperion try to steal the OS.

If may friend repair my car ad after he don't
giv it back. I don't like that.

Amiga Inc all step before this is never mind.
The step now and in the nearly future is the important.

Amiga Inc is going to turning!

Don't forget that all company's turning's more than one time
in the life.

I think Amiga Inc lost money and to make new money the move
focus on other thing. But the don't forget the root's and now
the have money again and turning focus to the root's.

(I hope You understand my very bad Eng. )

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I hope kirka & others have wrote down the serial numbers of their boards.
would be the first thing I would check, should the boards really get back to
their owners..

@linnar

Quote:

If may friend repair my car ad after he don't giv it back. I don't like that.

But ACK -who has done exactly that- get's your support, right? Why the double standards?

Quote:

I think Amiga Inc lost money and to make new money the move focus on other thing.

Make new money by expensive lawsuits that cost more than they can probably ever gain through selling OS4 to a tiny bunch of hardcore fanatics? Right...

Quote:

But the don't forget the root's and now the have money again and turning focus to the root's.

"Focus to the roots" as in investing millions (yet to be seen) in naming rights for an event center? And who is "they"? Believe me, investors like Kouri give sh*t about things like the "Amiga roots".

@linnar who said Quote:

Because Hyperion try to steal the OS.

I think you'll find that a lot of people disagree with such a crude & simplistic summary of the situation. The reality is that both Amiga Inc (#1) & Hyperion entered into this in good faith, they both signed a bad contract, they both made mistakes that cost OS4's development time, they both ran low on cash, they both made some bad decisions, and now they both make underhand legal manouvers for full control of OS4.

And really, I don't care *who* kicked sand in the other's face first. What I do care about is the future of OS4. And IMHO, on know facts, there is more uncertainty about OS4 if Amiga Inc wins (*), so I prefer Hyperion. That doesn't mean I think Amiga Inc are evil !


(* = Amiga Inc #1 (RIP) was always keen on AmigaDE/AmigaAnywhere, and got rid of AmigaOS as fast as it could. In 2003 they sold all rights to Itec, and then KMOS, who changed their name to Amiga Inc (#2). And their their actions seem to show more interest in OS4. But the same people are running both Amiga Inc #1 & #2, so who knows? By contrast, Hyperion has always been interested in OS4.)

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Sigh, what a mess overall (outside ACK as well)... wake me up when there are sub-$500 ACK boards to order by September 15th.

Last edited by jtsiren on 08-Jul-2007 at 10:10 PM.

@ChrisH

Quote:

ChrisH wrote: @linnar Why are you so against Hyperion? They are the one who wanted OS4 to continue, they are the one who has developed it so far. How could them controlling OS4, and licensing it to ACube/etc be bad? OTOH, what Amiga Inc wants for OS4 is unknown. It looks like they *may* want it as an 'mini laptop' (think Nokia N800). The current deal with ACK seems like a last-minute thing, to make them look better to the courts - maybe they are serious about the desktop market, but who knows? Frankly both Amiga Inc's & ACK's past history does not inspire confidence, whatever their plans. Overall, I'd prefer Hyperion to win, since they seem the better bet. If Amiga Inc win, it may be good, or it may be bad, and I'd prefer not to risk finding that out.

Not that I am a fan of AInc considering the history I find this Ben Hermans quote apt:
"Besides, if you paid 5 million dollars for something, would you accept other people running off with your IP without putting up a fight? "

@ChrisH

OK, I speculate like many other.
But the most important for me and maybe other is that
the name of OS4 must have forename "AMIGA".
It's not god for the market if Hyperion take over the name "Amiga" in the cort.

The computer:
-With the name "Hyperioan OS 4,0" can't sell to the World market and I don't own one with this name.
-With the name "Amiga OS 4,0" come to sell much mor computers and I buy one.

And the computer must be a real complet computer with Amiga-like-design.
ACK (Adam) say it's the only way for him.

All other "computer" is a motherboards. Amiga with only a motherboard is not
Amiga. It's maybe a part of Amiga.

The best, morally, for us all is if one of them by the other!
Hyperion and Amiga is a very strong part together, Bill McEwen own the Amiga
history and Hyperion build the best OS in the World.


stew:
God post!

Last edited by linnar on 08-Jul-2007 at 10:39 PM.

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@linnar

Quote:

The computer: -With the name "Hyperioan OS 4,0" can't sell to the World market and I don't own one with this name. -With the name "Amiga OS 4,0" come to sell much mor computers and I buy one.

