@Lou

Quote:

The PS3 is $445 USD in Japan. Guess who's eating that difference?

Ahh they're not selling many so therefore the loss is indeed small enough that they can comfortably eat it. Had the PS3 seen Wii popularity then they could increase it to the high pricing Europeans enjoy.

@Lou

Good price! 20GB or 60GB model?

Quote:

The PS3 is $445 USD in Japan. Guess who's eating that difference?

Customs? Local government taxes can be pretty high on luxury goods!

Personally I don't think it's that strange if a Japanese product is cheaper in Japan, Taiwan or China. At least they don't have to ship the units that far from the production plants.

Still I would greatly prefer to pay more for a native European model if I had visited Japan.

You are Nintendo Wii fan and likely their prices are more alike across the globe, but do note Sony is still losing money on the PS3 at this point and the Nintendo Wii generates profits on each and every sale, thus it's far more important for Sony to calculate the actual costs and evuale for every seperate market how low they can afford to go.

@MikeB

but PS3's are made in China just like the Wii and Foxcon makes both... Importing to Japan from China caused the Japanese Wii to be more expensive than the American one if you assume Wii Sports to be a $40 game...though in replay value it's easily a $60 game...

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @Lou Good price! 20GB or 60GB model? [quote]You are Nintendo Wii fan.

And you are a PS3 fan. What's your point? The 20GB model is non-existant. Have you already forgotten the price of the Korean 80GB model?

@Lou

Times Online, UK - May 24, 2007: At present, Sony offers 20-GB and 60-GB versions of the PS3 in Japan. It only sells the 60-GB model in Europe.

Quote:

Have you already forgotten the price of the Korean 80GB model?

The PS3 will be released in South Korea next month.

And what's so special about the 80GB model? A 80GB harddrive isn't much more expensive than a 60GB harddrive, 60GB is quite a lot, the price difference between the 20GB model and the 60GB model is also caused by added features like Wi-Fi and various Flashcard readers (CF/SD/MiniSD/PRO and Memory Stick).

@MikeB

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @Lou Times Online, UK - May 24, 2007: At present, Sony offers 20-GB and 60-GB versions of the PS3 in Japan. It only sells the 60-GB model in Europe. Quote: Have you already forgotten the price of the Korean 80GB model? The PS3 will be released in South Korea next month. And what's so special about the 80GB model? A 80GB harddrive isn't much more expensive than a 60GB harddrive, 60GB is quite a lot, the price difference between the 20GB model and the 60GB model is also caused by added features like Wi-Fi and various Flashcard readers (CF/SD/MiniSD/PRO and Memory Stick).

Ok Mike, the 20GB model launched at $425 in Japan... http://www.joystiq.com/2006/09/21/surprise-ps3-news-from-tgs/
So when a Japanese user from another forum (http://www.gamesarefun.com/news.php?newsid=7832 look for user ptt) says PS3's are $445 and we all know Sony has stopped producing the 20GB model...

Guess which PS3 model is on sale in Japan for $445?

If it makes you feel better, a 360 doesn't cost much more than a Wii... Or does all this make you wish you were Japanese?

Last edited by Lou on 30-May-2007 at 08:08 PM.
Last edited by Lou on 30-May-2007 at 08:06 PM.
Last edited by Lou on 30-May-2007 at 07:37 PM.

Another work around for the PS3's HDCP protection a DVI Converter

Alas I hate online players sometimes. Resistance is one. The large number of players online seems to mean a large number of campers. I think I'm not going to bother with online again campers ruin games. Nothing is more fun then spawning to take 1 step and be killed to then respawn again.. UGH... There's definitely an advantage to less players, vis-a-vis GearOfWar, it seems GeOW players are more apt to play the online game, though campers do exist there too.

@Lou

Quote:

If it makes you feel better, a 360 doesn't cost much more than a Wii... Or does all this make you wish you were Japanese?

No offence to the Japanese, but no...

Forza 2 for the 360 has a nice feature which the PS3's Grand Turismo should copy this fall.

Super Setup.

