@DonnieA2

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Just the other side of the world in the United States, the blue state of Michigan to be exact. It originally came with a 90 day warranty here.

Here in Europe 1 year warranty is required by law, if you don't trust your product don't sell it to consumers. But I think for the US 1 year warrenty from Sony and Nintendo is standard as well, so finally Microsoft's warranty has become on par with the industry standard.

Last edited by MikeB on 10-Apr-2007 at 07:32 AM.

20GB PS3 as good as dead. (Don't say I didn't warn you 2 months ago.)
http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=5164&Itemid=2

more independent films supporting HD-DVD over Blu-Ray in Europe due to Sony's poor support
http://www.next-gen.biz/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=5168&Itemid=2

Microsoft confirms Live Messenger for Xbox 360 using keyboard attachment...
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=24051

Hardcore gamers will switch to PC's rather than having consoles try to do it all, meanwhile the Wii gets it right:
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=24070

By the way, no one ever answered my question:
Is RR6/7 any less fun in 480i?

Last edited by Lou on 10-Apr-2007 at 12:14 PM.

This thread has run its course. I'm not locking it but after repeated requests from too many members to mention here, I'm taking it off the front page.

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@BrianK

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BrianK wrote: @sloxa here is some interesting info. if you want buy Sony http://www.consumeraffairs.com/home_electronics/sony_play.html there is some BIG problem whit hardware.

That is a article you should read, MikeB!
As you can see is that even the newer ps2 units bought in 2006 has the same problem with dying lasers.

Last edited by Tomas on 10-Apr-2007 at 02:21 PM.

@Tomas

Moreover, the slim PS2 laser issues are not just statistical. There are commercial modchips fixing just this issue.

That does not mean that the 360 issues are any less scary, though, it's just to set the facts straight regarding the oh-so-robust Sony hardware.

_________________

@AMiGR
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That does not mean that the 360 issues are any less scary, though, it's just to set the facts straight regarding the oh-so-robust Sony hardware.

Yeah exactly. I do not defend microsoft at all at that part, and know that Xbox 360 has/have had too high failure rates.

But Sony is no better either.. They do just like Microsoft refuse that there is something wrong with their hardware and makes users pay for both repair and shipping.

Last edited by Tomas on 10-Apr-2007 at 02:24 PM.

@Tomas

Quote:

Yeah exactly. I do not defend microsoft at all at that part, and know that Xbox 360 has/have had too high failure rates. But Sony is no better either.. They do just like Microsoft refuse that there is something wrong with their hardware and makes users pay for both repair and shipping.

I agree. Heck Sony's slimline PS2 doesn't play all the games the original PS2 could. They didn't release such info before the slimline came out. It was pressed by us fans trying to use it and finding our games would no longer run. So they even break their own consoles with future console revisions.

The 2nd time my PS2 broke it was out of warranty. I called Sony to see about a repair but the Sony dweeb on the other end told me they don't repair consoles out of warranty so it got junked and replaced by a new one. Luckily prices had fallen enough that the cost for a new console was probably close to any repair costs + shipping + another month wait for the job to get done.

@BrianK

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I agree. Heck Sony's slimline PS2 doesn't play all the games the original PS2 could. They didn't release such info before the slimline came out. It was pressed by us fans trying to use it and finding our games would no longer run. So they even break their own consoles with future console revisions.

I actually never heard of that part. Did they change something major in the console? And do you have any links for me?
My sister got a slim line "pal" a few months back, so i wonder how significant this issue is.

@Tomas

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I actually never heard of that part. Did they change something major in the console? And do you have any links for me? My sister got a slim line "pal" a few months back, so i wonder how significant this issue is.

You can find a brief mention on Wikipedia. ...V14 which contain an integrated EE and GS, and different ASICs compared to previous revisions, some chips having a copyright date of 2005 has issues. V15 uses an integrated unified EE+GS chip and a redesigned ASIC, different laser lens, updated BIOS, updated drivers still has issues with games and a few different then V14.

Sony's website: http://www.us.playstation.com/News/ConsumerAlerts/softwareTitles_75001.html

IGN article: http://ps2.ign.com/articles/659/659949p1.html

For those who want to know more about the Human Eye and 1080p see the report at Audioholics . WARNING -- Slashdot effect on US date 4/10. You may want to wait a day to check it out as it's really really slow.

@Tomas

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That is a article you should read, MikeB!

I have, note that I never claimed the PSX or PS2 are sturdy product, but still I think issues with the more expensive XBox 360 are more extensive.

