@thread

I don't know if it's been mentioned, but GIMP is 16-bit instead of 24-bit or 32-bit. I don't want my photos converted to 16-bits.

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@Manu

Quote:

I used gimp for most of my artwork (shameless advertising)

Wow. Great art work! You are very good!

Scott

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@KimmoK

[quote] Some 15 years ago I managed to do simple video clip with DPaint on my A4000 in far less than 5 minutes from power up. Very fast and powerfull after I've learnt it./quote]

I agree. I don't know exactly what it was about Deluxe Paint..but it was so easy to learn and to use compared to any other paint program I have tried...animations, anim brushes, all the paint tools...simple and elegant.

If we could even get the origianl DPaint 5 source and just update it to work on OS4.1, then get it to work with 16 bit and 32 bit....that would be so awesome. Open Source...slight improvements over the original..just like what they did with Dopus5.

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@thinkchip

Quote:

I don't know if it's been mentioned, but GIMP is 16-bit instead of 24-bit or 32-bit. I don't want my photos converted to 16-bits.

Rubbish. Ofcousre it works in 32bit, the later versions I think are even moving toward 16bit per channel (perhaps that's what confused you?) That's effective 64Bit

BTW SketchBlock is using 32bit float per channel, internally.

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@Raffaele

Quote:

Well at this point why don't we ask Pavel Kanzelsberger who made Pixel 32 Pixel Image Editor HDR Paint program how much does he want to release open source his MorphOS version and start a bounty? Then we could hire Nuts with another bounty to make the AmigaOs porting of Pixel32 then

SketchBlock does HDR (32 bit float per channel) It can only import and export 32bit formats at the moment but if there was a strong demand for true HDR output it can be added (I already ported a HDR image viewer, it's on OS4depot)

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@scabit

Nice when can you have it done

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@Raffaele

Your point is the port of a closed source paint program that doesn't support modern GFX hardware and has nothing that would work on a modern AmigaOID system except the menus ...

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AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

@Arko

Without sourcecodes of DPaint we could not discover why its graphical routines were so smooth so then it could be replicated on a new modern paint gfx program..
And we will continue porting uselessly any kind of alien software that too much often (despite the fact it supports number "n" millions colors) is still not usable at the levels of such a simple design-made 262144 colors max software as D-Paint.

Again major part of amigans are pointing to external resources/alien software because we are uncapable to apprecciate the strong points we have/had and to replicate strong features of old good software by enhancing existing sourcecode.

What has being made with DirOpus is an example of virtuous opensourcing and development of an existing good Amiga software that deserves to be replicated again, and DPaint is one of the major target for replicating same DirOpus experience.

Last edited by Raffaele on 29-Mar-2014 at 08:57 AM.

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"When the Amiga came out, everyone [at Apple] was scared as hell." (J.L. Gassée, former CEO of Apple France and chief of devs of Mac II-fx, interviewed by Amazing Computing, Nov 1996).

@Raffaele

Quote:

Raffaele wrote: @Arko Without sourcecodes of DPaint we could not discover why its graphical routines were so smooth ...

Maybe my understanding of 'smooth' is different from yours. IMR there was nothing smooth when using a palette.

Quote:

Raffaele wrote: @Arko What has being made with DirOpus is an example of virtuous opensourcing ...

I have supported a lot of Open Source projects but never something as useless as DirOpus and I would never support a similar action for DPaint.

Last edited by Arko on 29-Mar-2014 at 01:20 PM.

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AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

@Arko

A lot of people are productive with DPaint and think Gimp/Photoshop are counterproductive with their relatively clunky U.I. (plus those programmes don't do animation). You're entitled to your opinion but having an open source version of DPaint on OS4.x can only strengthen the platform!

Last edited by BigD on 29-Mar-2014 at 02:24 PM.

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John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios

@Raffaele

Quote:

Without sourcecodes of DPaint we could not discover why its graphical routines were so smooth so then it could be replicated on a new modern paint gfx program..

It use hardware blitter, and some 680x0 assembler optimized code, In any case it want be portable, the code has to be replaced.

