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Trixie 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 7:45:50
#1261 ]
Amiga Developer Team
Joined: 1-Sep-2003
Posts: 1948
From: Czech Republic

@fishy_fis

Quote:
Can only imagine those behind it are having severe regrets by now. They'd *HAVE* to be aware of this. They wont say it of course because admitting it was a terrible investment does nothing to help offload them, but unless impressively stupid they'd know.

The people interested in the Tabor Early Adopter scheme did not have to pay for the board up front, so what kind of investment do you have in mind? Or do you mean the AAA pack? Well, what kind of Amigan does consider 100 pounds an investment?

But seriously - you're right, the delay is unpleasant and makes the Tabor an even less enticing solution now. I've been thinking that by the time Tabor arrives I may as well have saved enough to buy another X5000, which is a great machine.

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AmigaOne X5000/020 @ 2GHz / 4GB RAM / Radeon RX 560 / ESI Juli@ / AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition
SAM440ep-flex @ 667MHz / 1GB RAM / Radeon 9250 / AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition

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AP 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 8:34:14
#1262 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 31-Jul-2003
Posts: 488
From: Vienna/Austria

@fishy_fis
The start and communication of the Early Adopter release was not ideal but I regret nothing.

In fact the the EA-offer with the AAA-bundle was a good offer. I got a software-bundle (including Enhancer 2.0) for a fair price and I will get a Tabor-board from the very first production-run for EUR 400,-. The only "investment" so far was for the softwarebundle.

Of course the long waiting is not a burner, in that aspect you are right.

Last edited by AP on 22-Apr-2020 at 08:36 AM.
Last edited by AP on 22-Apr-2020 at 08:35 AM.

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fishy_fis 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 10:07:23
#1263 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 1905
From: Australia

@Trixie & AP

I'd meant Trevor & co.
The people behind the development of the board.

It was a somewhat curious and dubious choice of hardware when announced, but it panned out even a longer delay than even the most hardcore trolls and naysayers hoped for.

I know I've been negative at times. Years of life kicking my ass did my attitude and outlook no favors, but I'm also realistic and analytical when thinking clearly.
Even now when things are infinitely better and my personal life ceases to encourage negativity I can't help but find the Tabor a complete failure, and it's not even released yet.
As far as Im concerned unless it's a few hundred dollars at most then those buying it will mostly be doing so in the name of charity; a way to encourage more hardware development.
This is not an ecosystem that can be sustained and it's disappointing things have gone that way.

Last edited by fishy_fis on 22-Apr-2020 at 10:08 AM.

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AP 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 11:00:59
#1264 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 31-Jul-2003
Posts: 488
From: Vienna/Austria

@fishy_fis: I see and understand your point. I have to agree, that - to make it short - the whole Tabor-story was kind of a mess: CPU-choice, endless delays etc., we all know the story so far.

BUT (and that is why I am still interested and one of the Early Adopters): Tabor is after a long time (since the production-stop of SAM460) the first really affordable AOS4-hardware with decent power (in comparison to other OS4-hardware). This point is still valid and this is why I want to buy/have one.

While X1000 and X5000 are worth the money for sure, not everyone is willing or able to spend EUR 2000+ for a AOS4-system. So my point of buying it is not charity (although I am interested in further AOS4-development in general, so maybe a little bit of charity ).

Also I hope, that Tabor will be produced in higher quantities after the EA-production run. Affordable entry/mid-level hardware is a missing piece in the AOS4-world for a long time now. I think after all the delays Tabor is still a step in the right direction.

Last edited by AP on 22-Apr-2020 at 11:14 AM.

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BigD 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 14:03:42
#1265 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 5387
From: UK

@AP

Quote:
Also I hope, that Tabor will be produced in higher quantities after the EA-production run.


Wow! Got excited then for a second that the launch of the Tabor was a joint venture with Electronic Arts!

We'd definitely get Deluxe Paint 6 and a new 'Strike' game if A-EON managed to pull that deal off! Can you imagine!

Instead 'Early Adopters' have the chance to play 4k videos hopefully before Christmas (like the lucky PlayStation 5 owners but without the 4k Blu-Ray support). They'll also have the important job of testing the sound driver for the rest of us to accept that it is finished! Rock on EA Supporters

Last edited by BigD on 22-Apr-2020 at 02:06 PM.
Last edited by BigD on 22-Apr-2020 at 02:05 PM.