If Hyperion win the case to carry on development and distribution of OS4 they will also win the right to use the word Amiga in conjunction with that product, it's all in the clause they claim self executed.

Quote:

And the computer must be a real complet computer with Amiga-like-design. ACK (Adam) say it's the only way for him.

It still uses off the shelf parts, so what makes it different to say SAM440, Efika or someone else's product marketed under the name.

Quote:

The best, morally, for us all is if one of them by the other! Hyperion and Amiga is a very strong part together, Bill McEwen own the Amiga history and Hyperion build the best OS in the World.

I don't think Bill and Fleecy's Amiga Inc is the right company to take OS4 forward. In their initial filing against Hyperion they state that "Development of OS 4.0 was, and remains, critical to Amiga's plans and it re-emergence as a major force in the computer industry."

With the announcement of these system from ACK, Amiga is marketing Amiga OS as a desktop OS. If they are to move forward in this direction, they need to get basic applications such as a web browser and office suite available for OS4.

They have had developer level access to OS4.0 since the same time that everyone else, there has been nothing to stop them from starting work on software since that time and the present day. There are several Amiga applications such as Digita's Wordworth and Aladin 4D that they could buy off the shelf for not large an amount of money and they were given the sources of Personal Paint from Cloanto.

Nothing has been announced and nothing has been made with regard to Amiga software from Amiga Inc, they cannot survive on software and hardware licenses alone. They need to invest heavily in application development if they are to make it today.

@jtsiren

Quote:

I think this thread already achieved one goal when ACK chose to reply here.

They are merely words; talk is cheap as they say.

Let's see some real action - how long does it take a board to get shipped ? Say Ack ships them at the end of the week then 2 weeks should be sufficient to see 2 of the 3 users posting that they have received them. They should at least receive tracking information by early next week.

Why it took Ack so long to deal with their boards is another matter. I notice some people were discussing avenues for legal redress. Is it the threat of legal action that prompted Ack to do something ?

@hatschi

Quote:

hatschi wrote: @herewegoagain Of course I was talking about the Amiga community as perceived from this website, e.g. in polls or in forum discussions. It was in response to linnar, who said that "**we** wait Amiga Inc win in the court!" This gave the impression that most, if not all, people would support Amiga Inc in the lawsuit, although this is simply not the case. However I do think that the general opinion is not much different outside of this community, so maybe it's even representative.

Ah, so just a bit over 11% of the users here side with Hyperion, and you call that the majority of the community? That's odd, because by my count, that leaves about 89% listed in "some other category". However, that is just my opinion, and it is no more correct than your "majority" theory.

I would be willing to bet that if they didn't care enough to vote in that poll, they probably don't care which side wins. This is sort of like the Red/Blue wars. Not everyone had a side, and most didn't want a side, just end user products. There were a vocal MINORITY on both sides who caused all of the public wars.

@Rob

Quote:

If Hyperion win the case to carry on development and distribution of OS4 they will also win the right to use the word Amiga in conjunction with that product

...and it will still be AmigaOS 4.0. Where is the future for Hyperion's OS ? They will only be able to call it Amiga OS 4. As they improve it, maybe they can call it OS 4 with a version number or a codename (How about naming it after big cats ? - there's a novel thought). Unless they purchase the trademark of Amiga, they will never be able to call a version "OS 5".

OS4 has too many restrictions - if Hyperion win the court case then they are allowed to sell it to people with A1s, uA1s and Classic PPC - hardly a big market. MorphOS is available for Pegasos and Classic PPC and soon EFIKA but MOS team are not interested in porting to A1 etc because 1. They don't have a test machine and 2. Market is too small.

For the software side of things, maybe Hyperion can soldier on with future variants of OS4 but unless they get licences for new hardware I don't think it's financially viable.

Quote:

It still uses off the shelf parts, so what makes it different to say SAM440, Efika

Amiga One and microA1 were reference designs. Ack's "hardware" is a modified reference design. SAM440 and EFIKA are System on Chip boards. There is nothing new here. These so-called hardware manufacturers are nothing but box merchants, flogging the hardware equivalent of Hello World to suckers like us. I have no problem with that for SAM and EFIKA, especially at less than $100, but it's not a future for our community, just a temporary measure.

Quote:

they cannot survive on software and hardware licenses alone

They are a software company that has none of their own software and no hardware to run it on.

Last edited by koan on 09-Jul-2007 at 03:52 AM.
Last edited by koan on 09-Jul-2007 at 03:52 AM.

@koan

Quote:

They are merely words; talk is cheap as they say.