Take 3 360s and 3 HDTV Screens and one can make a surround monitor setup. Left screen/center screen/right screen. Screens appear to be 60fps @ 720p native but the 360 will upscale to 1080p for you.

Too bad the PS3 got cut to a single HDMI from the dual HDMI Sony once claimed. It would have made a nice 2 screen setup w/o having to buy 2 consoles.

@MikeB

Quote:

You are Nintendo Wii fan and likely their prices are more alike across the globe, but do note Sony is still losing money on the PS3 at this point and the Nintendo Wii generates profits on each and every sale, thus it's far more important for Sony to calculate the actual costs and evuale for every seperate market how low they can afford to go.

It would not kill you to admit that their is no justification for the disparity in prices in Europe. Everybody does it, not just Sony. Everybody.

I don't defend Apple's price hiking because I'm a Mac fan. I don't defend Adobe's extortionate prices over here because I like their software. I don't defend Windows Vista's price hikes because... um.. well you get the idea.

This is a wide-reaching argument. Many companies used the Euro as an excuse to hike prices. I couldn't believe the prices of guitars in America - it makes you sick when you see how much we get charged.

I'd respect you a lot more if you had the guts to admit Sony are charging us more for less over here, and that is a bad thing for Europeans. As a PS3 fan you should be pushing Sony to give us a fairer deal in the future.

Chris

@BrianK

Quote:

BrianK wrote: @jiyong Quote: when are you going to stop your childish games? I seriously don't know what you're tryin to do.. Belittling someone for no reason is unacceptable. Quote: Where did SCEE say there will be no more changes to BC? Where? Looks like you are misquoting people or putting words into their mouths. It almost looks as if you are making it your habit. It appears you are trying to avoid the question. How does your point that there's fixes to HDMI support or not support the point I made that Sony said v1.8 has no changes to backwards compatibility? I questioned why your point was linked to mine as your point seemed to not be related.

I'm avoiding the question? How about you avoiding my question?

First of all I addressed your FUD. As I was trying to find when was the first time Sony had said BC was a lower priority, I ran into other things. So I never tried to tie them, I was just too lazy to do two separate posts.

You are the one that read as if they were tied.

Quote:

Quote: And as I said before (it's even in the quoted text, but for you I will point it out AGAIN): No major changes is not equal to no changes Alas yes and I made no claim that no major changes is equal to no changes. Your next statement was Quote: And as I tried to investigate this, I ran into some more positive stuff: Undocumented PS3 1.80 firmware goodies It seems some HDMI handshake problems were solved. And you know that's all and good. My point was there were no changes to backwards compatibility and Sony themselves said they are focusing on updates not on B/C. Showing a change to HDMI doesn't support or negate my point about B/C because your point simply does not relate.

OK, you didn't literally say there was no change to BC, but let me quote you:

Quote:

European BC appears to be as complete as it's going to be

Quote:

I quoted SCEE themselves when they said no changes to backwards compatibility

AGAIN Brian, where did you quote Sony that there was NO CHANGE TO BC? Sony only said "focus is now on innovative applications and services for PS3 and not B/C" and Sony said "not going to see major changes in future updates ".

Now you do the math. AGAIN, no major changes is not equal to no changes. Perhaps you were not aware that line was regarding BC, but it seems you have been trying to claim no major changes is equal to no changes. How else should I read your quotes?

Perhaps I should have spelled it out for you that line was about BC, just as I would spell out everything for little children...

Quote:

Quote: But even the original text you quoted has the following line: Quote: As we have pointed out on many occasions, our engineer's focus is now on innovative applications and services for PS3 and not B/C, so you are not going to see major changes in future updates First I addressed your FUD, after that I continued with some more good news for the PS3, that wasn't even mentioned by Sony themselves You accuse me of not reading. It appears perhaps you have the reading problem. Don't claim this is my FUD when the quote you have included was the one that Sony themselves said. Here's that full quote again so the context of exactly who said it isn't lost. Quote: Here's SCEE's statement in case you missed it "This upgrade focused on upscaling and there were no significant backward compatibility enhancements. As we have pointed out on many occasions, our engineer's focus is now on innovative applications and services for PS3 and not B/C, so you are not going to see major changes in future updates So if this is FUD, which it well may be. Name calling others is unacceptable perhaps name calling SCEE will better suit your usages. I had used Sony's own words about nothing major going on with B/C to let MikeB know why B/C didn't see any changes on v1.8 it appears that's not Sony's plans. Now if SCEE does have some secret plans or something to greatly increase B/C then the fault of me is nothing but believing in Sony's FUD. Now to go back... How does your example support a change to backwards compatibility? Or show anything? Sorry it just doesn't related. It's fine you linked to my point I was just trying to figure out why the link as it doesn't make any sense as there was litte to no relation there.