You can get Dpaint working whit some hardware emulation.

http://www.os4depot.net/index.php?function=showfile&file=emulation/misc/blitzen.lha

Quote:

And we will continue porting uselessly any kind of alien software that too much often (despite the fact it supports number "n" millions colors) is still not usable at the levels of such a simple design-made 262144 colors max software as D-Paint.

Its is true, part of way ports are being done is that its quick solution, in most cases, but only if every thing is supported.

It just like whit all games SpotUP was porting, as soon as there where no more SDL games to port the games stoped coming.

But does not give it the Amiga spirit, for Amiga program to have the Amiga spirit it needs to be designed for AmigaOS and the hardware it runs on, the UI design need to simple easy to understand and use, low learning curve, It should be easy to read and see what etch symbol is, and where there is text it should be readable.

Taking short cuts is not always the best thing.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 29-Mar-2014 at 02:35 PM.
Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 29-Mar-2014 at 02:29 PM.

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@Arko

Quote:

Arko wrote: @Raffaele Quote: Raffaele wrote: @Arko Without sourcecodes of DPaint we could not discover why its graphical routines were so smooth ... Maybe my understanding of 'smooth' is different from yours. IMR there was nothing smooth when using a palette.

Smooth paint in my poor english is for me any software that allow me drawing bitmap curved lines with mouse and it responds with a correct behaviour without starting drawing the bitmapped curve starting doing big "L" forms of pixels missing the actual graphic resolution and the curve I desired to draw.

Dpaint rarely missed the curve at lower 320*256 or higher resolutions, even if I used crappy mouse devices or those which had really dirty balls...

That is enough to say how good smooth and soft it reacted...

Quote:

Quote: Raffaele wrote: @Arko What has being made with DirOpus is an example of virtuous opensourcing ... I have supported a lot of Open Source projects but never something as useless as DirOpus and I would never support a similar action for DPaint.

I am not a lover of DirOpus too as I lost myself in all Diropus features but I have seen Diropus at its best used by a Pro like professor Morbius Peruggi, and I was impressed so many huge number of data files were modified, checksumed, changed of attributes and copied respectively at various directories locations in just a few seconds with a touch of two or three buttons, so despite I am not good with DirOpus because I am a real stupid dumbass, I sure have enough brain to have a great respect for such a powerful program, for its coders and for those who are capable to manage it.

Last edited by Raffaele on 29-Mar-2014 at 04:39 PM.
Last edited by Raffaele on 29-Mar-2014 at 04:28 PM.
Last edited by Raffaele on 29-Mar-2014 at 04:26 PM.

_________________
"When the Amiga came out, everyone [at Apple] was scared as hell." (J.L. Gassée, former CEO of Apple France and chief of devs of Mac II-fx, interviewed by Amazing Computing, Nov 1996).

@Raffaele

Quote:

Raffaele wrote: Without sourcecodes of DPaint we could not discover why its graphical routines were so smooth so then it could be replicated on a new modern paint gfx program..

Firstly, it all definitely wasn't quite as smooth as you're trying to claim it to be. Often when playing old games years later, I find myself thinking "I thought this was smoother than this..." - apparently the same can be true for programs too

But anyway, it was far from "total disaster". Why? It was at least somewhat optimized for the specific hardware (hardware blitter, planar graphics, 68k processor, HAM graphics modes) and guess what? What I assume you think as target platform (PPC) has none of those! So full rewrite it will be...

(If we got DOS version sources instead, it would at least support chunky graphics out of the box, but would still be mostly useless)

Quote:

Again major part of amigans are pointing to external resources/alien software because we are uncapable to apprecciate the strong points we have/had and to replicate strong features of old good software by enhancing existing sourcecode.

Have you even considered the totally unthinkable option, that most people understand that the sources would be practically useless for any new development?

note: This is absolutely true for MS-DOS, Microsoft Word and Adobe Photoshop sources (all of which are released) aswell, but instead they have historical value, which useless DPaint sources would also have.

Quote:

What has being made with DirOpus is an example of virtuous opensourcing and development of an existing good Amiga software that deserves to be replicated again, and DPaint is one of the major target for replicating same DirOpus experience.

There are major differences between those two:

-Directory Opus sources were known to be portable, and lacking any big hardware dependencies

-Existing 68k versions of Directory Opus already worked (mostly) problem-free on "NG hardware" (proving previous point)

-DOpus was (afaik?) mostly "single man project". We probably did make a difference for him, but we could never collect enough money to make "monetary difference" to Electronic Arts.