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Rob 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 14:21:54
#1266 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 20-Mar-2003
Posts: 5928
From: S.Wales

@fishy_fis

Quote:
nd before typical knee jerk reactions kick in,... no "classic" hardware isnt part of the equation. Collectables command a premium. Heck, even old pc gear is getting pricey.


What about new "classic" hardware? V4, Mediator, various re-amigas and 060 boards that are in the works.

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AP 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 15:03:37
#1267 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 31-Jul-2003
Posts: 488
From: Vienna/Austria

@BigD: EA.

I really hope there IS a sound driver by the end of the year. That would mean that waiting has its benefits...

Last edited by AP on 22-Apr-2020 at 03:07 PM.
Last edited by AP on 22-Apr-2020 at 03:07 PM.

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fishy_fis 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 15:13:21
#1268 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 1905
From: Australia

@BigD

Quote:
Instead 'Early Adopters' have the chance to play 4k videos hopefully before Christmas (like the lucky PlayStation 5 owners but without the 4k Blu-Ray support).


PS5?
Even PS4 and xb1 owners can watch 4k video and have been able to for roughly 7 years.
4k video is old hat by now.

Last edited by fishy_fis on 22-Apr-2020 at 03:13 PM.

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BigD 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 15:25:11
#1269 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 5387
From: UK

@fishy_fis

That's why I mentioned the 4k Blu-Ray drive as a compareable fairly recent mainstream feature. Yes, it is in the XBox One S and X as well but in the next-gen consoles 4k movies and games are still considered an exciting feature. The problem is that the Tabor will not support 4k Blu-Ray drives as far as I know

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AP 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 15:28:53
#1270 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 31-Jul-2003
Posts: 488
From: Vienna/Austria

@fishy_fis: Maybe he was referring just to the 4k-Blu-Ray-support (this was a big disappointment regarding PS4 for me, too. I still own a PS3 just for this.).

On the other side: I don't think, that AOS4-systems are able to handle BR-discs in the near future.

Edit: @BigD: My typing for the answer was too slow.

Last edited by AP on 22-Apr-2020 at 03:31 PM.

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fishy_fis 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 15:52:59
#1271 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 1905
From: Australia

@BigD

The reference to PS5 seemed somewhat redundant then.
Pretty much everything in the last 7 or so years supports 4k and higher playback. It's far from an exciting feature. Pretty much a standard and has been for a long, long time.

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fishy_fis 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 22-Apr-2020 15:54:58
#1272 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 1905
From: Australia

Speaking of 4k playback on OS4 is there HDR support with the new drivers, or is it still very outdated just with the ability to use higher than 1080p resolutions?
HDR is waaay more important unless a person is using a 65+ inch screen.

Last edited by fishy_fis on 22-Apr-2020 at 03:56 PM.

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MEGA_RJ_MICAL 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 23-Apr-2020 5:50:36
#1273 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 13-Dec-2019
Posts: 351
From: AMIGAWORLD.NET WAS ORIGINALLY FOUNDED BY DAVID DOYLE

@fishy_fis

Quote:

fishy_fis wrote:
Speaking of 4k playback on OS4 is there HDR support with the new drivers, or is it still very outdated just with the ability to use higher than 1080p resolutions?


If the next olympics were held in Palestine I would be less surprised.

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K-L 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 23-Apr-2020 9:26:29
#1274 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2006
Posts: 1376
From: Oullins, France

@fishy_fis

Quote:
Speaking of 4k playback on OS4 is there HDR support with the new drivers, or is it still very outdated just with the ability to use higher than 1080p resolutions?
HDR is waaay more important unless a person is using a 65+ inch screen.


What I like with your usual posts is the way how you can confirm you don't know anything about AmigaOS 4.1 and its users but you always think what you say is valuable...

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BigD 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 23-Apr-2020 9:37:35
#1275 ]
Elite Member
Joined: 11-Aug-2005
Posts: 5387
From: UK

@K-L

So it's confirmed that the Tabor can play HDR enabled 4k content then? Are you the official A-EON spokesman on this matter? Just because fishy_fis doesn't know the status of this feature categorically doesn't mean he's wrong!

The point of this is we're expected to see 4k playback on the Tabor as a massive selling point when it hasn't been clarified what the details / limitations are. That there's no support for 4k Blu-ray is a given so what else is missing?

