@ferrels

Quote:

ferrels wrote: So why do so many people here hang on to the idea that the X1000 will somehow put the Amiga back on the leading edge of anything? Then they get offended when it's pointed out to them? I'm entitled to my opinion just like everyone else. If you don't like it, that's too bad. I never said you had to agree with me!

I don't expect the X1000 to be cutting edge anything..........Except for running AOS.

You can't sway me I want one. Natami sounds good too thank you.

Chris

@Zylesea

Quote:

Some experinece I got while being part of this community for many, many years.

The continued survival of Hyperion and their continued development of OS4 is to me a far better indicator than "some experience" from forums.

Hyperion is not a charity, and with your estimate *they are* losing money on OS4 every year.

Quote:

And as a hint take for example downoad times of a must have app like OWB. It is in the range of 600-700 times.

According to os4depot and Aminet, the various different OWB versions have had ~17K downloads combined. And this is excluding direct downloads from strohmayer.org (which is where most of the news items posted about new versions point to, and so we can assume a significant percentage of downloaders go there too) or anywhere else people might have put copies.

Now, that *will* include quite a few duplicates, as it's across many versions of owb, but there's not that many of them, and it's ludicrous to assume every user have downloaded every version of every different package, and that nobody have used the direct links from strohmayer.org directly. All of that needs to be the case for your estimate to be remotely accurate.

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@ferrels

Glory days...

I would not be that pessimistic.
When Amiga was in mainstream, it sold about 5000000 units?
That's a very small number when considering IT HW sales of today.

So I do not see it totally impossible that we in best case could reach enough sales to live another great "Amigalife", even if it's less than 1% of world IT sales.

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// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@vidarh

Okay, we don't have numbers. But I seriously doubt theere are more than 1000 active OS4 users currently. Hyperion survives because they have low exenses (most of the work for OS4 is done for free). There is no big market.

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@Zylesea

I'm not arguing that the market is huge. I am arguing that it's bigger than the worst pessimists here seem to think. Even if Hyperion gets most of it's development work done for free, the low ball numbers that have been bandied around wouldn't cut it to make it profitable for them - most likely the numbers people have given wouldn't pay for even a single person on an ongoing basis and that's before costs like the lawsuit etc. have been added into the picture.

I think your latest number of 1000 is still too low, unless you define "active" very strictly, but I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this as there's no way we'll know who's right anytime soon, as I doubt Hyperion will suddenly disclose their sales numbers...

_________________
Wiki for new/returning Amiga users - Projects: ACE basic compiler / FrexxEd / Git

@QuikSanz

Quote:

How about a telescope controller? Hook up a CCD camera to your telescope and run it into your X1000

That is something I had been wondering for Digital Universe.

However I do find just pushing around a large dobsonian far easier that any of these very expensive automated goto type telescopes that take ages to set up and then seem not to work properly.

The main problem, however, is that unless you are an OS4 beta tester, no normal developer ever gets the information about how to use new OS features until ages after the OS has been released.

@-Sam-

Quote:

One of the ideas behind the X1000 is to add new bits of hardware to give users a genuine reason to purchase it as it will do something no PC can.

I fail to see what you mean with that...

The fact, there are currently no X86 systems, that have XMOS chip?

If that is the case, I can't see why:
1)There couldn't be X86 systems with the said chip onboard in the future or:
2)Why such chip couldn't be put on an add-on card and be installed on ANY computer with suitable add-on slot (X86 or not)

Quote:

KimmoK wrote: @persia The industry has found X-Core to be pretty usefull chip. Only the future will tell what use Amigans will build around it.

That's news to me.

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Quote:

DAX wrote: In short by having the Xmos on Board the Amiga programming community will be the only one that will be fluent in Xmos programming from the get go (something that can be exploited in many ways including the use of the aforementioned mini-cluster), having the thing as a "USB optional" had no chance of creating this beneficial situation.

What?! The tools won't run on AOS4. The best you're going to get on AOS4 is the c compiler (which by the way won't support any of the threading, so you'll be limited to one thread) and xgdb on the console for debugging. The XC language compiler which makes or breaks using this chip in projects is proprietary and not open sourced. If you want to actually make use of this thing, you're going to have to run the tools on an intel machine running Windows, Linux or OS X. I suppose A-Eon might put an XTAG header on the back of the machine so folks can push their PC right up next to it for debugging. How many people are going to bother?

If you want to have fun with the XMOS chips, go pick up an XC-1A quad core kit for a hundred bucks.

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Quote:

Zylesea wrote: IMHO the XMOS is primarily used for marketing. There will be no uses for that chip that cannot done by using an XMOS usb kit or a pci(e) card. It is an attempt to have something unique. The possibilities or limitations hve been chewed through in several threads already. All in all it seems as clever as adding a 8051 to a core i7 board.

