@MikeB
Quote:

Microsoft repeatably stated their aim is to make the XBox 360 the new PS2.

First - any actual quote would be good.

Second - anyone that's worked for a company knows there are external marketing sand internal expectations and these are not exactly the same. Clearly Microsoft did not plan for that as they have stated life expectancies longer then the Xbox but shorter then the PS2 and they don't appear to have the production facilities that would meet the demand in a shorter timeframe. For other examples of this disjoint look at Sony. They've clearly said backwards compatibility is important and yet have a console that can't do it.

Quote:

Microsoft has a bad reputation and Sony a long standing impressive track record, I think this will play an important role for the long run.

Well I hope you're right for Sony's sake because their 'impressive record' is doing nada for the PS3 in the short term in Japan. The company with the track record, Nintendo, is eating their lunch.

I know you love Japan numbers but their market is small they aren't going to determine the winner but they are lending their numbers to the Wii. Take last week for example in the US the 7th gen consoles, according to VgChartz, sold 31K PS3s. In Japan the all 7th Gen sales were 38K. Total US: 240K. The US had 80K more 360s then PS3 sold. So in the US last week the 360 outsold the PS3 by 2 weeks of total Japan console sales or even worse 2 months worth of PS3 sales. You said it before small numbers have little influence on overall stats. Japan isn't a significant determining factor in the winner but it will be an influence on a couple % points for all the consoles.

@MikeB

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @Derfs Quote: thats what it seems when you say RRoD The Red Ring of Death, refers to 3 flashing circle lights. It has nothing to do with video cable connections.

i feel my point was missed.

if it was a ring, all 4 red lights would be on, instead it is 3, which is not a ring.

unless there is a new meaning to the word 'ring'

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@Derfs

When people are stating "Red Ring of Death".

They are referring to this, nomatter that it's not a full circle:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Xbox360-ringofdeath.jpg

Built 2 months ago:

@MikeB

I have now ordered a Playstation 3 40GB.
I read on swedish forums that it is alot quieter and cooler running than the older
60GB version. Coupled with the new lower price I had to buy a unit.
The missing features, memory card reader, smaller harddrive, 2 USB and no
PS2 emulation will not be missed by me atleast.

It will mainly be used for Blu-ray but also for the occasional game now and then.

I don't understand the complaint that there ain't no games for PS3.. I saw alot in
the site where I ordered my unit. Also a hell of alot of new games that will be
released late 2007 and during 2008.

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@Samwel
Quote:

I don't understand the complaint that there ain't no games for PS3

Sony said about 65 by Christmas. After this statement at least 2 I know of slipped from Dec07 to 2008. Most of those games are ranked below an 8. There's no AAA titles yet -- GTA, Final Fantasy, Gran Turismo, Katamari, Soul Caliber, Dragon Quest. Devil May Cry, God of War. Compare this to the 360 which has close to 300 games for the console + over 300 backward compatibile games. We see after the loss of backwards compatibility that the PS3 has roughly 1/10th of the titles which the 360 has. This is why people say there aren't any games.

But yes I'm much looking forward to 2008 for my PS3.

@MikeB
360 pricut and new bundles with games were announced for 11/1 in Japan. 20GB bundle, listed at ¥39,795 (US $346), will retail for ¥34,800 ($302). Likewise, the ¥29,800 ($259) Core System will sell for ¥27,800 ($241). A new, limited-edition 20GB "Value Pack" with Forza Motorsport 2 and Viva Piñata will also go on sale. Personally I don't think it'll do much there for the console in Japan.

@MikeB

Quote:

ring (CIRCLE) noun [C] 1 a circle of any material, or any group of things or people in a circular shape or arrangement: The game involved throwing metal rings over a stick. The children sat in a ring around the teacher.

people only look foolish when usuing the RRoD term. hopefully you have now got my point, and dont send me more links of places that dont know what 'ring' means.

@picture

i have taken back a few faulty ps3's in the last week. one even ate a game. even had a few wii's back. can i have pictures of those too please?

*edit*

actually, just saw what the 360 was running. now i understand why it died

Last edited by Derfs on 22-Oct-2007 at 06:52 PM.

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@MikeB
3rd parties reducing PS3 Games?

