Nintendo wants to sell you a new 3D system. Sony wants to sell you a new living room. Good article on the coming 3D gaming

@BrianK

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BrianK wrote: Nintendo wants to sell you a new 3D system. Sony wants to sell you a new living room. Good article on the coming 3D gaming

LOL! I'll leave it at the stereo system.

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We polled our readers in January about their own plans for 3D, and only 8 percent were looking forward to buying a 3D display. Sixty-six percent said that they would get 3D when it came free with their televisions. Sony hopes that by leveraging the full force of its different content divisions, it can bring those numbers up. Nintendo, on the other hand, wants to sell you one sub-$200 piece of hardware and then a truckload of games. It's a piece of hardware, it should be noted, that enjoyed a three-hour wait and crushing lines at E3... exactly the experience the now-legendary Nintendo Wii found during its first E3. In the next few years, which technology do you think will find more general-interest welcome?

Synapsis Sony: doomed!
Synapsis Nintendo: boomed!

LOL! 7 years later, a new character is unlock in the Gamecube's Super Smash Bros Melee

http://kotaku.com/5577690/the-super-smash-bros-secret-that-took-7-years-to-unlock

@BrianK

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Wow! 360 isn't well accepted in Japan. It appears that Monster Hunter had 100% penetration.

In any case it's the worst entry for a Monster Hunter game ever for Japan. Even Monster Hunter Tri for the Wii sold 5 times as much on the Wii, the latest PSP games entered with almost 10 times the sales.

Needless to say given a choice the 360 version would have sold even less (probably much less).

@MikeB

Since you won't allow anyone to have fun in this thread. Let's use some of your penetration analysis to show the popularity of a game on a PS3 but analyze that for the 360.

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Even Monster Hunter Tri for the Wii sold 5 times as much on the Wii,

There's ~10.5M Wiis and ~1.25M 360s in Japan. A ratio of about 8:1. So if sales were 5:1 this clearly turns out that penetration of the game was better on the 360.

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the latest PSP games entered with almost 10 times the sales.

Ratio of units is about 12 PSPs for every 1 360. Again 360 wins for pentration of the game on that console.

So the 360 console which according to you is a FPS console. And has a yearly online fee to play games which is a deteriment. Has better penetration for a non-FPS, a MMORPG, with online gameplay than the other consoles.

Win Microsoft!

Last edited by BrianK on 02-Jul-2010 at 02:38 AM.

@BrianK

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Ratio of units is about 12 PSPs for every 1 360. Again 360 wins for pentration of the game on that console.

Total sales of Monster Hunter Freedom Unite for the PSP is about 4 million for Japan. So with less than 100K sales so far, that's more than a factor 40 sales less at this point.

Most 360 owners in Japan apparently bought the console for the Japanese timed exclusives of popular game projects (and there are even some high profile full exclusives, nomatter how insane that may sound). These gamers are for a large part the hardcore of the hardcore gamers, similar to western hardcore gamers who buy a Japanese languaged console/games because some release a year or so early for Japan.

So to see a normal/good penetration of a high profile (timed?) exclusive for Japan on the XBox 360 is not that much of a surprise. The Wii has a relative small amount of gamers for this sort of game and it's not really targetted at kids.

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Since you won't allow anyone to have fun in this thread

Of course I do, but I think we have a very different sense of humor.

@BrianK

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BrianK wrote: @MikeB Since you won't allow anyone to have fun in this thread. Let's use some of your penetration analysis to show the popularity of a game on a PS3 but analyze that for the 360. Quote: Even Monster Hunter Tri for the Wii sold 5 times as much on the Wii, There's ~10.5M Wiis and ~1.25M 360s in Japan. A ratio of about 8:1. So if sales were 5:1 this clearly turns out that penetration of the game was better on the 360. Quote: the latest PSP games entered with almost 10 times the sales. Ratio of units is about 12 PSPs for every 1 360. Again 360 wins for pentration of the game on that console. So the 360 console which according to you is a FPS console. And has a yearly online fee to play games which is a deteriment. Has better penetration for a non-FPS, a MMORPG, with online gameplay than the other consoles. Win Microsoft!

Ha Ha! You said 'penetration'!


It was enough to garner #1 for a week and that speaks for itself... Also:

May's NPD:
DS: 383,700
Wii: 334,800
Xbox 360: 194,600
PS3: 154,500
PSP: 59,400

and more importantly:

http://www.edge-online.com/news/microsoft-seeing-%E2%80%9Cunprecedented-demand%E2%80%9D-for-new-xbox-360

So much for that Sony momentum...

Also, that same week in Japan:
DSi LL - 41,676 (30,183)
PSP - 23,257 (20,929)
PS3 – 19,578 (17,175)
Wii - 19,115 (19,045)
Xbox 360 - 17,370 (2,060)
DSi - 17,306 (18,214)
DS Lite - 5,209 (5,126)
PS2 - 1,530 (1,568)
PSPgo – 845 (837)

The Japanese need consumer confidence. If this Xbox Slim gives them that over the previous models and can sustain sales, then Microsoft has scored an important victory going into 'round 3'.