@BrianK

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The 2nd time my PS2 broke it was out of warranty. I called Sony to see about a repair but the Sony dweeb on the other end told me they don't repair consoles out of warranty

Did they provide a reason?

Maybe repair would cost about the same as buying a new one. At least Microsoft charged XBox 360 users more than the cost of a PS2 for repairments.

@MikeB

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @Tomas Quote: That is a article you should read, MikeB! I have, note that I never claimed the PSX or PS2 are sturdy product, but still I think issues with the more expensive XBox 360 are more extensive.

I paid more for both my psx and my ps2, even though i did not buy it immediately after launch.

And if you think the microsoft customer service is bad, then read this one about the ps2: Quote:

Tracey of IA (12/13/06) Sent in a ps2 to be refurbished or repaired. They supposedly sent me a refurbished one. I paid 45.00 for repair and 23.00 for shipping. However, the one they sent me as a replacement is defective as well. It shuts itself off in the middle of the game. The cooling fan is not operating. They told me that it looked like they sent me one that was not repaired and apologized, however there is a 90 day warranty so I can get it fixed for nothing. The catch: I have to pay another 23.00 in shipping as it is Sony's policy that they will not and cannot pay for any shipping to them.

Why should he have to pay shipping for a mistake that Sony did?
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On 12/22/04 as a present I got my son a Playstation 2 -- it only worked for 2 days. You are supposed to be able to watch a DVD on the Playstation 2. After watching a DVD the Playstation 2 wouldnt play any games or DVD's. This is a problem and I'm not the first. I telephoned the company and will be sent a refurbished unit. The problem is my warranty now has been shortened. It shouldn't be shortened because this is a recurring problem with the PS2. I don't want my money back -- I want a machine that works.

and more..
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Jason of Marshfield MA (2/12/04): I have purchased three Sony playstation 2's in the last year and the company will not replace any of them. I have had numerous problems with software and just want what I paid for to be replaced or repaired with no questions asked but of course Sony has been nothing but a hassle and an inconvenience. They want me to pay for repairs and shipping. I have already bought it so they should be responsible for all aspects of repair and shipping, but when I told them that they were rude and showed no care at all for the consumer. I think X-box should have the rights to all sony games so people would not have to even buy sony ps2 anymore. I have spent almost a thousand dollars on three boxes with ps2 on them that are now door stops, paper weights, and a total finacial blunder on my behalf and I will let everyone in my area know about the waste of money that ps2 is.

Nearly all problems seems to involve the same.. One day the ps2 will suddenly stop reading certain discs and then soon later it refuses to read any..

Last edited by Tomas on 10-Apr-2007 at 04:43 PM.
Last edited by Tomas on 10-Apr-2007 at 04:36 PM.

@Lou

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supporting HD-DVD over Blu-Ray in Europe due to Sony's poor support

Did the article claim due to Sony? Are the Dutch (Philips) not important enough anymore, don't we count anymore....

I don't think this will mean much\ though.

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Hardcore gamers will switch to PC's

I predict they won't. The figures are clear the PC gaming market has declined 40% the last 5 years and the console market has and is growing by staggering numbers. I think they may be afraid by what game developers will be able to push out of the PS3 (they complained about the Cell being too complex for them to develop for, but other devs are loving it). No, longer are game consoles the low-end of the gaming industry!

The guys behind LittleBigPlanet:

"We had soft body physics and things like that running early on because we got lots of other smaller things sorted out or decided before hand – and even with all that in place there’s still loads more headroom. The PS3 has this insane quantity of "We had soft body physics and things like that running early on because we got lots of other smaller things sorted out or decided before hand – and even with all that in place there’s still loads more headroom. The PS3 has this insane quantity of power, which seems to take a cloth simulator, and then lots more you want to throw at it. It’s just a really enjoyable machine to code for."

But similar to what I stated many times over the last few years regarding the Cell and PS3 (I would rather word it like: Only game engines designed specifically for the PS3 will truly be able to push the hardware):

"We’ve come to the PS3 without baggage," explained Smith: "If you arrive with legacy code it just doesn’t work."

"Prior to speaking to Sony it was a conscious decision," adds director Chris Lee on the decision to focus on Sony's new machine.

"The game itself sits with their strategy – but going with them meant the team could be focused. It all aligned really well. And that gives us a lot of confidence that we are with the right partner."

Also interesting, the Cell a medical breakthrough?