Agreed, of course. Each person waiting for their board had already received, according to them, numerous promises before - I know this.

But I personally promised to give ACK a chance should they come out and post here a status update, so I'm waiting with an open mind for them to deliver this time. At least the time scale in this case is quite small - we'll see soon enough if there are results.

@herewegoagain

, The results on that poll (in quote with link) state a 70% in favor of Hyperion, and the remaining 30% for Amiga.
Perhaps you are refferring to another poll. Well possible, cause had so many of them in the past.

@Pyramider

Quote:

Pyramider wrote: @herewegoagain , The results on that poll (in quote with link) state a 70% in favor of Hyperion, and the remaining 30% for Amiga. Perhaps you are refferring to another poll. Well possible, cause had so many of them in the past.

His remark ("11% of the users here side with Hyperion") is based on the belief that only those voted who either side with Hyperion or AI and *all* who didn't vote don't care about who "wins". OTOH, my theory is based upon the belief that the poll results are indicative of the general opinion among the AW.net members and that there is only a small number of people who don't care who will first "win" or go bancrupt.
Nobody is right or wrong in this case, we would have to ask *every* AW.net member to figure that out.

@Rob

Quote:

Rob wrote: I don't think Bill and Fleecy's Amiga Inc is the right company to take OS4 forward. In their initial filing against Hyperion they state that "Development of OS 4.0 was, and remains, critical to Amiga's plans and it re-emergence as a major force in the computer industry."

But AI can't develope OS 4 to make OS 5 (or whatever) because Hyperion hasn't turned over a copy of the code, binaries and a copy of the contracts with 3rd party developers as per a contract that they signed.

Quote:

With the announcement of these system from ACK, Amiga is marketing Amiga OS as a desktop OS. If they are to move forward in this direction, they need to get basic applications such as a web browser and office suite available for OS4.

And they may have developed some, but for OS 5 not OS 4. They planned, by the contract, to take the OS and go their own direction, and Hyperion run OS 4. That arrangement has been cancelled officially by AI and by actions of Hyperion. They said that they have been working for 2 years on software as OS 4 progressed. A lie? Maybe. But unless they get a copy of OS 4, the building block for OS 5 (or whatever) we will never know.

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@Rob

Quote:

If Hyperion win the case to carry on development and distribution of OS4 they will also win the right to use the word Amiga in conjunction with that product, it's all in the clause they claim self executed.

Sorry, but Hyperion don't win!

Quote:

It still uses off the shelf parts, so what makes it different to say SAM440, Efika or someone else's product marketed under the name.

If my mother by a computer and with the post it's come a motherboard ??!!!
It's not a computer, it's only a part she can do nothing with. For the market
out ther You MUST have a real computer with OS installed.
Amiga can't survive in the mikro-antiamiga-community-market. They most out in the World with realy complet computer.
ACK have a realy complet computer on way and I hope that design is like the old good
Amiga.
And don't say ACK is a liar, giv him a chans!!


Quote:

/.../ nothing has been made with regard to Amiga software from Amiga Inc, /.../

And that do You now?
Do You now any more wath happening inside Amiga Inc?

Quote:

They need to invest heavily in application development if they are to make it today.

Yes!
But,
Do You now that to?


To many in this self-experted-forum now to much! Funny...

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Program, codes for websites, hifi, measuring instruments and more. The site is of more than 1200 pages and nearly 3Gb .

@linnar

Quote:

And that do You now? Do You now any more wath happening inside Amiga Inc?

This should give you an indication:

Quote:

A visit to Amiga's Issaquah offices last week found just McEwen and one other employee in a suite of offices strewn with cardboard boxes and old computers.

@hatschi

Quote:

This should give you an indication:

And what? I can't se anything what happening on inside Amiga Inc. in the article !?


Quote:

A visit to Amiga's Issaquah offices last week found just McEwen and one other employee in a suite of offices strewn with cardboard boxes and old computers.

I have se pic's from many other software and hardware offices.......

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@wolfe

Quote:

But AI can't develope OS 4 to make OS 5 (or whatever) because Hyperion hasn't turned over a copy of the code, binaries...

At one time, AI said that OS 5 was totally new and not dependent on OS 4. Now they are saying that OS 5 is totally dependent on OS 4.

But, how can you be working "for 2 years" on software that is totally dependent on something you don't have ?

@linnar

Quote:

linnar wrote: @Rob Sorry, but Hyperion don't win!

lol, I like your style!

How you can be so sure about the outcome of the trial?

Hmm, lately too many people foresee the future!

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