Bingo!

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@ferrels

Quote:

I'm waiting for a Replay board or a Natami,

To push your argument back at you:
Way do you even butter its not going to sell it 10000, and Natami / MiniMig is going to be expensive compare to price / performance of a x86 box.

Hey dude get a life stop being so negative,
We are interetsed in AmigaONE-X1000 becouse its going to run AmigaOS4.

price does not matter to pro AmigaOS4 user, if does what it needs to do then we are happy about speed too.
as for your USB3 argument, what USB3 equipment can buy in my local store to day?

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@ferrels

Quote:

I'm waiting for a Replay board or a Natami,

http://www.tradekey.com/product_listall/uid/3170731/Shenzhen-Xucai-Trading-Co-Ltd.htm

Quote:

USB3.0 to 2.5"&3.5"SATA HDD BOX/external box Compliant with USB 3.0 Specification and USB 2.0 Specification, Serial ATA Revision 2.5 Specification Compliant ? Embedded SATA PHY and Controller USB Mass Storage Class Bulk-Only Transpor...

As I can see USB3.0 equitment will happy work on USB2.0 ports.

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@koft

"That's news to me. "

For example in a (perhaps the most read) finnish professional electronics magazine "processori", there's one X-Core article every few months (one page and two page articles) and I'm pretty sure they will mention x1000 when it's out, I believe something like 100 000 finnish geeks will read it, a few will buy it, I'm sure.

And one can see many examples of x-core applications here:
http://www.xmos.com/videos
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=xmos&search_type=&aq=f

_________________
- KimmoK
// For freedom, for honor, for AMIGA
//
// Thing that I should find more time for: CC64 - 64bit Community Computer?

@vidarh

Numbers for Pegasos I & II and AmigaOne SE, XE and Micro are posted somewhere here on AWN. (How many motherboards were sold, that is.)

Last edited by itix on 25-Feb-2010 at 01:05 PM.

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Amiga Developer
Amiga 500, Efika, Mac Mini and PowerBook

@Zylesea
Quote:

And as a hint take for example downoad times of a must have app like OWB. It is in the range of 600-700 times.

I assume that figure comes with OS4Depot.net? But that doesn't include:
* Aminet downloads (looks like approximately same number of downloads as OS4Depot).
* Downloads from OWB's home page ( http://strohmayer.org/owb/ )
* Downloads using AmiUpdate
* People sticking to the version of OWB that comes with OS4.
* People not upgrading at every release.

In short, the actual figure could easily be 1-2 thousand actual OWB users.

Quote:

Some experinece I got while being part of this community for many, many years.

I've been in this community for many, many years, and I think you are being overly pessemistic.

Last edited by ChrisH on 25-Feb-2010 at 01:25 PM.

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@ferrels Quote:

I'm still here for the sake of nostalgia, just like most of the others who are still here

Your recent negative posts don't give that impression. Perhaps you should avoid threads about OS4 moving forward, and stick to threads that look backwards?

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It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue...

@KimmoK

Quote:

I believe something like 100 000 finnish geeks will read it, a few will buy it, I'm sure

They actually have something like 9000 readers...

@vidarh Quote:

I'm not arguing that the market is huge. I am arguing that it's bigger than the worst pessimists here seem to think

There's really no use arguing with pessemists. They're *convinced* that the Amiga is dead, and we don't have the facts to convincingly argue EITHER way.

In the past Hyperion has done work for industrial customers (e.g. 3D drivers, e.g. PDA prototype port), using their work on OS4, to help pay the bills, and we only found out about that when they chose to reveal it (or from court case documents). It seems reasonable they have continued to do that, as well as having some customer lined-up for the X1000.

I suspect that so far OS4 has only broken even, at best. But it has obviously done well enough that Hyperion think it is worth investing more in it (e.g. OS4.1u1, e.g. X1000). I'm certain that Hyperion intends OS4 to make a decent profit at some point.

Last edited by ChrisH on 25-Feb-2010 at 01:36 PM.

_________________
Author of the PortablE programming language.
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue...

@Britelite

Quote:

Britelite wrote: They actually have something like 9000 readers...

Is that readers or buyers?

Do any of the 'readers' talk with other interested people?

(You get the point)

@koft

Quote:

koft wrote: What?! The tools won't run on AOS4. The best you're going to get on AOS4

Wow! I didn't know that. Wait-a-minute..........You're one of those 'inside' people
aren't you?

Hey, is it true that the production Nemo boards are going to be black with pinstripes?