Last edited by Lou on 02-Jul-2010 at 01:51 PM.
Last edited by Lou on 02-Jul-2010 at 01:49 PM.
Last edited by Lou on 02-Jul-2010 at 01:46 PM.

I want to go on record saying that I am pro-3D. I remember in 1990 walking into a store that sold Amigas and playing that game where you put on glasses and shot pooop in space in 3D... Sad that the technology hasn't really come farther...except with parralax screens like Nintendo is using ofcourse.

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In The Land of the Rising Sun, electronics manufacturers like Sony and Panasonic are rolling out 3D televisions. Sony, in particular, shows great interest in 3D with its TVs and 3D-ready PlayStation 3. Japan, however, does not. According to Kakaku.com survey that polled 8,957 individuals, 70 percent said they were turned off by wearing 3D glasses and 57 percent said the price was too high. Out of those polled, 67.4 percent stated they had no interest in purchasing a 3D TV. However, 31.2 percent stated they were interested in buying one. Nearly 9 thousand individuals is certainly a healthy sample. And if 31.2 percent of the entire Japanese population bought new 3D television, certainly that would translate into healthy sales. It seems like the 3D glasses and the high price are the two major turnoffs for Japanese consumers — two thing that Nintendo appears it will be side-stepping with its 3D glasses-free Nintendo 3DS.

@Lou

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http://www.edge-online.com/news/microsoft-seeing-%E2%80%9Cunprecedented-demand%E2%80%9D-for-new-xbox-360

In the US Gamestop ran a fairly good trade-in your old console for a new console offering. If one has an Elite it's about $100 more to replace it with a new console. Demand was unexpectedly high and Gamestop is out of their 360 stock.

I went to Gamestop last night and asked them about the offer. The guy said it runs until 7/18, even though it's no longer advertised. There is a wait list which is now closed, he said for all stores. The Gamestop guy said a new shipment would be coming in early July. He said he was guessing but believes Microsoft will ship them enough to fulfill the wait list and a few extra for those still wanting the offer. He did state the problem isn't only Gamestop but other retailers are running out of stock too.

Gamestop now has a PS3 'upgrade' to the slim model offer. Though it's popularity isn't 1/10th (according to the employee) what the 360S garnered.

@Lou

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I want to go on record saying that I am pro-3D.

I'm pro-3D too. Though the near term future market seems low. You had quoted the Edge article showing even in Japan about 2/3 of the population doesn't plan on buying 3DTVs.

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It seems like the 3D glasses and the high price are the two major turnoffs for Japanese consumers — two thing that Nintendo appears it will be side-stepping with its 3D glasses-free Nintendo 3DS.

This cleary captures what is going on.



@MikeB

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Molyneux says Milo is: "not a game that we’re planning to bring to market."

Your quote is mistaken. The statement was from Greenberg the Xbox product manager. Not from Molyneux the head of Lionhead who is making this game.

Molyneux has a speech at TED in July. He plans on showing Kinect and his team's work. I suspect we'll see more Milo. On 6/30 Molyneux corrected Xbox product manager's statement that Milo wasn't a full game with ... "It's being worked on, it's a full game."

Last edited by BrianK on 02-Jul-2010 at 02:15 PM.

@Lou

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Ha Ha! You said 'penetration'!

Yes, BrianK's '100% penetration' does sound like the XBox 360 is completely fcked for Japan.

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/110/1103136p1.html

LOL @ Shuhei Yoshida

Sony has no problem bashing the competition. However, once the competition uses a tech clearly superior (parralax screen), Sony wants to work with Nintendo so they can sell more Sony TV's with the next Nintendo home console.

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Yoshida later said the industry should advocate 3D development, and that Sony would like to work alongside Nintendo in promoting the new technology.

How is wearing polarized glassed new technology?
I question whether there is a PS4 in development or not. I wouldn't be suprised if they did try to push the PS3 as their main console for 10 years simply to get ROI. I think they want to work with Nintendo for Nintendo's next console soley to promote sales of their TV's.

With Move and the PS3, Sony can become the low and in-expensive console when compared to the next (8th gen) MS and Ninendo console and try to win back the casual market over time with cost-savings.

Basically, I wouldn't expect a PS4 until 2016. I'd expect a new Nintendo console in 2012. MS for 2012/13. I figure Nintedo will go HD + whatever ever their next innovation is before we see new consoles from the other two players...

@Lou

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With Move and the PS3, Sony can become the low and in-expensive console when compared to the next (8th gen) MS and Ninendo console and try to win back the casual market over time with cost-savings. Basically, I wouldn't expect a PS4 until 2016.