This is what I mean with your childish games. You tell me I can't read, while it is obvious you are the one who can't read. Was my post really that confusing? Or are you just too busy to find potential errors in my posts, that you will do everything to make it look like I am twisting things? As I explained above, I just jumped to another topic after I told you "No major changes is not equal to no changes". But it seems you are just using that as an excuse so you could cover up/deflect you hadn't properly read the quote from Sony.

And look how you are twisting the text.

You translate "no significant backward compatibility enhancements" to "no BC enhancements". You really want to claim these two lines mean the same?
That's why I addressed your post.

You think "so you are not going to see major changes in future updates" is equal to "European BC appears to be as complete as it's going to be".

Now Brian, who needs to do some proper reading here?

Really Brian, I have had it with you. You either acknowledge your mistake, or I will put you in the same league as someone else. I assume you know who I mean.

Last edited by jiyong on 31-May-2007 at 04:42 AM.

@jiyong

Quote:

First of all I addressed your FUD. As I was trying to find when was the first time Sony had said BC was a lower priority, I ran into other things. So I never tried to tie them, I was just too lazy to do two separate posts.

Great! Thanks for answering the question. Your post is indeed run together and this helps provide clarity. That's all I was asking there's no need for your hostility.

Quote:

AGAIN Brian, where did you quote Sony that there was NO CHANGE TO BC? Sony only said "focus is now on innovative applications and services for PS3 and not B/C" and Sony said "not going to see major changes in future updates

If you read only what was written with a strict pedantic basis then yes my statement was an oversimplification Sony didn't say no updates again ever. Sony may indeed, according to their words, include some minor changes to backwards compatibility, but don't count on anything. If they do come, great, my PS3 will download them.

Quote:

as I would spell out everything for little children...

Please stick to the discussion points. It seems your posts are near consistently filled with ad hominem attacks. If you actually helped us understand when we questioned instead of getting your hackles up a discussion would go so much further.

Quote:

Was my post really that confusing? Or are you just too busy to find potential errors in my posts, that you will do everything to make it look like I am twisting things?

Yes your post was confusing and you nicely cleared it up in the quote I put above. Thanks for that. Also, it seems that you're somehow paranoid that I've this vendetta against you. I don't so no need to be defensive.

Quote:

You either acknowledge your mistake, or I will put you in the same league as someone else

If threating and belittling behavior gives you peace of mind then do as you must.

Quote:

I assume you know who I mean.

I don't know and I don't need to know. You see I don't consider your personal vendetta's important enough for me to follow. I'll let you worry about that.

The Guardian:
http://technology.guardian.co.uk/weekly/story/0,,2091221,00.html

"We asked Game, one of the largest console retailers in the UK. "That's not information we're able to give out. It's commercially sensitive," it said."

Commercially sensitive? Of course! But what about fairness towards potential consumers and those who are fed up with the situation?

"Third-party repair specialists also cast doubt on the 360's reliability. Simon Donn at Undercutter UK in London Colney, Hertfordshire, says: "There's a particular problem in relation to overheating. Quite often it's to do with the soldering on the board, and the fact that the fans, which are already very loud, can't seem to extract enough air. ""

Last edited by MikeB on 31-May-2007 at 10:03 AM.
Last edited by MikeB on 31-May-2007 at 10:02 AM.

@BrianK

Maybe this helps you in in quest, from NeoGAF:

"Good job on moving over to the PS3! Once again I am astounded at how so many feel exactly the same way I do. I was so close to writing off the 360 and doing the same thing. The only thing that kept me from doing so was the amount of money I spent on this thing already. After the utterly disgusting feeling I had after my BBB call with MS today, I am starting to wish I made the switch.

