@BrianK

Quote:

The SPE can't do branch prediction.

You can do that on the SPEs. You must be confusing the fact that the SPEs don't include hardware branch predictors. Branch elimination is just good practice for software development and branch hints are more accurate.

Quote:

It doesn't do the code scheduling.

You can do that as well.

Quote:

It can't reorder instructions.

You mean to say the Cell is an in-order CPU just like the XBox 360's Xenon processor. Not an issue with good coding.

Quote:

As I compare games on my 360 and on my PS3 nothing proves to be a twice as powerful improvement.

The CPU is more than twice as powerful and the general design is less bottlenecked. In due time you will understand, I promise you. But remember Pacman on a twice as powerful system is still just Pacman.

Quote:

Games, even as simple as Wipeout HD, are going to be downscaled in resolution

Rendering two pictures (one for each eye) is of course more demanding. However WiperOut HD was never designed from the core up for 3D. The first couple of games are quick demos of how easy this can be implemented in existing games. However Super Stardust HD is said to receive a good game engine overhaul. Better results will be shown in due time.

Rendering performance is just a piece of the performance puzzle. For example you may think a system which would be able to render Pacman in twice the rendering resolution to mean it's twice as powerful. But what about a system which instead can produce a bigger gaming world, more onscreen activity, more effects, more complex AI, etc? Doesn't that make a system more powerful?

Quote:

Sony claimed 1080p to be the 'Holy Grail' of HD

What do you mean by that? 1080p is a common HDTV resolution standard, it's advertised by all the TV makers out there.

Need to sleep now, see you tomorrow.

@MikeB

Quote:

You must be confusing the fact that the SPEs don't include hardware branch predictors

Exactly, we're on the same page here. The hardware in the 'system on a chip' doesn't exist for these. Doesn't mean it can't be done in software. Certainly a chip could multiply in software with only addition hardware. But, having the ability in hardware, generally, means improved performance and easier controls for the developer.

Quote:

In due time you will understand, I promise you

Not sure why you think I don't understand? I understand the numbers pushed by Sony. What doesn't exist is the game application that proves the claim.

Quote:

Doesn't that make a system more powerful?

Certainly. And few, and not me, doubt the PS3 is more powerful than the 360. Simply that developers are rare to optizime on that ability and certainly haven't shown us they can build something that uses twice the 360 power.

Quote:

What do you mean by that?

It was a slight at Sony's marketing lies. Remember this claim from Harrison? " The Xbox 360 has a maximum output resolution of 1080i. As a result, Harrison says that "the HD era really only starts when we are on the market" Sony, via Harrison, advertised that 1080p is the only HD resolution. Of course 720p and 1080i are also common HDTV resolution standards.

Last edited by BrianK on 18-May-2010 at 01:10 AM.

@BrianK

Quote:

It was a slight at Sony's marketing lies. Remember this claim from Harrison?

I think you should have provided the proper context. He was talking about movie playback and that the XBox 360 did not come with either HD DVD or Blu-Ray out of the box. The XBox 360 did not come with a HDMI port at the time neither (IMO a big shortcoming for a HD console) and couldn't output 1080p over component cables.

Well after that statement Microsoft released a firmware update which allowed the console to output 1080p over VGA cables (and later with new consoles over HDMI). I can't say they added this in an elegant manner though, plugging in HDMI and optical out of the box wasn't possible without performing tricks (needed to plug in an extra cable which did not fit).

By providing the proper context and suddenly it all reads a lot less malicious don't you agree?

Of course even the PS2 can also output HD resolutions, but he seemed to be referring to other facts at the time.

@MikeB

Quote:

I think you should have provided the proper context. He was talking about movie playback and that the XBox 360 did not come with either HD DVD or Blu-Ray out of the box. The XBox 360 did not come with a HDMI port at the time neither (IMO a big shortcoming for a HD console) and couldn't output 1080p over component cables.

I appreciate the feedback. It could possibly be that all the games press took the comment out of context. Can you provide for us something else that details the fuller point?

HDMI is digital. Components are analog. Components can do 720p and 1080i both of which are HD standards. Actually components could do 1080p if the industry didn't decide to cut them short and not allow TV to accept 1080p inputs via component. Xbox could do VGA which at the time was on most TVs and does again carry HD. Not having HDMI, which most TV sets at the time of the 360 launch didn't have BTW, does not exclude HD output. For example, in various testing the 360 HD output quality of HDMI or component is unchanged.

Quote:

By providing the proper context and suddenly it all reads a lot less malicious don't you agree?

I would agree. Though what I see here is the gaming journalist's out of context claim by MikeB. Do you have a link or article that more fully details the entire statement by Harrison? This would go a long way into accepting your claimed context is true and the press have it wrong.

