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Arko 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 17-Aug-2010 7:59:04
#181 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Jan-2007
Posts: 1989
From: Unknown

Why must a C64 or Amiga retro computer look like the old chunk I tried to shove into real computer cases after I found out how bad the keyboard cases really where.

Why not try to present a CommodoreNG or AmigaNG in a new and really crazy looking design?

Something like here:
http://www.techfemina.com/entry/chip-pc-concept-by-shyam-balasubramanian/

Instead a cheesy looking Boingball mouse something like this:
http://www.gizmowatch.com/entry/10-most-innovatively-made-mice-that-leave-us-impressed/

I believe these devices would be worth the extra money, more than a keyboard computer in beige or some mice with stickers would be

_________________
AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

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vidarh 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 17-Aug-2010 9:43:06
#182 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 4-Jan-2010
Posts: 580
From: London, UK (ex-pat; originally from Norway)

@Arko

Quote:
Why not try to present a CommodoreNG or AmigaNG in a new and really crazy looking design?

Something like here:
http://www.techfemina.com/entry/chip-pc-concept-by-shyam-balasubramanian/


That design is an ergonomical disaster. Having the screen and keyboard at a right angle like in that picture only works for children or midgets.

As for why the "fantasy" cases, the answer is obvious: Nostalgia. I'd like one, if it's cheap enough and reminds me enough of some idealized version of my old A500's..

This community will always have a fetish for the classics, or at least the *idea* of the classics. I don't want to go back to an A500, but I like to be reminded of it... Anything that successfully marries the nostalgia with newer tech will do well with a certain segment of us, though I doubt any of it will ever "break out" into the mainstream.

Though there is one real use apart from nostalgia though: Kids.

I have a 15 month old son, and have started thinking about what to do for his first computer (he will have one within the next 12 months.... ).

A laptop is a no-go for a few years because the keyboards are way too flimsy - mine already has a loose key from his "exploration. A big desktop just so he's going to have something to play with... I don't think so.

An A1200/A600/C64 style case with a Minimig or FPGA Arcade would be great, maybe even a modern PC though it wouldn't need it. More robust than a laptop, easier to hide away than a full desktop. Easy to do a customized setup on a SD card I can clone over and over once he learns how to mess it up.. Much better than those fake laptops that toy manufacturers like VTech churn out (all of which seems to insult the intelligence of kids and not allow much creativity)

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Arko 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 17-Aug-2010 10:41:31
#183 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Jan-2007
Posts: 1989
From: Unknown

@vidarh

Quote:



That design is an ergonomical disaster.


Exactly like the keyboard computer but at least it looks cool.



Quote:

Having the screen and keyboard at a right angle like in that picture only works for children or midgets.


Maybe you have not read the whole desciption:

Quote:

The tablet PC features retractable screen and hinged keyboard that can turn it into a tablet from a laptop or a desktop PC.



Last edited by Arko on 17-Aug-2010 at 10:43 AM.

_________________
AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

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persia 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 17-Aug-2010 11:19:57
#184 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Jul-2009
Posts: 1059
From: Unknown

@Arko

Currently the Apple tablets seem to just work better than the Android tablets. I have an iPad and a ZT180 Android 2.1 tablet from China. With Apple you take a standard Apple keyboard, sync the bluetooth which takes all of 30 seconds and you are good to go.

With the Android tablet You have to work with dodgy bluetooth (or other wireless) buttons that clog the USB port or (heaven forbid) use an old style wired keyboard. The problem with an old style wired keyboard is that the system doesn't really put enough juice through the USB port to power a mouse tethered to a keyboard. But this is likely a problem with the cheap chinese construction and will likely go away with bigger names (and higher prices) wntering the market.

The Android interface is just less intuitive, what's up with two separate program screens? Why is "back" such a hard concept for Android that you need to program it to a button? Why does Android keep referring to my tablet as a "phone?" And where's multi-touch or something equivalent?

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persia 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 17-Aug-2010 11:30:46
#185 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Jul-2009
Posts: 1059
From: Unknown

@vidarh

The computer in a keyboard design was a money saving move. Nowadays it costs more to build, because parts have become so much cheaper.