-For Directory Opus, there weren't any projects that "already do the same thing, just better" (unlike there are for gfx programs). Sure, MorphOS ambient is very capable, but lacks some features (but also has some extras) but OS4 and AROS desktops are clearly inferior.

Why not just use Grafx2? It's definitely inspired by Deluxe Paint. Sure, it might look a bit "alien" as it doesn't use "native" file requesters, but hey, neither did (most versions of) Deluxe Paint!

The only "downside" I can think of, is that you could "just use it already and stop complaining"

Last edited by Jupp3 on 29-Mar-2014 at 04:59 PM.
Last edited by Jupp3 on 29-Mar-2014 at 04:56 PM.

@Jupp3

If you make Grafx2 run without crashes all along, more people might use it

@all:

I saw an early version of a DPaint remake, made using Hollywood. There is still some work to do, but it looked quite promising. Maybe it will see the light of day this year...

After all, it would be a much wiser idea to do a remake, no "port".

@Thread

In the meanwhile I sended a request to Computer History Museum asking them if they could request to Electronic Arts the source code of versions 1.0, 2.0 and 3.0 of De Luxe Paint (the original ones made by Dan Silva) for historical purposes.

if we want something, we must start from a single little step.

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"When the Amiga came out, everyone [at Apple] was scared as hell." (J.L. Gassée, former CEO of Apple France and chief of devs of Mac II-fx, interviewed by Amazing Computing, Nov 1996).

I think I should just start learning grafx2 for pixel painting or just use Dpaint + anim tools via UAE/real68k.

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@Raffaele

There is one problem whit the history Museum License, there license states that they own any changes you make, basically they can sell your product, but you can't. You can never take money for it, and so you can never call it your own, It will end up as hobby project, where some one does some thing if they feel like it or not at all.

Last edited by NutsAboutAmiga on 29-Mar-2014 at 08:13 PM.

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@NutsAboutAmiga

Quote:

NutsAboutAmiga wrote: @Raffaele There is one problem whit the history Museum License, there license states that they own any changes you make, basically they can sell your product, but you can't. You can never take money for it, and so you can never call it your own, It will end up as hobby project, where some one does some thing if they feel like it or not at all.

Once we have learned the sourcecode, then a good amiga programmer could made the same thing by using a different code and avoid any licence...
That is how it works many programs and drivers in Linux, that are made reverse engineering windows ones, is n't it?

Last edited by Raffaele on 29-Mar-2014 at 08:53 PM.

_________________
"When the Amiga came out, everyone [at Apple] was scared as hell." (J.L. Gassée, former CEO of Apple France and chief of devs of Mac II-fx, interviewed by Amazing Computing, Nov 1996).

@Raffaele

Quote:

Smooth paint in my poor english is for me any software that allow me drawing bitmap curved lines with mouse and it responds with a correct behaviour without starting drawing the bitmapped curve starting doing big "L" forms of pixels missing the actual graphic resolution and the curve I desired to draw.

I never saw a program that failed painting a simple curved line, following the mouse when you used the right painting algorithm. Even stupid windows paint did this.

Modern paint programs are doing anti-aliasing on 24/32 bit screens with variable pen sizes, something PPaint never could. You should come of with something more unique.

Just look into some tutorials on Youtube they show how people are using modern programs today, the way they paint pictures is advanced over most things that where possible with PPaint.

Last edited by Arko on 29-Mar-2014 at 10:18 PM.

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AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

@Arko

Quote:

Just look into some tutorials on Youtube they show how people are using modern programs today, the way they paint pictures is advanced over most things that where possible with PPaint.

Just because a few egg heads have made it there life's obsession to get good at Photoshop does not make it a more intuitive program for the masses. DPaint (I couldn't give two figs for PPaint) made it easy to generate simple shapes and made freehand drawing and animation a joy to learn and create. That is not true of Photoshop for the vast majority of computer users.

Last edited by BigD on 29-Mar-2014 at 11:28 PM.

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"Art challenges technology. Technology inspires the art."
John Lasseter, Co-Founder of Pixar Animation Studios