Last edited by BrianK on 18-May-2010 at 12:26 PM.

Remember when Sony used to claim a free PSN was a feature over the 360?

http://www.edge-online.com/news/premium-psn-subscription-details-leak

Another epic fail from Sony.

@Lou

What part of "it won’t impact currently free PSN features, which include online gaming." don't you understand?

@MikeB

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @Lou What part of "it won’t impact currently free PSN features, which include online gaming." don't you understand?

Obviously, what is free and what is not would change. What part of that can't you understand?

Austrailian console sales to date:

Wii 1.7 M
360 1 M
PS3 0.85 M

http://www.edge-online.com/news/australia-ps3-hits-850000-sales-pspgo-under-25000

@Lou

Regarding Microsoft's figures, they state:

"Last month Microsoft revealed that it had sold one million Xbox 360s in both Australia and New Zealand but did not break down the figure country by country."

The 360 had a 1 year and 4 months headstart in these countries (2 extra holiday seasons). Thus it looks like the PS3 is closing the gap there as well, Australia together with the UK and especially the US are relatively strong 360 markets.

----
Overall:

The worldwide gap at the end of March 2010 was 4.47 million units between the PS3 and XBox 360 to the advantage of the XBox 360. Yet 115.6 million games were sold for the PS3 last year and only 103.1 million games for the XBox 360.

- PS3 hardware sales went up about 30% last year.
- XBox 360 hardware sales dropped by about 11% last year.
- Wii hardware sales dropped by about 21% last year.

- Sony's forecast for this fiscal year:
PS3 up by 14%
- Nintendo forecast for this fiscal year:
Wii down by about 14%
- Microsoft did not provide a forecast, but it's anticipated by analysts sales will drop by about 20% this year.

If those figures end up being correct the PS3 install base will have overtaken the XBox 360 install base by 2.5 million before the end of this fiscal year. If the XBox 360 sells the same as last year, the PS3 will have overtaken the XBox 360 by little over half a million.

Regarding software sales:

- PS3 game sales went up about 10% last year.
- XBox 360 game sales went down by about by about 2% last year.
- Wii game sales went down by about 7% last year.

@MikeB

Quote:

If those figures end up being correct the PS3 install base will have overtaken the XBox 360 install base by 2.5 million before the end of this fiscal year

Whose 'fiscal year' are you talking? I believe Microsoft ends their fiscal year in June. There's no way the numbers work for that.

I think Sony's fiscal year ends in March. Please correct me if I'm mistaken. So, your new prediction for PS3 to be #2 is March 2011?

@MikeB

Quote:

MikeB wrote: @Lou Regarding Microsoft's figures, they state: "Last month Microsoft revealed that it had sold one million Xbox 360s in both Australia and New Zealand but did not break down the figure country by country." The 360 had a 1 year and 4 months headstart in these countries (2 extra holiday seasons). Thus it looks like the PS3 is closing the gap there as well, Australia together with the UK and especially the US are relatively strong 360 markets. ---- Overall: The worldwide gap at the end of March 2010 was 4.47 million units between the PS3 and XBox 360 to the advantage of the XBox 360. Yet 115.6 million games were sold for the PS3 last year and only 103.1 million games for the XBox 360. - PS3 hardware sales went up about 30% last year. - XBox 360 hardware sales dropped by about 11% last year. - Wii hardware sales dropped by about 21% last year. - Sony's forecast for this fiscal year: PS3 up by 14% - Nintendo forecast for this fiscal year: Wii down by about 14% - Microsoft did not provide a forecast, but it's anticipated by analysts sales will drop by about 20% this year. If those figures end up being correct the PS3 install base will have overtaken the XBox 360 install base by 2.5 million before the end of this fiscal year. If the XBox 360 sells the same as last year, the PS3 will have overtaken the XBox 360 by little over half a million. Regarding software sales: - PS3 game sales went up about 10% last year. - XBox 360 game sales went down by about by about 2% last year. - Wii game sales went down by about 7% last year.

If
If
If

If Nintendo stopped selling consoles today, Sony might overtake them in 3 years.
Assuming a constant price of tea in China, it could take 3.5 years.

@Lou

Quote:

If If If If Nintendo stopped selling consoles today, Sony might overtake them in 3 years. Assuming a constant price of tea in China, it could take 3.5 years.

I agree with the sentiment. We've seen guesses every year that the PS3 will be #2. (I'm even guilty with thinking Sony could do it.) Now it's shifting to #2 out past 2010. If and when the PS3 makes #2 it's still a long way from #1.

This fall the PS3 Wand and 360 Natal comes out. We'll see if a recycled Wii controller can drive popularity or is it something even more innovative.