You are right it was an ergonomic disaster. But I think with was an important step in the building of a laptop. You can sort of look at it like the dinosaurs. You can say the dinosaurs went extinct because they were too big and impractical or you can say they evolved into birds and continue to be a dominant group. Similarly the lumbering computers in a keyboard evolved into the elegant notebooks of today.

Commodore, the original Commodore, would have leapt on the laptop/netbook design. Building a keyboard computer today is just someone taking an old name, copying the form and putting out a product. In a way it's an insult to the days when keyboards with computers in them made sense. The days when monitors were heavy beasts and everybody was (often literally) building computers in their garages....

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Arko 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 17-Aug-2010 12:13:44
#186 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Jan-2007
Posts: 1989
From: Unknown

@persia

Quote:

persia wrote:
@Arko

Currently the Apple tablets seem to just work better than the Android tablets.


Funny no one in the artikle I linked to, mentioned Android, maybe you have readed it somewhere in an advertisement banner.

_________________
AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

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vidarh 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 17-Aug-2010 13:03:11
#187 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 4-Jan-2010
Posts: 580
From: London, UK (ex-pat; originally from Norway)

@persia

Quote:
The computer in a keyboard design was a money saving move. Nowadays it costs more to build, because parts have become so much cheaper.


If you'd get sufficiently volume it still ought to be cheaper. The problem is that you won't get sufficient volume. But in any case it doesn't really matter since the target market for that kind of case won't be people that particularly care about the price.

Quote:
You are right it was an ergonomic disaster. But I think with was an important step in the building of a laptop


I wasn't referring to laptops. The hinge on a laptop makes it ok to work with, though I'm about to get myself a desktop again because I want a proper work station. What I was referring to was specifically the picture of the concept Arko posted for a design where the display seemed to be fixed at a 90 degree angle.

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vidarh 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 17-Aug-2010 13:15:52
#188 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 4-Jan-2010
Posts: 580
From: London, UK (ex-pat; originally from Norway)

@Arko

Quote:
Exactly like the keyboard computer but at least it looks cool.


What ergonomical problems are there with a keyboard computer? You can easily place it at the appropriate distance, and as long as the incline of the keyboard isn't too steep it's far nicer to type on for me at least than a laptop keyboard is.

Quote:
Maybe you have not read the whole desciption:


No, I must admit I only looked at the pictures, and it seemed like a flawed concept to me, and still does - if I'm going to have a computer on my desktop, I'd like the keyboard to be detached completely so I get proper distance to the screen and can get the screen high enough up from the keyboard not to strain my neck, in which case that design has no redeeming features over a normal desktop or a "keyboard computer". If I'm going to use it as a laptop I want it smaller.

It just seems to me like it's trying to be too many things, just like those hugely oversized 4kg-5kg monster "laptops" you can buy these days.

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persia 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 17-Aug-2010 14:09:08
#189 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Jul-2009
Posts: 1059
From: Unknown

@vidarh

You just put the tablet on a stand and bluetooth the keyboard and mouse. Make the stand adjustable. Commodore would have had this if they were still around.....

Tablets are the 2011 analogue of 1980's computer in a keyboard boxes. Commodore would have be all over them like a cheap suit on a chimp.

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Arko 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 17-Aug-2010 14:15:52
#190 ]
Super Member
Joined: 17-Jan-2007
Posts: 1989
From: Unknown

@vidarh

Quote:

vidarh wrote:
@Arko


What ergonomical problems are there with a keyboard computer? You can easily place it at the appropriate distance, and as long as the incline of the keyboard isn't too steep it's far nicer to type on for me at least than a laptop keyboard is.



Yes but I don't think it could hide them behind a monitor or under a desk or at some other place where I can connect all those wonderfull I/O I would like to have connected to them.

_________________
AmigaONE. Haha. Just because you can put label on it does not make it Amiga.

I borrowed this comments from here (#27 & #28):
http://amigaworld.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=38873&forum=2&start=20&order=0

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persia 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 17-Aug-2010 14:53:46
#191 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Jul-2009
Posts: 1059
From: Unknown

@Arko

Yeah, exactly, you put the laptop in a dock when not travelling. This gives you the best of both world...