PS3 Chip Speeds Up Medical Imaging
http://blog.wired.com/games/2007/04/ps3_chip_speeds.html

The Science behind Super Ruba Dub:
http://www.developmag.com/news/26471/Super-Rub-a-Dev

Last edited by MikeB on 10-Apr-2007 at 06:06 PM.
Last edited by MikeB on 10-Apr-2007 at 06:04 PM.
Last edited by MikeB on 10-Apr-2007 at 06:03 PM.

@MikeB
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I predict they won't. The figures are clear the PC gaming market has declined 40% the last 5 years and the console market has and is growing by staggering numbers. I think they may be afraid by what game developers will be able to push out of the PS3 (they complained about the Cell being too complex for them to develop for, but other devs are loving it). No, longer are game consoles the low-end of the gaming industry!

Are you saying that the ps3 will outperform a high end pc?
The gfx card in the PS3 "basically a nvidia 7800GTX" is already getting outdated compared to the pc world and the gfx card is still the most important device when it comes to games.
In just a year or two even the cheaper range of pcs will have more sophisticated gpu than both the xbox 360 or the ps3.

When the psx and saturn came out it was a whole different story.. Back then the consoles outperformed computers for quite some time when it came to games.

You should really not eat what the developers are saying.. Have you seen what developers are saying about Xbox 360? They are saying the same, just that they replaced the word ps3 with xbox 360. A developer that invest in a certain console, will of course defend it as they want to sell games. It would not be very smart for them to say that they believe for example that the ps3 are underperformed.

Last edited by Tomas on 10-Apr-2007 at 06:18 PM.

@Tomas

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Are you saying that the ps3 will outperform a high end pc?]

In some crucial ways I think this will be the case, due to the Cell processor and Blu-Ray disc. HDTVs have now also become at least on par with the best monitors.

Last edited by MikeB on 10-Apr-2007 at 06:44 PM.

@MikeB

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In some crucial ways I think this will be the case, due to the Cell processor and Blu-Ray disc. HDTVs have now also become at least on par with the best monitors.

Most games install all the data on the hard drive, so i dont see how that should make a difference as they can just distribute games on 2 dvds or similar.

@MikeB

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Did they provide a reason?

Likely they did. Since it's been a couple years since the incident I can't remember the exact details but as I said it was solved by buying a new console.

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Also interesting, the Cell a medical breakthrough?

No the Cell would be a data processing breakthrough enabling medicine or whatever other computational task it's given. Now I'm sure the PS3 will save us all when it does free in home MRI scans before each game we play ensuring none of us has any diseases..

Quote:

In some crucial ways I think this will be the case, due to the Cell processor and Blu-Ray disc

Come on dude high end PCs will undoubtably have Blu-Ray too it's not an advantage of the PS3 over high end PCs. The Cell is a good concept but it's been done before -- DSP + CPU for example. The Cell is one of the first integration within a single core. No doubt the quad core CPU and dual quad core systems -- new Apple tower for example, will give it a run. Undoubtably Intel/AMD/IBM are looking at the Cell and deciding what/if/how x86 can be extended with this sort of concept.

Now I lumbed IBM in there because they have a close relationship with AMD. Undoubtably IBM is pushing PowerPC and how/if the cell concept might come to x86 I would believe would be discussed in some capacity. One example may be the rumored PowerPC CPUs to use Opteron sockets in the future. I'd be surprised if a few years down the road we don't see some sort of dsp+amd cpu similar to the cell.

@Tomas

For instance Metal Gear Solid will fill up a 50 GB disc, if you would distribute this content on dual layer DVDs that would take about 6-7 discs (if not installed, some data may need to be duplicated for each disc and require disc swapping).

50 GB may sound a lot but if for instance you stream 5 MB/s worth of data (such as textures and sound) 50 GB would only mean about 2 and a half hours.

@MikeB

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @Tomas For instance Metal Gear Solid will fill up a 50 GB disc, if you would distribute this content on dual layer DVDs that would take about 6-7 discs (if not installed, some data may need to be duplicated for each disc and require disc swapping). 50 GB may sound a lot but if for instance you stream 5 MB/s worth of data (such as textures and sound) 50 GB would only mean about 2 and a half hours.

I find that claim very far fetched.. I have heard that they store the same data multiple times on the same blueray disc, so that the ps3 are able to access the data faster. I highly doubt it has 10+ gigs of textures as the ps3 does not even have enough memory to store such big textures in memory.

And like i said, nearly every pc game out there needs to be installed on the hd. The only thing you need the disc for these days, is for the copy protection to check if you have a real copy.