The call I had felt like the rep was just going through the motions. It almost felt as though I was bothering her with my case. Every step of the way she made it a point to quote the warranty as gospel. She literally layed my options on the table for me. i could either eat #### and get my console repaired or she could cancel the repair. This is my reality;

-My original 2005 brick was repaired for free out of warranty (Even though I had to pay to ship it to them. I am sure it cost me more to ship it than it would have cost Microsoft considering I do not have a corporate UPS account)
-They send me a refurb that is only covered for 90 days because it was a free repair. Microsoft will only give you an additional warranty if you are paying them money.

Logic tells me that;

-It was an out of warranty repair. Why does the "free" factor make it exempt from a 1 year warranty? Maybe I should ask the question as to why was the out of warranty repair "free"?

-They sent me a busted console, They screwed up and I payed for it. This is unacceptable and insulting to me as a consumer. Shouldn't a refurb be "like new"? Why would they not stand behind the refurbs they are sending out? My guess would be either they know it is a peice of #### or I did not fork over any money to them.

It appears to me as though Microsoft is hiding behind this warranty. I suppose legally the warranty absolves them from any accountability to this issue. I want to pose some questions to the community reps who happen to read these threads.

How am I supposed to feel when something like this happens to me? How am I supposed to react when a company tells me I have no options and there is no path for me to take? I reaffirmed to the woman that she was basically telling me that I can either pay them the money to fix it or she can cancel the repair, leaving me stuck with a $400 paperweight. She agreed with me very matter-of-factly with no sympathy to my plight. I felt like I would have had better luck talking to Max the automated attendant about this issue.

Is all Microsoft has to do when fulfilling their obligations to the BBB is restate the warranty over and over? What if I think the warranty is ####? What if I think that sending me a refurbished console that lasts shorter than my original one is a really lowlife scumbag thing to do? What if I think that I have been mistreated, robbed and cast aside by this company? What am I supposed to do as a consumer? Should I just eat it because Microsoft is adhering to some unwritten standard of the consumer electronics world?

It is interesting to me that every step of they way I have clearly expressed to them that I am not satisfied and I feel as though the situation is ridiculous. Rather than try to work with me, I become more and more incensed with how they treat me. How is $65 dollars worth it to MS to have a customer leave with an overall feeling of disgust, violation, disdain, and sheer anger?"

@clebin

Quote:

I'd respect you a lot more if you had the guts to admit Sony are charging us more for less over here, and that is a bad thing for Europeans. As a PS3 fan you should be pushing Sony to give us a fairer deal in the future.

Good luck with that... It seems very, very rare MikeB sees a problem with Sony's actions. I guess that is just how it is.

Last edited by jtsiren on 31-May-2007 at 11:36 AM.

Example of bad / cheap XBox 360 motherboard design? Any hardware experts want to comment on this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQgLBD3F6Bg

@jtsiren

Quote:

It seems very, very rare MikeB sees a problem with Sony's actions. I guess that is just how it is.

I think if Sony would not make gaming systems and compete with Microsoft and Nintendo, there would be a lot less criticism outed on these forums. Sony is in the spotlight a lot as a company with the most powerful brandname and has to deal with a lot of rival fanboyism.

A Dutch saying goes. the tallest trees catch the most wind.

Good news, apparently a new PSP firmware update is now available enabling access to all your media content stored on your PS3 through the internet.

Some low qualtiy initial photos, user reports state quality is very good:





Also "RSS Channel Guide" has been added as a feature under "RSS Channel.



We love our NDSes, but the PSP is starting to look attractive.

@MikeB

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @jtsiren Quote: It seems very, very rare MikeB sees a problem with Sony's actions. I guess that is just how it is. I think if Sony would not make gaming systems and compete with Microsoft and Nintendo, there would be a lot less criticism outed on these forums. Sony is in the spotlight a lot as a company with the most powerful brandname and has to deal with a lot of rival fanboyism. A Dutch saying goes. the tallest trees catch the most wind.