'One piece of news that came out this week was that Sony pleaded with third-party developers not to abandon its struggling platform. That change in attitude is a marked difference compared to the arrogance of past years. The argument is that the PS 3 will show its strength as developers learn how to make games for it. But developers know they can staff four or five Wii teams with the same number of people it takes to make one PS 3 game. We may have a glut of Wii games soon, but that’s not as bad as not having enough games on the PS 3'

@BrianK

Quote:

Sony said about 65 by Christmas. After this statement at least 2 I know of slipped from Dec07 to 2008. Most of those games are ranked below an 8. There's no AAA titles yet -- GTA, Final Fantasy, Gran Turismo, Katamari, Soul Caliber, Dragon Quest. Devil May Cry, God of War. Compare this to the 360 which has close to 300 games for the console + over 300 backward compatibile games. We see after the loss of backwards compatibility that the PS3 has roughly 1/10th of the titles which the 360 has. This is why people say there aren't any games.

Yes, 65 seems correct. But ain't that enough? How many games can a user go
through each year?
Also PS3 is more than just a games machine. Many (like me) buy it for its good
media features aswell. I plan to use it as my main movie player for time being for
example.

My guesstimate is that there will be atleast 180-200 games for the PS3 for next
christmas. Enough for most I guess.

What's a AAA title?

I like racing & sports games mainly, PS3 have +25 of those.. The rest is just eye
candy for me. Good enough for me.
Then there's the Blu-ray vs. HD-DVD issue.. I believe Blu-ray is better and will win
the movie battle..

As you may have gathered I'm not game freak.. I rarely play games actually..
So that's why I don't see the games issue the way you do (I think).

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@Samwel
Quote:

Yes, 65 seems correct. But ain't that enough? How many games can a user go through each year?

How many books are there? Surely more then videogames. But ain't that enough?

Quote:

Also PS3 is more than just a games machine

As is the 360.

Quote:

I like racing & sports games mainly, PS3 have +25 of those

Out of those about 7-10 are worth trying. I'm not one to pay the expensive $40-$60 for the current gen titles when they rank a 2.5 out of 10 like the PS3's Sprint game. Most of those sport games are on other consoles too.

Quote:

Then there's the Blu-ray vs. HD-DVD issue.. I believe Blu-ray is better and will win the movie battle

I have both so it's a non-issue. I expect that 1 will eventually win out but who knows DVD-A vs SA-CD winner was the iPod.

Seeing the PS3 as a good Blu-Ray machine is fine. The 40GB version is the least expensive player, currently, and can game so has some more features then the standard player. Unfortunately making a good Blu-Ray player doesn't encourage the consumer looking to play games to come to your console. I think it shows that people aren't looking at it for mainly a Blu-Ray player. Because for about every 4 PS3s on the market there's 1 Blu-Ray sold. Compare this to HD DVD where they have sold more movies then consoles.

@BrianK

Heh.. Yes, but I believe there are TOO MANY books.

IMO 360 is more a "game console only" than PS3. Yes you could buy stuff for it
making it more like a media station.. But if we count those options then anything
that plays music and/or video could be called a media station. It has to do with
what the machine is delivered with as standard IMO.
Note I'm not saying 360 is bad or anything..

7-10 is more than enough for me.
Yeah, I won't be buying many of those full price games either.. Too expensive!

I personally think it was a GREAT idea to use Blu-ray in the PS3. Despite what
others think. It gives the PS3 a edge over the 360, especially when coming after
360 into the market.
About the amount of Blu-ray sold.. I think this will change during 2008.
I just checked the largest movie (selling) site in Sweden and 16 of its 20 best selling
HD movies are Blu-ray, also taking the 6 first places and the next HD-DVD came at
16th place.

Last edited by Samwel on 24-Oct-2007 at 02:18 AM.

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@Samwel

Quote:

IMO 360 is more a "game console only" than PS3. Yes you could buy stuff for it making it more like a media station.. But if we count those options then anything that plays music and/or video could be called a media station. It has to do with what the machine is delivered with as standard IMO

You seem misinformed. Media options are built in the only add-on is an HD DVD player. What else is there to buy?

Haha that is some good news. LOL

Serves you well, Microsoft slaves.

"I am an Amiga fan! Really, I mean it, M$ did not do ANYTHING bad to destroy my beloved system. The world is much better with standardised PC's and handhelds. We should make sure they standardise consoles too! I love to support them. Maybe soon they will give us M$ babies (actually they already exist! Hooray!), M$ Hifi, M$ Everything. Oh I cannot wait! It is good that they are getting rid of future proof custom hardware like the Amiga was. Or those stupid eastern consoles. A real console should be American. Just like everything else. Real consoles HAVE to be obsoleted and trashed after a few years, so we can all buy new ones!!! Long live modern capitalism! Long live Microsoft! I love Microsoft! They should spread sperm samples of the one who created that company. The world will be filled with superior & genius people all over! Yes, when my PS2 broke first time it was all Sony's fault, same for when my Wii controller flew away. I smashes them both with a hammer! My 360 ONLY died twice!!! And it is still running!!! Is that not the most greatest thing? Oh I am so glad to be an Amiga user. Bless you all. God gave Rock'n'Roll - no! - God gave XBOX 360 to us!!!"