Other factors for this fall, besides games, is Windows Phone 7 mobile gaming and tying into the Xbox Live. Sony has the PSP2 on the way. Hopefully it'll be more successful than the PSP Go Dud. Of course Nintendo is headed to another handheld to with their 3D DS. (Which coincidentally the DS will soon overtake the PS2 as the most sold game console ever.)

Basing a prediction on current sales ignores that these factors may be influential. I think they will.

@BrianK

Quote:

I think Sony's fiscal year ends in March. Please correct me if I'm mistaken. So, your new prediction for PS3 to be #2 is March 2011?

Yes, before the end of Sony's fiscal year I think the PS3 has overtaken the XBox 360 install base.

In the past I said I thought this would happen by the time Final Fantasy XIII, Gran Turismo 5, Killzone 2 and Metal Gear Solid 4 are all available.

This year Gran Turismo 5 will be released, the highest-selling PlayStation exclusive franchise of all time.

@BrianK

My past predictions:

2005 (well before th XBox 360 launched), regarding PS3:

Quote:

It will probably take some time before developers manage to get the most out of this platform, as has for example also been the case with the classic Amiga chipsets. The early Amiga games don't compare well to the complex graphics used by for instance game like Elfmania or Lion Heart.

2006/2007:

Quote:

Quote: I was talking about Christmas 2007. For 2006 my prediction is that the Playstation 2 will be on top (not counting the handhelds). Nintendo Wii and PS3 will sell as much as their companies can produce. I think 2006 will also be a good year for the XBox 360 in closing, but will not get close to PS2 figures." The Wii hype will dry down quite a bit, though still preferred by many young kids and females, after 2008 I expect HDTV penetration and higher expectations to considerably hurt worldwide sales, somewhere in 2009 I think HD DVD will have lost the format war and the Slimline PS3 really starts to take off.

2007:

Quote:

I expect the PS3 to continue to perform roughly on par with XBox 360 sales from the year before, until Killzone 2, Gran Turismo 5, Final Fantasy XIII and Metal Gear Solid 4 are all on the market (when that will be exactly may not even be known to the developers themselves.

2nd of January 2009:

Quote:

I anticipate around 10 million sales per year on average, until the release of a "PSThree", then I expect the PS3 to sell around 15 million on average. So 2007 + 2008, about 20 million, I anticipate a slimline PS3 to launch somewhere in 2009.

I think not bad predictions at all, actually I haven't seen anyone produce better predictions than those!

However what I didn't anticipate was the fierce economic problems Japanese electronics companies (including Sony) would be facing in especially 2008. Escpecially the strong yen vs weak dollar caused problems killing a potential PS3 price drop for that year.

I also didn't anticipate Microsoft killing its PC gaming business by not releasing games such as Alan Wake, Halo 3, Gears of War 2 and Fable 2 for the PC this to the advantage of exclusivity for the XBox 360. And although before launch I was one of the very few who thought the Wii would be a success, it was more so than I imagined (women are pretty unpredictable )

Last edited by MikeB on 19-May-2010 at 11:22 AM.
Last edited by MikeB on 19-May-2010 at 11:20 AM.

LOL

http://blogs.watoday.com.au/digital-life/screenplay/2010/05/19/apple.html

Sony claims it's not as arrogant as it used to be and that Apple takes the arrogance cake now.

@MikeB

Quote:

I think not bad predictions at all, actually I haven't seen anyone produce better predictions than those!

MikeB you made far more predictions than 4. I think you have a bit of cherry picking going on.

And luckily GT5 has been a dangling 'it's coming' for the last 4 years. Saved some of your predictions.

@Lou

Quote:

Sony claims it's not as arrogant as it used to be and that Apple takes the arrogance cake now.

It appears the new Sex and the City movie the girls are losing their Macs for HP. While it doesn't support Sony is less a concern it does suppor the theory that Apple may be a concern.

@BrianK

Yes, have made more predictions, like I said PS3 owners actually buy more software than XBox 360 owners per month of console ownership. The figures of the last two fiscal years heavily back up this claim (this at a time most claimed the exact opposite!).

And I said I thought the European PS3 launch would be more impressive and the PS3 will perform much better there and this would more than compensate for the US's bias towards Microsoft's XBox 360, this ended up being correct as well.

Some unforeseen disappointments I mentioned above.

http://kotaku.com/5543662/whats-new-about-nintendos-new-wii-remote

Looks like Nintendo will have WM+ built into new Wii Remotes. WM+ has been shown to be 4 to 5 times more sensitive than Sony's MOVE controller.

We'll have to wait until E3 for confirmation of WM+ augmented functionality to new Wii Remotes...

@Lou

You aren't being honest there... Move is more accurate and shows less lag compared to Nintnedo's MotionPlus.