Well they do and the problem is that their track record (PS1, PS2, PSP) isn't that good from a hardware quality perspective. So far, the PS3 does seem to offer better quality than the PS1, PS2, PSP... Time will tell if these blue laser dioded will stand up to everyday use.

Again, I have no problem with their stereos and TV's. I think they should make an external brick power supply in a future PS3 in order to keep the unit cooler and require less fans on the main unit itself...

Though the Wii has a small external brick PSU, the console still gets fairly warm in standby mode. Though the drive can make some noise sometimes during gaming, overall it's a pretty quiet system.

@jiyong

Quote:

Really Brian, I have had it with you. You either acknowledge your mistake, or I will put you in the same league as someone else. I assume you know who I mean.

When are you going to realize that it is your that stirs the pot...?


In other more interesting news:
Quote:

Japanese software sales for May 21 - May 27: (Last week's rank) This week. Platform - Title - Publisher - This week's sales (Total sales) - Weeks on sale (N/A) 1. NDS - Kekkaishi: Karasumori Ayakashi Kidan - Bandai Namco - 40,741 - NEW (N/A) 2. PSP - Bleach: Heat the Soul 4 - Sony - 37,764 - NEW (N/A) 3. NDS - Lucky Star Moé Drill: Travel - Kadokawa Shoten - 30,397 - NEW (5) 4. Wii - Wii Sports - Nintendo - 27,642 (1,629,207) - 26th week (4) 5. PSP - Final Fantasy Tactics: The Lion War - Square Enix - 26,019 (220,390) - 3rd week (7) 6. NDS - Brain Training 2 - Nintendo - 22,378 (4,307,282) - 75th week (9) 7. NDS - New Super Mario Bros. - Nintendo - 21,472 (4,480,257) - 53rd week (N/A) 8. NDS - Kurikin: Nano Island Story - Nintendo - 20,792 - NEW (14) 9. NDS - More English Training - Nintendo - 19,375 (237,206) - 9th week (8) 10. Wii - Wii Play - Nintendo - 18,477 (1,336,284) - 26th week Total top 10 sales: 265,057 (down 104,861 from last week) Last week's sales: 369,918 More: (N/A) 11. 360 - Forza Motorsport 2 - Microsoft - NEW (1) 12. PS2 - Shining Wind - Sega - 2nd week (12) 13. NDS - Yoshi's Island DS - Nintendo - 11th week (N/A) 14. PS2 - Pachinko Ultraman: Iron Pachi-Chonmage 12 - Hackberry - NEW (11) 15. Wii - Super Paper Mario - Nintendo - 6th week (6) 16. NDS - Final Fantasy XII: Revenant Wings - Square Enix - 4th week (13) 17. NDS - Momotarou Dentetsu DS: Tokyo & Japan - Hudson - 5th week (16) 18. NDS - Mario Kart DS - Nintendo - 77th week (20) 19. NDS - Brain Training for Adults - Nintendo - 107th week (24) 20. NDS - English Training - Nintendo - 71st week For reference: Last week's sales Source: Media Create

via www.gamesarefun.com

Overall, sales are down again from the previous week...

Wow an Xbox 360 game just missed the top 10! Still no PS3 games anywhere to be found... I wonder how this will affect hardware sales...

...hardware sales to be published tomorrow - stay tuned...

I'm still predicting the week of June 14 when Trusty Bell is released that the 360 out sells the PS3 for that week in Japan... heck maybe 2 weeks in a row...

Manhunt 2 coming to a Wii near you:

Last edited by Lou on 31-May-2007 at 12:44 PM.
Last edited by Lou on 31-May-2007 at 12:35 PM.
Last edited by Lou on 31-May-2007 at 12:31 PM.

@Lou

Quote:

Well they do and the problem is that their track record (PS1, PS2, PSP) isn't that good from a hardware quality perspective.

I just bought the original God of War (PS2) for a mere 14 Euros. Plays great so far on my PS3!

What hardware issues are you talking about with regard to the PSP? I am starting to get interested in the device, should I wait for a possible redesign?