Basically they don't have a choice in this matter. Does one toss $6Billion or try to make it up? If the PS4 can't be as innovative as the PS3 else it'll cost Sony another $6Billion. So not only do I expect the PS4 to be the late comer to the 8th Gen console I expect the PS4 to be more akin to a PS3.5.

Or, try this on, the PS3 takes on steam about around 2012. Sony 'skips' the 8th Gen console trying to push the PS3 as the low cost leader against the 8th Gen. They bring out a console around 2018 and declare the 9th gen console war has begun.

(Isn't it fun to play with ideas in the future.)

Either way Sony squandered their lead in the 6th Gen so while the 7th Gen is a $6B uphill battle it'll also severly impede the innovation ability in the 8th Gen.

Last edited by BrianK on 02-Jul-2010 at 07:03 PM.

@MikeB

We don't you don't have the passion for Halo that other people do. Halo is very popular and some go nutsoid over their favorite game. Check out the Elite animatronic costume.

OMG Sega beats everyone to 3D!

http://kotaku.com/5579632/quick-look-back-at-sega-3d

@Lou

For real 3D worlds in stereoscopic 3D (including head and hand motion tracking games such as 3D swordfight and FPS games) look here:

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=103674

Dactyl Nightmare for example was an interesting innovative FPS, it allowed 4 player networked play (modes included normal deathmatch and "capture the flag"), the hand tracking allowed for instance to hide behind and bend your gun around pillars. Note this was at a time before the ancient, much simpler in comparison (for example no mulitple heights like Dactyl) and unimpressive in comparison Wolfenstein3D was released for the PC.

@BrianK

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So not only do I expect the PS4 to be the late comer to the 8th Gen console I expect the PS4 to be more akin to a PS3.5.

You still remember the discussions we had in the past? This is what *I* actually speculated on a couple of years ago.

But IMO a PS3.5 would not per se mean the PS4 will not be the most powerful games/multimedia console available. A PS3.5 as a PS4 to me means the progress in technical potential could be more evolutionary like we see with PC technical advancements (so still quite a bit more powerful due to the amount of time in between, despite requiring far less R&D and be relatively much cheaper to produce at launch).

As nearly all Playstation developers by then will likely have made great advancements to their PS3 game engines, being able to easily tap into similar PS4 technology could make great sense (great early results upon release, more in line with the actual performance potential compared to early PS3 launch games as the PS2 to PS3 provided such an enormous technical leap and radical departure from how the PS2 operates).

@MikeB

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A PS3.5 as a PS4 to me means the progress in technical potential could be more evolutionary like we see with PC technical advancements

Or to keep the comparison in the console gaming realm. More like the Wii is to the Gamecube.

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As nearly all Playstation developers by then will likely have made great advancements to their PS3 game engines, being able to easily tap into similar PS4 technology could make great sense

Sure it does. Though one might argue the same from the PS1 to PS2 and PS2 to PS3. We've seen Sony not rely on the past. But, now that Ken's gone perhaps Sony will take such an evolution basing the PS4 on the PS3 past.

@BrianK

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Or to keep the comparison in the console gaming realm. More like the Wii is to the Gamecube.

Yes, but IMO the technical leap from PS2 to PS3 is of more importance (for example I think a PS3.5 will suit my wishes). This because of the availability of HDTVs/3DTVs, solid internet connectivity for consoles, solid storage media options, good surround audio options, etc. IMO the PS4 wouldn't need a big leap, following the PS3 road sets good standards to built on further.

However a PS2.5 would have been a huge dissapointment for me and I think would not make sense for a consumer electronics company like Sony at all, so many progress is now realized in consumer electronics (potential to take advantage of), it would IMO be sad (and not good logic from the grand perspective) if Sony didn't try to take as much advantage of such as advancements technically as was economically feasible for them.

@MikeB

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MikeB wrote: @BrianK Quote: Or to keep the comparison in the console gaming realm. More like the Wii is to the Gamecube. Yes, but IMO the technical leap from PS2 to PS3 is of more importance (for example I think a PS3.5 will suit my wishes). This because of the availability of HDTVs/3DTVs, solid internet connectivity for consoles, solid storage media options, good surround audio options, etc. IMO the PS4 wouldn't need a big leap, following the PS3 road sets good standards to built on further. However a PS2.5 would have been a huge dissapointment for me and I think would not make sense for a consumer electronics company like Sony at all, so many progress is now realized in consumer electronics (potential to take advantage of), it would IMO be sad (and not good logic from the grand perspective) if Sony didn't try to take as much advantage of such as advancements technically as was economically feasible for them.

The problem is IBM isn't designing a faster CELL.
A PS4 will require completely new hardware/architecture.

Perhaps a PS3.1 with more RAM, that's your best bet. 1GB of cpu ram and perhaps upping RSX to 512MB but I don't see the clockspeed going up at all...

I think with the extra RAM, PS3 could finally surpass 360 in even cross-platform games...at the very least match it.