I am sure many of you agree!

@Peyote

So you hate Microsoft and capitalism. That's fine. It of course has no bearing on the usablity and quality of their console.

@BrianK

Who says I hate capitalism? I do not like abuse of capitalism, hence M$.

"The quality of the console"

Yeah, I can dig that. ~40% defect ratio. Quality and usability.

Not in my dictionary.

@Peyote

Quote:

"The quality of the console" Yeah, I can dig that. ~40% defect ratio. Quality and usability. Not in my dictionary.

Cool see it's easy to get on topic.

@BrianK

IMO a HD content format player as is one BIG difference when using it as a mediastation.
Didn't the 360 also lack HDMI until the elite came out?
What about getting HD audio from the HD-DVD player?
I think HDMI and a built-in HD-DVD/DVD player would be really nice for the 360.
Of course keeping the lower price. I would then be convinced to buy it.

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@Samwel
Sounds like you need all HD things to be a media station. I'd agree that having those makes the media station more flexible but that doesn't stop the unit from being a Media station.

HD DVD isn't necessary for HD, at least in the USA. Many movies and TV shows are downloadable in HD. Even one's that are Blu-Ray only.

360 did lack HDMI it's now being put all on units. HDMI means no 1080p but 1080i and 720p are available from the console without it, both are HD formats. Plasma owners enjoy 768p from their sets and many DLPs were 720p only, until the last year or so, but clearly those TVs one wouldn't call media unfriendly.

@BrianK

360 can do 1080p without HDMI

_________________

@BrianK

Quote:

Sounds like you need all HD things to be a media station.

Heh I don't need all things to be HD.. But when a unit is advertised as a HD unit
I very much expect it to perform fully with HD out of the box.

Quote:

HD DVD isn't necessary for HD, at least in the USA. Many movies and TV shows are downloadable in HD. Even one's that are Blu-Ray only.

I don't know if downloadable HD content is available in Sweden, but I doubt it is.
Sweden is a too small market for this I guess (with a total population of 9 million).
We'll get it when the technology is ordinary and alot cheaper I guess.

Quote:

360 did lack HDMI it's now being put all on units. HDMI means no 1080p but 1080i and 720p are available from the console without it, both are HD formats. Plasma owners enjoy 768p from their sets and many DLPs were 720p only, until the last year or so, but clearly those TVs one wouldn't call media unfriendly.

Having only a DVD player, and no HDMI port really sucked for 360 when it was
released IMHO. And yes, I know they have started to put HDMI ports on all versions
now for a while. Which is really good. Do they use the newer 1.3 standard?

I know most TV's and projectors are 768/720 today.. But what about in 2-3 years?
IMO MicroSoft lacked vision when they chose not to have a HDMI port when it was
released. But HDMI is not just 1080p, it's also digital transfer compared to
component which IMO is a huge difference. As I'm sure you know it can be digital
transfer of both video and audio which makes setup alot easier. It is also the only
DIGITAL way of transfering the new HD audio formats today aswell.

So what about the HD audio issue.. I saw somewhere that it was impossible to
get it out from the 360 HD-DVD player.. Has this changed with the HDMI versions
of the consoles?

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@Samwel

yes the HDMI is 1.2

i like having choice on which disc format to get for the future, and not having sony force me to have their format. if blue-ray is the only one left in the end, then there will be a blue-ray player for the 360.

if you think that 1080p HDMI vs component on 360 is alot different then you have been using ps3 too long to comapre. the conversion for the 360 is so good, unless you have a high end HD screen, you will not notice the difference. Eurogamer did a comparison a few months back.

As for audio, you do know that there is a digital optical link (toslink) on the component cable for the 360, yes? gives the same audio quality as a a PS3 through HDMI.

The Sony PlayStation 3 does not currently support the delivery of Dolby TrueHD or DTS-HD Master Audio bitstreams but can decode Dolby TrueHD and deliver it at up to 7.1 channel LPCM.

The audio issues are really to do with the early batch of films using the new HD compression systems, and recievers that are not quite compatible. Just like the ps3, the 360 can be updated with patches.

Last edited by Derfs on 29-Oct-2007 at 08:02 AM.
Last edited by Derfs on 29-Oct-2007 at 08:01 AM.

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