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bennymee 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 23-Apr-2020 10:07:14
#1276 ]
Cult Member
Joined: 19-Aug-2003
Posts: 595
From: Netherlands

@fishy_fis

Quote:
Speaking of 4k playback on OS4 is there HDR support with the new drivers, or is it still very outdated just with the ability to use higher than 1080p resolutions?
HDR is waaay more important unless a person is using a 65+ inch screen.


HDR is very nice, I have a 49 inch LG HDR10 with PS4/Xbox - it gives an extra dimension in some games!
But how many people have a HDR monitor on their desk ? People just don't upgrade their desktop systems as much as before.

Second: looking in the Dutch pricewatch list there are 96 HDR10 monitors listed out of 1793 which are younger then 5 years.
So only 1 out of 20 monitors in the shops has HDR10.

It is importent, but I don't think it should be priority 1 as in reality most people do not own such a device.









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fishy_fis 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 23-Apr-2020 10:18:49
#1277 ]
Super Member
Joined: 29-Mar-2004
Posts: 1905
From: Australia

@bennymee

It's more useful/important than 4k support though. That was my point.
Unless a person is using a 65+ inch screen the difference is nigh on inperceivable between 1080p and 4k. The same isn't true of HDR.

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K-L 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 23-Apr-2020 10:35:17
#1278 ]
Super Member
Joined: 3-Mar-2006
Posts: 1376
From: Oullins, France

@BigD

What are you talking about ? You don't know how to read simple sentences ?

Was I talking to you ? Did I ask you anything ?

As fishy_eyes, you are always posting/trolling nonsense regarding everything about AmigaOS 4.1 and the Tabor while you don't own an OS4 system, always making assumptions.

I'm an OS4 user (and I've been one for many years) using my X1000 as my main system every day, I'm not the PR of anyone (did you read correctly when I asked for when the new driver gets released ?)

And even if HDR would be supported (I don't know anything regarding this specfific topic), you and fishy_eyes will come to criticize another thing. It's like that, we all get used to this behaviour.

Personnaly, I don't care about HDR, I just want ot be able to play 1080p videos at a decent speed.

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amigadave 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 23-Apr-2020 12:23:52
#1279 ]
Super Member
Joined: 18-Jul-2005
Posts: 1629
From: Lake Shastina, Northern Calif.

@K-L

As a frequent user of AmigaOS4.1, maybe you can answer this question for me (another fellow X1000 owner), am I correct in thinking that the 4k support currently in AmigaOS4.1FE with the latest Enhancer Pack and graphics drivers from Hans, are using the video card GPU to scale the playback of 4k video files, and play them back in smaller than 4k windows on a 1080p, or similar screen resolution? The only YouTube video I have seen that was demonstrating 4k video playback had two separate 4k videos playing in windows, and I don't think that the screen resolution was well over 8k in size, so I just assumed that the new video card drivers are able to take advantage of the power of the new(er) video cards, so that the X5000, or Tabor CPU's aren't having to do any of that type of heavy lifting, and the GPU is doing all of the decoding and scaling of the video content, just like, or similar to how modern Windows/Linux PC's playback video content. Do you know if I am correct in my assumptions?

Hans has done some amazing work in bringing us compatibility with more powerful and faster video cards. I just hope that someone can figure out what the problem is preventing such drivers from working on my X1000, so I can enjoy his latest work as well. I don't want to have to trade my X1000 in for a Tabor, or X5000, and give up Altivec (plus, I'm sort of proud that I supported the X1000, which was the machine that got A-Eon started, and even with it's few faults, is still a great AmigaOS4 system).



Edit: Is there any demo videos showing the A1222/Tabor playing back 4k video content full screen on a 4k monitor?

Last edited by amigadave on 23-Apr-2020 at 12:25 PM.

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AP 
Re: Trevor's Amiga Blog
Posted on 23-Apr-2020 12:36:47
#1280 ]
Regular Member
Joined: 31-Jul-2003
Posts: 488
From: Vienna/Austria

@BigD: Who says, that 4k on Tabor is meant as "a massive selling point"? Even Trevor didn't do that.

Fact is, that with new drivers in the Enhancer Software and a new version of Motion it will be possible to use GPU (on certain graphic cards) for video-playback without stressing the CPU.

Especially "low level" hardware like SAM460 and Tabor will benefit of the GPU-use and will be able to play HD-videos up to 4k.

As I said before: The main-selling point for Tabor was and is having an AOS4-system with decent power for a good price. Period.

And like K-L I really don't care about 4k and HDR, but it's a nice addition to play HD-videos on slower AOS4-systems.

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