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vidarh 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 23-Aug-2010 14:30:46
#192 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 4-Jan-2010
Posts: 580
From: London, UK (ex-pat; originally from Norway)

@Arko

Quote:
Yes but I don't think it could hide them behind a monitor or under a desk or at some other place where I can connect all those wonderfull I/O I would like to have connected to them.


That misses the point/appeal of them completely.

The appeal of a keyboard computer today is something simple but retro, but somewhat updated.

If you want to put it behind a monitor or under a desk you obviously wouldn't buy something where you are paying extra for the look.

Different markets.

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Naz 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 23-Aug-2010 14:58:35
#193 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 10-Mar-2004
Posts: 264
From: Unknown

the website has not been modified yet.

Last edited by Naz on 23-Aug-2010 at 06:07 PM.

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persia 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 23-Aug-2010 15:37:45
#194 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Jul-2009
Posts: 1059
From: Unknown

@Naz

And what would you expect from a furniture company?

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Hattig 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 23-Aug-2010 16:08:56
#195 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 11-Mar-2003
Posts: 340
From: Cambridge, UK

To be honest I wouldn't mind a case like the A1000, with a keyboard tray and matching keyboard (although I think a keyboard like Apple's wireless keyboard would be nice these days, except it would recharge when slotted into the computer). It's really handy to have the keyboard separate (unless the computer is tiny, even then the cables for an integrated keyboard computer are annoying) in my opinion, and there are no cost reasons to integrate any more.

As for all-in-one designs like the iMac, you either have something that looks good (iMac), or terrible (all PC variants on the iMac format).

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Argosy 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 23-Aug-2010 17:42:14
#196 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 24-Jul-2010
Posts: 129
From: Shores of Adriatic sea

@Hattig

These 2 computers are primarily focused on the retro market, hence the design, the names and all-in-one keyboard. There's nothing stopping Commodore making a tower or a desktop case, and BigBen did hint they'd be selling separate keyboards, which probably includes wireless also.

BTW, BigBen, when is the 1st revision of the new website coming on-line? You said last week, don't let us down

_________________
The shadow is cast on who you used to be,
Let me set you free.
Come now, come take my hand, then you'll understand,
We'll go to that forbidden land.

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djnick 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 23-Aug-2010 19:59:49
#197 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 11-Jun-2003
Posts: 945
From: space

@BigBentheAussie

Wow! Great work, mate! I like what you started! What OS will be in new Commodore???

Keep it up with great work & all best! :)

_________________
nykk | deetronic.rs | youtube.com/djnykk | gfx.river | mamavolibebu.com

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persia 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 23-Aug-2010 20:40:40
#198 ]
Super Member
Joined: 14-Jul-2009
Posts: 1059
From: Unknown

@Hattig

Now you are talking, I still miss the A1000 design after all these years. Yeah, having it recharge keyboard and mouse while they are in the dock would be brilliant. Imagine never having to replace a keyboard or mouse battery again.

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Dandy 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 31-Aug-2010 10:19:12
#199 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 24-Mar-2003
Posts: 3049
From: Cologne * Germany

@BigBentheAussie

...
There may even be an open letter from Barry, introducing himself and ...

[/quote]

Barry - like Barry Moss, aka Fleecy?

_________________
Ciao

Dandy
__________________________________________
If someone enjoys marching to military music, then I already despise him.
He got his brain accidently - the bone marrow in his back would have been sufficient for him!
(Albert Einstein)

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Manu 
Re: The New Commodore C500 and Commodore PC64
Posted on 31-Aug-2010 10:49:58
#200 ]
Super Member
Joined: 4-Feb-2004
Posts: 1561
From: Unknown

@Dandy

Of course not, it's Barry as in Barry S. Altman, CEO of Cybernet.

_________________
AmigaOS or MorphOS on x86 would sell orders of magnitude more than the current,
hardware-intensive solutions. And they'd go faster.-- D.Haynie

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